00:15:42 <verbosus> *** verbosus (~verbosus@ip-183-161.sn1.eutelia.it) has joined #swhack
00:32:23 <verbosus> *** verbosus has quit ("Client exiting")
00:44:33 <evangineer> *** evangineer (~evanginee@spc1-seve3-4-0-cust195.lond.broadband.ntl.com) has joined #swhack
00:45:21 <evangineer> Monty: help
00:45:21 <Monty> Help: I understand the following commands: help save stats time lookup thesaurus foldoc ignore remind tell whatson random countdown google seen box javadoc acronym weather insult translate paper/scissors/stone calc day define/declare/set
00:45:23 <Monty> Help: To ask me for help about a certain command, try "Monty: help <command>"
00:45:38 <evangineer> hmm, 'nuff bots!
00:45:49 <xover> .define slander
00:45:50 <xena> sorry couldn't find an appropriate definition for 'slander'
00:46:02 <evangineer> .wn slander
00:46:02 <xena> slander defined as:
00:46:04 <xena> - n 1: words falsely spoken that damage the reputation of another
00:46:05 <xena> - 2: an abusive attack on a person's character or good name [syn: {aspersion}, {calumny}, {defamation}, {denigration}] v : charge falsely or with malicious intent; attack the good name and reputation of someone; "The journalists have defamed me!" "The article in the paper sullied my reputation" [syn: {defame}, {smirch}, {asperse}, {denigrate}, {calumniate}, {smear}, {sully}, {besmirch}]
00:47:02 <xover> @evangineer++
00:47:23 <evangineer> cheers, xover! :)
00:52:03 <d8uv> Hmm.. is there an RDF person in the room?
00:52:31 <d8uv> (I'd say SW, but that seems off to me)
01:14:23 <xover> * xover receives spam "Hot Teens! Fresh Juice!"...
01:14:38 <xover> I'll have the fresh juice, thanks. Orange if you have it.
01:14:53 <jordan> *** jordan has left #swhack
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02:57:33 <kandinski_auto> life is good
02:57:40 <d8uv> Why is this?
02:58:39 <kandinski_auto> I am back from a hip-hop club, eating a home baked cookie from this friend's girlfriend's mother
02:58:51 <d8uv> All good.
02:59:03 <kandinski_auto> yes
03:04:58 <kandinski_auto> not exactly hoppin', this channel, at this hour
03:05:21 <d8uv> Not exactly.
03:05:48 <kandinski_auto> no, not quite
03:06:02 <kandinski_auto> but we can have a quiet chat
03:06:10 <kandinski_auto> what did you do today?
03:06:23 <kandinski_auto> or, rather, what have you done today so far?
03:08:15 <d8uv> Me? Nothing.
03:08:25 <d8uv> Absolutely nothing.
03:08:46 <mediovia> *** mediovia has left #swhack
03:09:11 <kandinski_auto> whee!
03:09:17 <kandinski_auto> me neither!!
03:09:21 <kandinski_auto> w00t!
03:10:51 <kandinski_auto> * kandinski_auto goes away to do nothing somewhere elsw
03:10:54 <kandinski_auto> *** kandinski_auto has quit ("Leaving")
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04:10:15 <xover> * xover hops up and down for a bit...
04:10:30 <xover> Just for the sake of appearances y'see.
04:11:32 <xover> Besides, I'm done with Episode 1x22 of GitS SAC and 1x23 is taking forever to download, so I'm bored... :-|
04:12:02 <d8uv> xover: Relieve your boredom by making me a sandwich.
04:12:24 <xover> Sure. What kind of sandwich would you like?
04:12:47 <xover> I make a killer BLT...
04:13:54 <d8uv> That sounds great.
04:14:16 <d8uv> I was thinking The Sandwich, actually.
04:15:09 <xover> Unfortunately I'm all out of B and T, not to mention bread; how about I just throw you a lettuce and you can virtualize the rest?
04:15:34 <d8uv> Sounds wonderful.
04:16:09 <xover> * xover takes a step back to make room to really swing...
04:16:32 <xover> Woops! Fell a little short. But you're a strong swimmer, right, d8uv?
04:17:08 <d8uv> Sure. Where'd it land?
04:17:34 <xover> Oh, around 68.7N/17.4E...
04:18:58 <d8uv> Ok. Off to retrieve!
04:19:29 <xover> * xover curses Bandai Entertainment...
04:23:06 <d8uv> WTF? Iceberg lettuce?
04:23:17 <d8uv> You FOOL
04:23:26 <d8uv> I refuse to eat this.
04:23:29 <xover> Hey! It's the best kind.
04:23:40 <d8uv> I'll just have the imaginary BL.
04:23:45 <d8uv> Er, BT.
04:23:50 <xover> Well, that's good too.
04:24:12 <d8uv> Yeah. This BT is the best one I've not had.
04:32:35 <redmonk> *** redmonk has quit (Remote closed the connection)
04:36:28 <xover> Heh heh. BayStar, who invested a hefty chunk of cash in SCO wants its money back; all $20M of it... :-)
04:38:08 <xover> And, apparently, if Royal Bank of Canada follows suit -- to a total tune of $60M -- SCO will be unable to pay up because they just don't have the cash.
04:47:15 <Ash> baystore
04:47:43 <xover> As companies go, the difference is academic... :-)
04:47:49 <xover> (thanks!)
05:19:26 <sbp> hehe:
05:19:26 <sbp> <Morbus> [15:39] <bunny_colloquy> I don't know you -- or do I?
05:19:27 <sbp> <Morbus> [15:39] <Morbus> heh,heh. ne'ermind ;)
05:19:27 <sbp> <Morbus> [15:39] <bunny_colloquy> and why the hell would you want to send me a webcam?
05:19:27 <sbp> <Morbus> i mean, you can't get a better quote than that.
05:19:33 <sbp> and!
05:19:34 <sbp> <d8uv> Sure. Where'd it land?
05:19:34 <sbp> <xover> Oh, around 68.7N/17.4E...
05:19:34 <sbp> <d8uv> Ok. Off to retrieve!
05:20:20 <sbp> redmonk's cartoon is pretty good too
05:21:27 <sbp> ouch, we lost mediovia
05:22:55 <xover> Wow! SCO is just getting all kinds of new assholes ripped for them lately.
05:23:28 <sbp> heh, oh man: 10:43:36 <deltab/#esp> I also discovered a couple of days ago that it's pretty easy to do rot13 in my head
05:23:39 <sbp> oh?
05:24:13 <xover> The Groklaw crowd is no longer hoping SCO will burn in hell; they're rooting for them to stay in business as long as possible just so we can reap the fringe benefits (court test of GPL, verdict dispelling IP FUD from OSS, etc.).
05:25:20 <sbp> heh
05:25:52 <sbp> yeah, that's a pretty good idea actually. and the way that IBM tends to crush people indicates that it might actually happen
05:28:27 <xover> Hmmm. Apparently, even if SCO go tits up (file for Chapter 7/11), they can't actually pull out of the trial.
05:28:44 <sbp> a few K of scrollback on IRC, hardly any email... it's nice and quiet today
05:29:38 <sbp> that's good. because the people responsible still have to attend? but I thought that a corporation's a legal entity--if it ceases to exist...
05:29:45 <xover> Since IBM has countersued _and_ asked for a declaratory ruling, SCO and The Boies must stay to duke it out until the judge takes pity on them.
05:30:21 <xover> The lawyer, in particular, can't back out without "The Court's" permission; even if his employer has zero cash and zero prospects. :-)
05:30:48 <xover> * xover is laughing his ass off while reading Groklaw... :-)
05:31:02 <sbp> heh: http://www.forbes.com/personaltech/2004/04/12/cx_ah_0412tentech.html
05:31:03 <supybot> Title: Forbes.com: A First Look At Google's Gmail (at www.forbes.com)
05:31:10 <sbp> "First". suure :-)
05:32:44 <sbp> ah, found the BayStar story: http://slashdot.org/articles/04/04/16/1843213.shtml?tid=187&tid=88&tid=98&tid=99
05:32:46 <supybot> Title: Slashdot | BayStar Cashes Out of SCO Stock (at slashdot.org)
05:34:08 <xover> Baystar Sends SCO a Letter ("Give Me Back My $20M!"): http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20040416151214305
05:34:09 <swhacker> posted 288
05:34:10 <supybot> Title: GROKLAW (at www.groklaw.net)
05:35:20 <sbp> * sbp flicks through http://www.blueoxen.org/papers/0000D/
05:35:23 <xover> Ooooh! And BayStar and RBC actually have veto power over SCO taking legal action!
05:35:35 <sbp> chuckle
05:37:31 <bjoern_> *** bjoern_ (~bjoern@dsl-213-023-059-015.arcor-ip.net) has joined #swhack
05:41:17 <sbp> oh evangineer's here--cool. I missed that
05:41:39 <sbp> I'll be returning to #esp when Tav releases some code--i.e. on May 9th, though earlier or later if Tav is earlier or later with it
05:41:49 <sbp> I left because:
05:41:57 <sbp> a) I was distracting tav
05:42:46 <sbp> b) Mainly I work against the grain of the channel, trying to provide constructive criticism, whereas I think there needs to be a bit more boltering for a while
05:43:14 <sbp> c) That thing with Omni was really strange--thought I'd lie humbly low for a while after that. Very odd indeed
05:43:41 <sbp> d) Trolls are a nuisance. Frankly, I was getting a bit irritated with their constant appearances
05:44:38 <sbp> e) Generally, there's not much going on anyway--and won't be until tav releases code
05:46:26 <Ash> and plex is a myth
05:46:46 <sbp> at first I was just hoping that Omni would return and feel welcome and so forth... but then I decided that if you do something as strange as he did--and so badly that you can be outed in under a minute--then, well...
05:46:59 <sbp> no, no. it's just vapourware
05:47:07 <sbp> give it a few years--*then* it'll be a myth
05:47:09 <sbp> and hey Ash
05:47:21 <xover> Enough teasing. DIsh the dirt on this Omni incident!
05:47:33 <Ash> yeah who is Omni and why should we harass him
05:47:39 <sbp> hmm. don't know if I can or should, really
05:47:39 <d8uv> Hi!
05:47:43 <sbp> hey d8uv
05:48:11 <sbp> I guess the incident is obscure enough in the logs that I can provide an overview
05:49:00 <sbp> basically, in #esp we get a lot of self-made trolls in there; people that come in using Canadian proxy addresses and espouse lots of singular political and sociological ideas. that's the nice way of putting it
05:49:29 <sbp> they're highly secretive, and get jumpy at any attempt to find their identity, which we of course do rather often
05:49:35 <sbp> heh, heh
05:50:21 <sbp> one day, someone came in and started asking questions a la the trolls, though this person was slightly different, and so we were intrigued. I came in at the tail end of it, and thought I'd find out who was behind it
05:50:35 <sbp> it took me about thirty seconds--it just wasn't difficult at all
05:50:47 <d8uv> Like what you people did with me.
05:50:49 <d8uv> :(
05:51:11 <sbp> (heheh)
05:51:14 <xover> No, no. You we decided to swallow whole d8uv. :-)
05:51:37 <sbp> it turned out to be one of the #esp regulars who was sitting on the channel, so I said "ha! gotcha", and proceeded to unmask the whole event--I figured he was just having a laugh pretending to be one of the trolls, etc.
05:51:46 <sbp> instead, he got extremely upset and left
05:52:04 <sbp> so we begged him to return since he'd seemed a nice guy, and he's a good developer...
05:52:42 <sbp> but then I thought, hey, if you can't have a laugh about it, what's up?
05:53:36 <sbp> actually, d8uv's a good example. we outed him rather quickly
05:53:39 <xover> FWIW, I agree. If you want to piss about with cloaking, do it *right* fer chrissakes!
05:53:47 <sbp> heh, exactly
05:53:53 <sbp> it's not like it's hard
05:54:04 <sbp> if you do it sloppily and get caught, basically: tough shit
05:54:17 <sbp> thanks for playing, 25c to try again, etc.
05:54:25 <Yoplax> *** Yoplax (d8uv@16-67-237-24.gci.net) has joined #swhack
05:54:28 <Yoplax> Hi.
05:54:34 <sbp> hi there d8uv, and welcome to Swhack
05:54:36 <Yoplax> I just read about gmail.
05:54:48 <Yoplax> It's awesome. Is it really a gig?
05:54:49 <Yoplax> Wow.
05:54:52 <sbp> heh
05:55:02 <Ash> try #gmail
05:55:07 <sbp> yeah, d8uv
05:55:12 <sbp> you should know better than that
05:55:14 <Ash> sbp kickbanned the last few people that came in asking about gmail
05:55:42 <sbp> *** sbp has kicked Yoplax from #swhack
05:55:46 <sbp> :-)
05:55:56 <sbp> oh, shit, I'd better unban. heheh
05:56:00 <Ash> HAR
05:56:03 <Ash> why
05:56:16 <Ash> *** Ash has changed the topic to: ask about gmail and you will be banned
05:56:19 <sbp> otherwise d8uv will be unable to spea... oh, I guess I see your point
05:56:43 <Ash> lol!
05:57:03 <Ash> I wasn't paying attention
05:57:07 <sbp> hehehe
05:57:13 <Ash> it's even funnier now
05:57:14 <Ash> hehehe
05:57:19 <sbp> * sbp ruffles d8uv's hair
05:57:40 <xover> * xover is willing to bet d8uv is off racking his brains trying to come up with a better second attempt...
05:57:41 <sbp> * sbp ruffles Ash's too
05:57:45 <sbp> heheh
05:57:58 <Ash> it helps to not join from your own ip address
05:58:11 <sbp> well, that and also not using "d8uv" as a user nam
05:58:21 <sbp> ...e, butterfly net, yadda yadda
05:58:40 <GeorgeWashington> *** GeorgeWashington (d8uv@16-67-237-24.gci.net) has joined #swhack
05:58:45 <GeorgeWashington> XOVER IS A LOOSER
05:58:46 <GeorgeWashington> *** GeorgeWashington has quit (Client Quit)
05:58:47 <xover> * xover sighs...
05:58:52 <AthlonRob> lmao
05:59:00 <sbp> drive by LOOSERing
05:59:04 <sbp> .wn looser
05:59:16 <AthlonRob> wonder if he's an aol'er... can't gag an aol member after they leave the aol chatroom
05:59:21 <sbp> * sbp taps xena
05:59:34 <AthlonRob> @define looser
05:59:35 <supybot> AthlonRob: Error: 'define' is not a valid command.
05:59:44 <AthlonRob> @dictionary looser
05:59:45 <supybot> AthlonRob: Error: 'dictionary' is not a valid command.
05:59:49 <sbp> in any case, d8uv: "looser" means "more loose". "loser" means "person who sucks"
05:59:57 <xover> @supybot--
06:00:07 <d8uv> AthlonRob: Who, GeorgeWashington? Nah, he's from Compuserv.
06:00:14 <xover> +e
06:00:25 <AthlonRob> CS2K?
06:00:36 <AthlonRob> ....'cause CS2K *is* AOL :-)
06:00:47 <marme> *** marme (~marme@craigm.dsl.xmission.com) has joined #swhack
06:00:50 <sbp> the easy solution to AOLers is to ban them all
06:01:07 <marme> hi
06:01:16 <xover> Now *that's* better! :-)
06:01:19 <d8uv> Hi marme!
06:01:21 <sbp> hey there Scott
06:01:32 <marme> Scott?
06:01:34 <sbp> except that's probably Ash on Scott's box
06:01:39 <marme> Ash?
06:01:43 <AthlonRob> @dict looser
06:01:44 <supybot> AthlonRob: web1913: Loose \Loose\, a. [Compar. {Looser}; superl. {Loosest}.] [OE. loos, lous, laus, Icel. lauss; akin to OD. loos, D. los, AS. le['a]s false, deceitful, G. los, loose, Dan. & Sw. l["o]s, Goth. laus, and E. lose. ? See {Lose}, and cf. {Leasing} falsehood.] 1. Unbound; untied; unsewed; not attached, fastened, fixed, or confined; as, the loose sheets of a (4 more messages)
06:02:01 <marme> @jeffk [last --from sbp]
06:02:01 <supybot> marme: <SBP> ESCIEPT TATH"S RPOBABLEY ASH ON SCOTT"S BOX
06:02:24 <marme> @topic add [jeffk last --from sbp]
06:02:24 <supybot> *** supybot has changed the topic to: ask about gmail and you will be banned || LAST --RFOM BSP (marme)
06:02:28 <marme> ha
06:02:34 <sbp> @topic add [jeffk [last --from sbp]]
06:02:35 <supybot> *** supybot has changed the topic to: ask about gmail and you will be banned || LAST --RFOM BSP (marme) || <sbp> escietp taths probablyl Ash on Scott"s box (sbp)
06:02:37 <marme> @topic add [jeffk [last --from sbp]]
06:02:37 <supybot> *** supybot has changed the topic to: ask about gmail and you will be banned || LAST --RFOM BSP (marme) || <sbp> escietp taths probablyl Ash on Scott"s box (sbp) || <sbp> @topic add [jeffk [llast --from sbp]] (marme)
06:03:02 <sbp> :-)
06:03:13 <d8uv> *** d8uv has changed the topic to: ask about gmail and you will be banned || <sbp> escietp taths probablyl Ash on Scott"s box (sbp)
06:03:19 <sbp> thanks d8uv
06:03:32 <marme> @jeffk [topic add [jeffk [jeffk [last --from d8uv]]]]
06:03:33 <supybot> *** supybot has changed the topic to: ask about gmail and you will be banned || <sbp> escietp taths probablyl Ash on Scott"s box (sbp) || <d8uv> Hio mamre! (marme)
06:03:36 <sbp> I was going to try @topic remove, but who wants to mess up the indexen?
06:03:42 <marme> @topic remove *
06:03:42 <supybot> marme: Error: The argument must be a number.
06:03:47 <marme> @topic remove 125218912675981265921658912659816295621895
06:03:48 <supybot> marme: Error: OverflowError: long int too large to convert to int
06:03:49 <sbp> heh. I tried :
06:03:58 <marme> *** marme has quit (Client Quit)
06:04:12 <d8uv> @topic remove -1
06:04:13 <supybot> *** supybot has changed the topic to: ask about gmail and you will be banned || <sbp> escietp taths probablyl Ash on Scott"s box (sbp)
06:04:18 <xover> @topic remove -42
06:04:19 <supybot> xover: Error: That's not a valid topic number.
06:04:36 <d8uv> @topic remove sbp
06:04:37 <supybot> d8uv: Error: The argument must be a number.
06:04:42 <xover> @topic remove - (2-1)
06:04:43 <supybot> xover: Error: The argument must be a number.
06:04:49 <xover> @topic remove -(2-1)
06:04:50 <supybot> xover: Error: The argument must be a number.
06:04:52 <sbp> @topic remove pi
06:04:53 <supybot> sbp: Error: The argument must be a number.
06:04:57 <xover> @topic remove -1^2
06:04:58 <supybot> xover: Error: The argument must be a number.
06:04:58 <sbp> pi is a number
06:05:11 <xover> @topic remove -1_000
06:05:12 <supybot> xover: Error: The argument must be a number.
06:05:27 <d8uv> @topic remove -1.0
06:05:27 <supybot> d8uv: Error: The argument must be a number.
06:05:31 <xover> You have a rather limited view of numbers don't you?
06:05:37 <AthlonRob> @topic remove [calc 1^2]
06:05:37 <supybot> AthlonRob: Error: Something in there wasn't a valid number.
06:05:44 <xover> @topic remove -1,0
06:05:45 <supybot> xover: Error: The argument must be a number.
06:05:54 <AthlonRob> @calc 1^2
06:05:55 <supybot> AthlonRob: Error: Something in there wasn't a valid number.
06:06:01 <Ash> @jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [last --from xover]]]]]]]
06:06:03 <supybot> Ash: <XOVAR> @TOOOOPOIOC REMOVE -1,0 HAHAHAHHAHHAHHAH!!!~ LOLLOLLOLFAGOT JERK!!~~~~!
06:06:08 <sbp> haha
06:06:12 <xover> Hah hah.
06:06:17 <d8uv> Hehehe.
06:06:32 <Ash> @jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [last --from xover]]]]]]]]]]]]
06:06:33 <supybot> Ash: Error: Spurious "]". You may want to quote your arguments with double quotes in order to prevent extra brackets from being evaluated as nested commands.
06:06:35 <Ash> oops
06:06:37 <sbp> @calc 1 ** 2
06:06:38 <supybot> sbp: 1
06:06:40 <Ash> @jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [last --from xover]]]]]]]]]]]]
06:06:42 <supybot> Ash: NO YUO AHHLL0LLL0LLLLLLL0LLLLLLLL0LLLLLLL!!~~!!~~ HAHHAHHAHHAHLLOLL!!~~!!~~
06:06:44 <sbp> @calc 1 ** 0.5
06:06:44 <Ash> i need paren balancing
06:06:45 <supybot> sbp: 1
06:06:47 <Ash> in irc
06:06:53 <sbp> @calc 0.5 ** 0.5
06:06:54 <supybot> sbp: 0.707106781187
06:06:59 <sbp> use emacs IRC client, k thx
06:07:06 <Ash> @jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [last --from xover]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]
06:07:07 <d8uv> @topic add <supybot> Ash: NO YUO AHHLL0LLL0LLLLLLL0LLLLLLLL0LLLLLLL!!~~!!~~ HAHHAHHAHHAHLLOLL!!~~!!~~
06:07:08 <supybot> Ash: <XOVAR> HAH HAH! LLLLOLLLLOLLLOHLLAHHAHHAHHAH~~~ HAHHAH DUMBHSEOS~~~~! LOLLOLLOLAHHAHHAHHAHH!~~!!~~
06:07:09 <supybot> *** supybot has changed the topic to: ask about gmail and you will be banned || <sbp> escietp taths probablyl Ash on Scott"s box (sbp) || <supybot> Ash: NO YUO AHHLL0LLL0LLLLLLL0LLLLLLLL0LLLLLLL!!~~!!~~ HAHHAHHAHHAHLLOLL!!~~!!~~ (d8uv)
06:07:20 <Ash> lol
06:07:51 <d8uv> *** d8uv has changed the topic to: ask about gmail and you will be banned || <sbp> escietp taths probablyl Ash on Scott"s box (sbp) || <supybot> Ash: NO YUO AHHLL0LLL0LLLLLLL0LLLLLLLL0LLLLLLL!!~~!!~~ HAHHAH DUMBHSEOS~~~~!(d8uv)
06:07:57 <sbp> @jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [last --from xover]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]
06:07:59 <supybot> sbp: NO YUO LOLLLLOLLLLOLLLLLLOLLLLLLOL~~ HAHHAHHAHHAHLOLLOLLOLLOL!!~~~~~! AHHAHHAHHAHHAHH JERKS!~~~!!!~ AHHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHH!!~! AHHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHH~!!~~!~ HAHAHAHAHA FAGOT1!!~~ HAAHHAHHAHHAHH DUMBSHOES!~~!!~~ LOLLOLLOLHAHAHAFAGOT JERK!~!~!~ hahahahaha fagorts~!!~~~~~!
06:08:03 <xover> «Look Mike, I like you. I like the way you handle yourself. You seem like a reasonable man. Why don't we make a deal. What's it worth to you to drag your considerable talents back to the gutter you crawled out of?»
06:08:05 <Ash> @topic [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [last --from morbus]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]
06:08:06 <supybot> Ash: Error: I couldn't find a message matching that criteria in my history of 1000 messages.
06:08:14 <Ash> @topic [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [last --from xover]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]
06:08:15 <supybot> Ash: (topic <command> [<args> ...]) -- Command dispatcher for the Topic plugin. Use 'list Topic' to see the commands provided by this plugin. In most cases this dispatcher command is unnecessary; in cases where more than one plugin defines a given command, use this command to tell the bot which plugin's command to use.
06:08:23 <sbp> * sbp tries to read xover's comment in amidst the junk
06:08:23 <Ash> @jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [jeffk [last --from xover]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]
06:08:24 <supybot> Ash: NO YUO AHHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHHFAGOT JERK!!~! HAHHAHHA!~~~!!~
06:08:32 <Ash> normalized to jeffk form
06:08:38 <sbp> heh!
06:08:40 <Ash> is there a translator thing
06:08:42 <Ash> in this bot
06:08:45 <Ash> @translate jalokbahd
06:08:46 <supybot> Ash: (translate <from-language> [to] <to-language> <text>) -- Returns <text> translated from <from-language> into <to-language>.
06:08:58 <sbp> @topic add Swhack: now normalised to JeffK form
06:08:58 <xover> * xover adds to his .sig file: HAHAHAHHAHHAHHAH!!!~ LOLLOLLOLFAGOT JERK!!~~~~!
06:08:58 <supybot> *** supybot has changed the topic to: ask about gmail and you will be banned || <sbp> escietp taths probablyl Ash on Scott"s box (sbp) || <supybot> Ash: NO YUO AHHLL0LLL0LLLLLLL0LLLLLLLL0LLLLLLL!!~~!!~~ HAHHAH DUMBHSEOS~~~~!(d8uv) || Swhack: now normalised to JeffK form (sbp)
06:09:49 <Ash> @translate german to english [translate english to german [jeffk --from xover]]
06:09:51 <supybot> Ash: -- of xovar
06:10:07 <sbp> @translate en to es buenos dias senor, I come to you now from the channel of Swhack where many beautiful people are
06:10:08 <supybot> sbp: Error: Babelfish has foiled our plans by changing its webpage format
06:10:12 <Ash> @translate german to english [translate english to german [jeffk --from sbp]]
06:10:14 <supybot> Ash: -- of sbp
06:10:16 <Ash> heh
06:10:21 <sbp> well doesn't that just take the biscuit
06:10:38 <Ash> @translate english to spanish [jeffk --from sbp]]
06:10:39 <supybot> Ash: Error: Spurious "]". You may want to quote your arguments with double quotes in order to prevent extra brackets from being evaluated as nested commands.
06:10:42 <Ash> @translate english to spanish [jeffk --from sbp]
06:10:43 <supybot> Ash: Error: Babelfish has foiled our plans by changing its webpage format
06:10:47 <Ash> :(
06:10:55 <sbp> we could use xena
06:11:00 <Ash> xena
06:11:03 <Ash> .translate
06:11:04 <xena> usage: translate <from language>-<to language> <phrase>
06:11:05 <xena> - translates the given phrase from one language to another.
06:11:06 <xena> - run translate languages to see the host of languages supported.
06:11:09 <sbp> .translate eng-spa buenos dias senor, I come to you now from the channel of Swhack where many beautiful people are
06:11:19 <xena> buenos dias senor , Vengo hasta usted ahora del canal de Swhack dónde many bello gente are
06:11:26 <Ash> @jeffk [last --from sbp]
06:11:27 <supybot> Ash: <SBP> .TRANSLATE ENG-SPA BUENOS DOIAS SENOR, I COME TO YOU NOW RFOM TEH HCANNEL OF SWHACK WHERE MANY BAEUTIFULL POEPAL ARE
06:11:31 <sbp> .translate spa-eng buenos dias senor , Vengo hasta usted ahora del canal de Swhack dónde many bello gente are
06:11:33 <xena> good dias sinus , I avenge until you now of the duct of Swhack where many beautiful people are
06:11:42 <sbp> @jeffk good dias sinus , I avenge until you now of the duct of Swhack where many beautiful people are
06:11:42 <supybot> sbp: good dais sionus , I avenge untoilleyuo now of teh duct of Swhack where mayn baeutioful poeple are hahahahahhah~!
06:11:45 <Ash> .translate eng-spa <SBP> .TRANSLATE ENG-SPA BUENOS DOIAS SENOR, I COME TO
06:11:45 <Ash> YOU NOW RFOM TEH HCANNEL OF SWHACK WHERE MANY BAEUTIFULL
06:11:47 <xena> SBP ENG - ESTACIÓN BALNEARIA BUENOS DOIAS SENOR , Vengo HASTA
06:11:48 <Ash> bah
06:11:55 <xover> @translate english to spanish [jeffk [last --from sbp]]
06:11:56 <supybot> xover: Error: Babelfish has foiled our plans by changing its webpage format
06:12:17 <sbp> @topic add Good dias, Sinus! I avenge until you now of the duct of Swhack where many beautiful people are.
06:12:17 <supybot> *** supybot has changed the topic to: ask about gmail and you will be banned || <sbp> escietp taths probablyl Ash on Scott"s box (sbp) || <supybot> Ash: NO YUO AHHLL0LLL0LLLLLLL0LLLLLLLL0LLLLLLL!!~~!!~~ HAHHAH DUMBHSEOS~~~~!(d8uv) || Swhack: now normalised to JeffK form (sbp) || Good dias, Sinus! I avenge until you now of the duct of Swhack where many beautiful people are. (sbp)
06:13:03 <d8uv> Hmm?
06:13:03 <d8uv> [[[
06:13:04 <d8uv> [22:13] <d8uv> @translate english to spanish "I enjoy the cheese, thanks"
06:13:05 <d8uv> [22:13] <supybot> Gozo del queso, gracias
06:13:06 <d8uv> ]]]
06:13:16 <sbp> hmm
06:13:22 <d8uv> Quotes maybe?
06:13:30 <sbp> @translate english to spanish "take this monkey and give it to your sister"
06:13:32 <supybot> sbp: Error: Babelfish has foiled our plans by changing its webpage format
06:13:41 <d8uv> Hmm!
06:13:52 <sbp> where did you do the quote above?
06:14:09 <d8uv> In dialog window.
06:14:11 <xover> @translate english to spanish [last --from sbp]
06:14:12 <supybot> xover: Error: Babelfish has foiled our plans by changing its webpage format
06:14:26 <sbp> huh!
06:14:26 <sbp> <sbp> @translate english to spanish "I enjoy the cheese, thanks"
06:14:26 <sbp> <supybot> Gozo del queso, gracias
06:14:29 <sbp> he's right
06:14:47 <sbp> even freakier:
06:14:47 <sbp> <sbp> @translate english to spanish "take this monkey and give it to your sister"
06:14:48 <sbp> <supybot> Error: Babelfish has foiled our plans by changing its webpage format
06:15:00 <sbp> @translate english to spanish "I enjoy the cheese, thanks"
06:15:01 <supybot> sbp: Gozo del queso, gracias
06:15:06 <xover> Ah! It's the Cheese!
06:15:14 <sbp> @translate english to spanish "I enjoy the cheese"
06:15:15 <supybot> sbp: Gozo del queso
06:15:19 <sbp> @translate english to spanish "I enjoy cheese"
06:15:20 <supybot> sbp: Gozo del queso
06:15:29 <sbp> @translate english to spanish "I enjoy a particularly interesting cheese"
06:15:30 <supybot> sbp: Error: Babelfish has foiled our plans by changing its webpage format
06:15:37 <sbp> OKAY THEN
06:16:02 <d8uv> http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=936790&group_id=58965&atid=489447
06:16:06 <supybot> Title: SourceForge.net: Detail:936790 - Translate weirdness. (at sourceforge.net)
06:16:15 <xover> @translate english to spanish "I enjoy the cheese thanks"
06:16:16 <supybot> xover: Gozo de las gracias del queso
06:16:20 <xover> @translate english to spanish "I enjoy the cheese thanks and"
06:16:21 <supybot> xover: Gozo de las gracias del queso y
06:16:25 <xover> @translate english to spanish "I enjoy the cheese thanks and I also"
06:16:26 <supybot> xover: Error: Babelfish has foiled our plans by changing its webpage format
06:16:28 <sbp> well done, d8uv
06:16:37 <xover> @translate english to spanish "I enjoy the cheese thanks and I do"
06:16:39 <supybot> xover: Gozo de las gracias del queso y
06:16:43 <xover> @translate english to spanish "I enjoy the cheese thanks and I do not"
06:16:44 <supybot> xover: Error: Babelfish has foiled our plans by changing its webpage format
06:16:57 <sbp> oh, I'll bet it's output length
06:17:09 <sbp> @translate english to spanish "ass are who?"
06:17:10 <supybot> sbp: ¿el asno es quién?
06:17:15 <xover> @translate english to spanish "I enjoy the cheese thanks and I don't"
06:17:16 <supybot> xover: Error: Babelfish has foiled our plans by changing its webpage format
06:17:22 <xover> @translate english to spanish "I enjoy the cheese thanks and don't"
06:17:23 <supybot> xover: Error: Babelfish has foiled our plans by changing its webpage format
06:17:35 <sbp> @translate english to spanish "it is translation length"
06:17:36 <supybot> sbp: es longitud de la traducción
06:17:41 <sbp> @translate english to spanish "translate shorter phrases"
06:17:42 <supybot> sbp: traduzca frases más cortas
06:17:45 <sbp> @translate english to spanish "then it works"
06:17:46 <supybot> sbp: entonces trabaja
06:18:12 <sbp> @translate english to spanish "my monkey..."
06:18:14 <supybot> sbp: mi mono...
06:18:19 <sbp> @translate english to spanish "...it is spangly!"
06:18:20 <supybot> sbp: ¡... está spangly!
06:18:22 <d8uv> @translate english to german "but what is the character limit?"
06:18:22 <supybot> d8uv: Error: Babelfish has foiled our plans by changing its webpage format
06:18:32 <xover> @translate spanish to english "Ay! Caramba!"
06:18:33 <supybot> xover: Ay! Caramba!
06:18:36 <sbp> "Gozo de las gracias del queso y" is the longest we've got frmo it yet
06:18:43 <xover> @supybot++
06:19:00 <sbp> @translate english to spanish "hey! fuck!"
06:19:01 <supybot> sbp: ¡hey! ¡cogida!
06:19:19 <sbp> s/frmo/from/
06:20:32 <sbp> also: "Woods"? bleh
06:20:46 <d8uv> Trying to find how to change now.
06:20:48 <xover> @karma
06:20:50 <supybot> xover: Highest karma: 'supybot' (3), 'tav' (2), and 'karma' (2). Lowest karma: 'soopy' (-2), 'datum' (-1), and 'd8uv' (0).
06:20:53 <sbp> :-)
06:20:59 <sbp> @d8uv++
06:21:23 <xena> @datum++
06:21:38 <xover> @d8uv++++
06:21:58 <xover> Oooh. xena has a thing for datum!
06:22:12 <xover> @karma
06:22:12 <xena> * xena blushes
06:22:13 <supybot> xover: Highest karma: 'supybot' (3), 'tav' (2), and 'karma' (2). Lowest karma: 'soopy' (-2), 'datum' (-1), and 'd8uv++' (1).
06:22:20 <sbp> you should be able to multiply karma people at expense of your own karma
06:22:42 <xover> @help karma
06:22:43 <supybot> xover: (karma [<channel>] [<thing> [<thing> ...]]) -- Returns the karma of <text>. If <thing> is not given, returns the top three and bottom three karmas. If one <thing> is given, returns the details of its karma; if more than one <thing> is given, returns the total karma of each of the the things. <channel> is only necessary if the message isn't sent on the channel itself.
06:23:09 <xover> @karma supybot
06:23:10 <supybot> xover: Karma for 'supybot' has been increased 4 times and decreased 1 time for a total karma of 3.
06:24:10 <d8uv> Damnit.
06:24:25 <d8uv> I have "떴다!! 그녀!!" by the Witches stuck in my head.
06:24:28 <xover> Hmm, with sufficient command aliasing you should be able to while (self.karma >= 0) {@$1++}
06:24:49 <d8uv> But I can't find the song.
06:26:31 <sbp> xena: .rot13 hmm
06:26:38 <sbp> xena: rot13 hmm
06:26:45 <sbp> xena?
06:26:53 <xena> What?
06:26:57 <sbp> sigh
06:27:20 <sbp> @echo [last --from xena]
06:27:21 <supybot> <xena> What?
06:27:22 <xover> deltab: rot13 hmmm
06:27:27 <sbp> haha
06:27:54 <xover> SLowest damn bot I've seen in a while.
06:27:58 <sbp> yeah
06:28:04 <xover> .wn damn
06:28:05 <xena> damn defined as:
06:28:06 <xena> - adj 1: used as expletives; "oh, damn (or goddamn)!" [syn: {goddamn}]
06:28:07 <xena> - 2: expletives used informally as intensifiers; "he's a blasted idiot"; "it's a blamed shame"; "a blame cold winter"; "not a blessed dime"; "I'll be damned (or blessed or darned or goddamned) if I'll do any such thing"; "he's a damn (or goddam or goddamned) fool"; "a deuced idiot"; "tired or his everlasting whimpering"; "an infernal nuisance" [syn: {blasted}, {blame}, {blamed}, {blessed},
06:28:08 <xena> {damned}, {darned}, {deuced}, {everlasting}, {goddam}, {goddamn}, {goddamned}, {infernal}] n : something of little value; "his promise is not worth a damn"; "not worth one red cent"; "not worth shucks" [syn: {darn}, {hoot}, {red cent}, {shit}, {shucks}, {tinker's damn}, {tinker's dam}] adv : extremely; "you are bloody right"; "Why are you so all-fired aggressive?" [syn: {bloody}, {all-fired}] v : wish
06:28:10 <xena> .. a very large amount of text.
06:28:11 <sbp> @echo re s/<xena>// [last --from xena]
06:28:12 <supybot> re s/<xena>// <xena> .. a very large amount of text.
06:28:18 <sbp> @echo [re s/<xena>// [last --from xena]]
06:28:19 <supybot> sbp: Error: You don't have the 'trusted' capability. If you think that you should have this capability, be sure that you are identified before trying again. The 'whoami' command can tell you if you're identified.
06:28:29 <sbp> figures
06:28:52 <d8uv> I think last has regex built in.
06:28:57 <d8uv> @help last
06:28:57 <supybot> d8uv: (last [--{from,in,to,with,regexp}] <args>) -- Returns the last message matching the given criteria. --from requires a nick from whom the message came; --in and --to require a channel the message was sent to; --with requires some string that had to be in the message; --regexp requires a regular expression the message must match. By default, the current channel is searched.
06:29:05 <sbp> @echo [re s/<xena>// [last --from xena]]
06:29:05 <supybot> sbp: Error: You don't have the 'trusted' capability. If you think that you should have this capability, be sure that you are identified before trying again. The 'whoami' command can tell you if you're identified.
06:29:12 <sbp> grumble
06:29:25 <Ash> * Ash -> bed
06:29:30 <d8uv> Night Ash!
06:29:30 <sbp> 'night Ash!
06:29:36 <sbp> heh
06:29:48 <Ash> goodnight!
06:30:08 <xover> @jeffk [last --from Ash]
06:30:09 <supybot> xover: <Ahs> goodnight! lollollollol dumbshoe!~!~
06:30:23 <sbp> that's more like it
06:30:39 <d8uv> sbp: @outfilter jeffk
06:30:52 <sbp> AHAHAAH OPARATION SUCCESDEDD FAGGAT
06:30:59 <sbp> ROFFLE
06:31:02 <d8uv> Hahahaha.
06:31:18 <xover> * xover needs to get that for his X-Chat...
06:31:23 <sbp> O NOE U MAEN I CAN ONLY TALK LIEK TEH JARKA????!!! AHAHA DUMBSHOES
06:31:40 <sbp> HELPPPS!!!!!~!~!
06:31:48 <sbp> LOLOLLOLLAHAHAHA
06:31:53 <xover> You're frighteningly good at that!
06:32:00 <sbp> AHAHAHA THX
06:32:01 <d8uv> sbp: You won the "special" prize.
06:32:03 <d8uv> *** d8uv has quit (""AHAHAAH OPARATION SUCCESDEDD FAGGAT"")
06:32:17 <sbp> OOH~!
06:32:40 <xover> And by "frighteningly" in this context I mean, it scared the bejeesus out of me that you're able to do that at will!
06:32:49 <d8uv> *** d8uv (d8uv@16-67-237-24.gci.net) has joined #swhack
06:32:53 <xover> Not to mention "at length".
06:33:11 <sbp> O NOE~! I MUST UES THIS POWER ONLY FOR TEH GOOD???!?? ~~HERPES@@@@!
06:33:31 <xover> @topic add [last --from sbp]
06:33:33 <supybot> *** supybot has changed the topic to: ask about gmail and you will be banned || <sbp> escietp taths probablyl Ash on Scott"s box (sbp) || <supybot> Ash: NO YUO AHHLL0LLL0LLLLLLL0LLLLLLLL0LLLLLLL!!~~!!~~ HAHHAH DUMBHSEOS~~~~!(d8uv) || Swhack: now normalised to JeffK form (sbp) || Good dias, Sinus! I avenge until you now of the duct of Swhack where many beautiful people are. (sbp) || <sbp> O NOE~! I MUST UES THIS POWER ONLY FOR TEH GOOD???!?? ~~HERPES@@@@! (xover)
06:33:57 <sbp> AHAHAHA!!! DFOILED BY TEH TOPIAC LANEGH FAGGAT AHAHA ROFFEL+!$*!~~~~~!
06:34:04 <d8uv> NO U HALF 2 USE TI 4 DA AWESUM FUKHED
06:34:14 <xena> sbp: @outfilter
06:34:16 <xover> jeffk: Endless Amounts Of Fun! (HAHAHAHHAHHAHHAH!!!~ LOLLOLLOLFAGOT JERK!!~~~~!)
06:34:21 <sbp> phew. thank goodness for that
06:34:59 <xover> @jeffk++
06:35:14 <sbp> @jeffk++
06:36:24 <xover> Hmmm. Karma should get a much more complicated assignment system.
06:36:33 <sbp> different grades of karma?
06:36:43 <xover> No assigning karma if you have no karma.
06:36:44 <sbp> like Star Karma, Mushroom Karma, Frog Karma?
06:36:57 <sbp> but then no one can ever get karma
06:37:01 <sbp> so everyone stays at 0
06:37:08 <xover> @0++
06:37:16 <d8uv> @0--
06:37:20 <d8uv> @karma 0
06:37:21 <supybot> d8uv: Karma for '0' has been increased 1 time and decreased 1 time for a total karma of 0.
06:37:35 <xover> Not as much fun, no, I agree. :-)
06:37:51 <sbp> I dunno... I'd say it's about as fun... :-)
06:38:06 <sbp> <sbp> @hmm++
06:38:07 <xover> No, I mean there should be some initial karma, or accrued over time...
06:38:12 <sbp> <sbp> Karma it! DAMNIT!
06:38:24 <xover> @it++
06:38:37 <sbp> you should automatically get a karma point if you can go for over a month without saying LOL
06:38:37 <d8uv> @d8uv--
06:38:50 <sbp> and other random keywords
06:38:58 <xover> Yeah, karma based on arbitrary (but still automatic) rules.
06:39:04 <d8uv> Like "lalala", you ashhater.
06:40:26 <xover> Kinda like real life that way. Funny how that worked out... :-)
06:40:43 <d8uv> I like karma how it is.
06:41:03 <xover> @bored++
06:41:04 <xover> @bored++
06:41:05 <xover> @bored++
06:41:06 <xover> @bored++
06:41:07 <xover> @bored++
06:41:07 <xover> @bored++
06:41:08 <xover> @bored++
06:41:10 <xover> @bored++
06:41:12 <xover> @bored++
06:41:14 <xover> @bored++
06:41:16 <xover> @bored++
06:41:32 <d8uv> @xover--
06:41:33 <d8uv> @xover--
06:41:34 <d8uv> @xover--
06:41:34 <d8uv> @xover--
06:41:35 <d8uv> @xover--
06:41:36 <d8uv> @xover--
06:41:37 <d8uv> @xover--
06:41:37 <d8uv> @xover--
06:41:40 <d8uv> etc.
06:42:42 <sbp> I guess I ought to say something...
06:43:15 <xover> Yeah. Do a bit! Entertain me!
06:43:18 <sbp> FAGGATS!!~! AHAHA J/K, ROFF1L ETCTARS! HAHAHAHAHA !!!!!! BURNX0r!~!~!~!!!!
06:43:31 <sbp> LOLOLOLOL
06:43:59 <d8uv> KIKIKIKIKIKIK OPS TYPO
06:44:20 <sbp> in any case, since all this is being publically logged, I feel I ought best refrain from demeaning myself by using that sort of most inelegantly gross and colloquial of languages
06:44:23 <xover> /kickbanfuckkill *
06:44:38 <xover> Woops!
06:44:58 <sbp> hmm
06:45:11 <sbp> what we need in here is a bit of homoerotic mudjelly wrestling
06:45:18 <sbp> and I can only think of one equivalent
06:45:21 <xover> @roulette
06:45:22 <supybot> xover: *click*
06:45:26 <sbp> opwar!
06:45:26 <xover> @roulette
06:45:27 <supybot> xover: *click*
06:45:29 <xover> @roulette
06:45:30 <supybot> xover: *click*
06:45:31 <xover> @roulette
06:45:32 <supybot> xover: *click*
06:45:33 <xover> @roulette
06:45:34 <supybot> xover: *click*
06:45:35 <xover> @roulette
06:45:36 <supybot> xover: *click*
06:45:44 <xover> AAAAAAARRRRRRGGGGGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!!
06:46:00 <d8uv> I did that last night too. 8 times I think.
06:46:12 <sbp> it's firing blanks anyway. come on! opwar!
06:46:13 <d8uv> Then I died in #sbp this afternoon.
06:46:17 <sbp> * sbp nods
06:46:19 <xover> *** xover has kicked d8uv from #swhack
06:46:28 <sbp> [06:14] <d8uv> @roulette
06:46:28 <sbp> [06:14] <supybot> d8uv: *BANG* Hey, who put a blank in here?!
06:46:28 <sbp> [06:14] <d8uv> DAMNIT
06:46:30 <sbp> hehe
06:46:35 <sbp> that's more like it
06:46:39 <xover> If you want a thing done _right_, do it yerself!
06:46:44 <sbp> * sbp nods
06:46:50 <GeorgeWashington> *** GeorgeWashington (d8uv@16-67-237-24.gci.net) has joined #swhack
06:46:59 <GeorgeWashington> THE GLOVES ARE OFF MOTHERFUCKER
06:47:00 <sbp> welcome to Swhack Mr. Washington
06:47:07 <xover> Heh heh.
06:47:09 <Monty> ChanServ and GeorgeWashington sitting in a tree...
06:47:13 <GeorgeWashington> Hello sbp. Limey bastard.
06:47:18 <sbp> chuckle @ Monty
06:47:21 <Monty> categorisation's schistosomes sells Gtk pornography...
06:47:29 <sbp> quiet, Monty
06:47:29 <Monty> Right...
06:47:39 <sbp> man, it's so intelligent
06:48:21 <GeorgeWashington> Anyways, back to buisness.
06:48:29 <GeorgeWashington> *** GeorgeWashington has kicked xover from #swhack
06:48:38 <sbp> hehe
06:49:44 <sbp> I think xover just got expelled from the union
06:49:45 <GeorgeWashington> I should stay as George Washington for a bit.
06:50:21 <GeorgeWashington> Please. Bitchass Lincoln punk.
06:50:35 <GeorgeWashington> (That was hilarious though)
06:51:03 <sbp> * sbp waits for xover
06:51:20 <sbp> * Quits: xover (~link@thumper.tj.unn.no) ("Client exiting")
06:51:21 <sbp> bleh
06:51:23 <sbp> COME BACK
06:51:40 <GeorgeWashington> I hope I didn't crush his spirit.
06:52:03 <sbp> I have to say that I'd be a bit dispirited if I were kicked by d8uv
06:52:08 <GeorgeWashington> Then again, getting schooled by a President has to be pretty damned embarrasing.
06:52:12 <sbp> but you're in the guise of GeorgeWashington, so I guess that makes it okay
06:53:24 <GeorgeWashington> I quite like this alterego. Jill will come in and be all "George Washington? WTF?"
06:53:37 <GeorgeWashington> And I'll be all "HAHAHAH LOOSER"
06:53:58 <GeorgeWashington> And you'll be all "You calling Jill loose?"
06:54:14 <GeorgeWashington> And Jill will never come back...
06:54:37 <d8uv> *** d8uv (d8uv@16-67-237-24.gci.net) has joined #swhack
06:54:46 <GeorgeWashington> *** GeorgeWashington has quit (""AHAHAAH OPARATION SUCCESDEDD FAGGAT"")
06:54:53 <sbp> yeah
06:55:10 <sbp> it'd be a disturbing trend. first mediovia, then xover, then jill...
06:55:48 <d8uv> Yeah...
06:55:56 <d8uv> @karma
06:55:56 <supybot> d8uv: Highest karma: 'bored' (11), 'supybot' (3), and 'jeffk' (2). Lowest karma: 'xover' (-8), 'soopy' (-2), and 'datum' (-1). You (d8uv) are ranked 22 out of 26.
06:56:08 <d8uv> @karma xover
06:56:08 <supybot> d8uv: Karma for 'xover' has been increased 0 times and decreased 8 times for a total karma of -8.
06:56:22 <d8uv> @xover++
06:56:23 <d8uv> @xover++
06:56:23 <d8uv> @xover++
06:56:24 <d8uv> @xover++
06:56:25 <d8uv> @xover++
06:56:25 <d8uv> @xover++
06:56:26 <d8uv> @xover++
06:56:27 <d8uv> @xover++
06:56:29 <d8uv> @xover++
06:56:33 <d8uv> @d8uv--
06:56:39 <d8uv> @d8uv--
06:56:40 <d8uv> @d8uv--
06:56:54 <d8uv> There. Karmaic balance is now all good.
06:57:00 <sbp> * sbp nods
07:17:08 <libby> *** libby (~libby@82-32-4-244.cable.ubr01.azte.blueyonder.co.uk) has joined #swhack
07:52:37 <patparazzi> http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/4707
07:52:39 <supybot> Title: O'Reilly Network: The Fuss About Gmail and Privacy: Nine Reasons Why It's Bogus [Apr. 16, 2004] (at www.oreillynet.com)
08:09:29 <libby> *** libby has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
10:01:02 <sbp> @help convert
10:01:02 <supybot> sbp: (convert [<number>] <unit> to <other unit>) -- Converts from <unit> to <other unit>. If number isn't given, it defaults to 1. For unit information, see 'units' command.
10:01:11 <sbp> @help units
10:01:12 <supybot> sbp: (units [<type>]) -- With no arguments, returns a list of measurement types, which can be passed as arguments. When called with a type as an argument, returns the units of that type.
10:01:22 <sbp> .help change
10:01:23 <xena> usage: change <#> <starting-currency> to <desired-currency>
10:01:24 <xena> - changes the amount specified by # from the starting-currency to the desired-currency, using latest exchange rates.
10:01:25 <xena> - run change currencies to see a list of valid currencies.
10:01:26 <xena> - run change <currency-symbol> to see the full name for a currency symbol.
10:01:43 <sbp> .change 5200 eur to gbp
10:01:45 <xena> 5,200.00 (Euro (EUR)) makes 3,470.93 (United Kingdom Pounds (GBP))
10:01:48 <sbp> ouch
10:06:27 <patparazzi> .change 142 usd to eur
10:06:28 <xena> 142.00 (United States Dollars (USD)) makes 119.008 (Euro (EUR))
10:37:01 <patparazzi> .change 149 usd to bef
10:37:03 <xena> 149.00 (United States Dollars (USD)) makes 5,037.42 (Belgium Francs (obsolete) (BEF))
11:20:10 <d8uv> To bed I go!
11:22:36 <sbp> 'night d8uv!
12:49:20 <sbp> *** sbp has changed the topic to: The previous topic was too long.
12:50:01 <patparazzi> it's all so quiet
12:53:08 <sbp> yeah
12:53:59 <libby> *** libby (~libby@adsl164-249.dsl.uva.nl) has joined #swhack
12:59:26 <sbp> "Keep fit, use the stairs": heh
12:59:43 <libby> in the CS dept
13:00:29 <sbp> there of all places? :-)
13:01:58 <libby> yeah, heh
13:26:41 <libby> *** libby has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
15:08:26 <libby> *** libby (~libby@adsl164-249.dsl.uva.nl) has joined #swhack
15:14:35 <jambonb> *** jambonb (~Aragorne@ALille-103-1-4-164.w81-50.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #swhack
15:15:23 <jambonb> hello , i am french,can i speak with you? (please)
15:16:19 <patparazzi> qu'est-ce que vous voulez
15:16:39 <jambonb> bonjour
15:16:52 <patparazzi> bonjour
15:16:53 <jambonb> ce chan a un rapport avec le hack ou pas?
15:17:30 <patparazzi> pas vraiement
15:17:41 <jambonb> ah
15:17:44 <jambonb> ou puis je en trouver ?
15:18:05 <patparazzi> je sais pas
15:18:34 <jambonb> arf
15:19:03 <patparazzi> qu'est-ce que tu cherches exactement?
15:19:08 <sbp> salut jambonb, bienvenue à Swhack
15:19:50 <jambonb> ben je recherche des hackers pr m'aider
15:20:34 <sbp> jambonb: je vous dirais que que c'est un canal publically noté, aussi bien que beaucoup plus de choses, mais malheureusement mon Français est la courtoisie du babelfish, ainsi l'I'll stoppé maintenant
15:20:53 <sbp> l'I'll? good grief that thing is a pile of shit
15:20:58 <patparazzi> hehe
15:21:30 <jambonb> *** jambonb has left #swhack
15:21:44 <sbp> heh, that was great
15:22:36 <patparazzi> i think he got the message
15:23:53 <sbp> yeah. quel est "tree files" en Français?
15:24:25 <patparazzi> tree=arbre
15:24:35 <sbp> et "files"?
15:24:48 <patparazzi> documents
15:24:51 <sbp> merci
15:25:06 <sbp> I'll be prepared for the next one, now
15:39:45 <libby> *** libby has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
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16:28:29 <thelsdj> *** thelsdj has quit ("leaving")
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16:39:30 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
16:43:01 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
17:01:47 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
17:01:57 <sbp> hey Jim
17:02:01 <JibberJim> Stupid network!
17:02:03 <JibberJim> hey sbp
17:02:04 <sbp> just reading http://moinmoin.wikiwikiweb.de/MoinMoinEtymology
17:02:07 <JibberJim> * JibberJim is annoyed!
17:02:08 <supybot> Title: MoinMoinEtymology - MoinMoin (at moinmoin.wikiwikiweb.de)
17:02:15 <sbp> again? what's the problem today? :-)
17:02:21 <Ash> SEMANTIC BALLS PIZZA
17:02:36 <sbp> just the network?
17:03:01 <JibberJim> so MOIN - is pronounced muy-in and not MO which rhymes with HO then?
17:03:17 <sbp> AROMATHERAPUTIC SALIENT HOMOEROTICISM
17:04:10 <sbp> (hi Ash!) Jim: right. it sounded rather polynesian or micronesian to me, and I was about to rant on odd neologisms or imported words being used as common greetings in English... but I looked it up and found that it was German
17:04:31 <deltab> I think of it as rhyming with coin
17:04:35 <JibberJim> * JibberJim always pronounces it like HOIN
17:04:38 <Ash> what's new
17:04:57 <sbp> yeah, I rhyme it with "coin" too
17:05:15 <sbp> but I think the diphthong is longer and flatter
17:05:30 <sbp> Ash: new is the state of something being recently created
17:05:52 <JibberJim> but talking about rhymes against english words are tough, since we don't all pronounce them the same!
17:05:52 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
17:05:53 <sbp> * sbp melts Ash first
17:06:23 <sbp> agreed, and I also think that you were a bit understated about the shitiness of your network
17:07:13 <sbp> .gc shitiness
17:07:16 <sbp> .gc shittiness
17:07:17 <xena> shittiness: 3,430
17:07:18 <xena> shitiness: 239
17:07:25 <sbp> ...
17:07:45 <sbp> * sbp checks the logs to see if they were really returned out of order
17:08:01 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
17:08:11 <sbp> welcome back. you missed: <sbp> agreed, and I also think that you were a bit understated about the shitiness of your network
17:08:17 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
17:08:22 <sbp> th... heh
17:08:48 <Ash> hi
17:09:00 <sbp> hey Ash. what's ne... er, how are you?
17:09:05 <Ash> i am ok
17:09:09 <Ash> allergies bugging me
17:09:12 <Ash> but otherwise ok
17:09:13 <sbp> be better than okay
17:09:16 <Ash> how about yourself
17:09:23 <sbp> oh, I see. don't you have any medication for that which you can take?
17:09:24 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
17:09:29 <Ash> yes
17:09:31 <Ash> i took it
17:09:31 <sbp> not great, but not really bad either
17:09:33 <Ash> it's helping a little.
17:09:38 <sbp> and you're st... ah, good
17:09:44 <sbp> are you back properly now, Jim?
17:10:00 <sbp> Ash: what kind of pollen are you allergic to?
17:10:02 <JibberJim> ARGHSHSSHSHSSHSHS
17:10:04 <JibberJim> who knows, this is normally a good network...
17:10:18 <Ash> sbp: i'm allergic to the pollen from almost all fruit trees
17:10:19 <JibberJim> this network is shite.
17:10:21 <sbp> it seems a bit early in the year for allergies, though I think that Jill mentioned one the other day...
17:10:24 <Ash> and there are a lot of fruit trees here
17:10:29 <sbp> you missed: <sbp> welcome back. you missed: <sbp> agreed, and I also think that you were a bit understated about the shitiness of your network
17:10:31 <JibberJim> * JibberJim is allergic to horse chestnut pollen
17:10:33 <Ash> maybe it's a bit early in the UK
17:10:36 <Ash> but
17:10:36 <JibberJim> Nah, I saw that!
17:10:42 <Ash> here, everything is blooming
17:10:52 <sbp> Horse Chestnut pollen? ouch. must be difficult collecting conkers
17:10:53 <JibberJim> fruit trees are in blossom here.
17:11:07 <sbp> yeah, they are--it's just a rather early kind of pollen
17:11:09 <JibberJim> no sbp, you see the thing about conkers is there not on the tree the same time as the pollen...
17:11:32 <JibberJim> it's kind of like a chicken and egg question...
17:11:32 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
17:11:33 <sbp> oh, that's pretty useful. but maybe they should be--then the trees could fend away at least a few people
17:11:45 <sbp> what came first, the jibber or the jim?
17:11:53 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
17:11:53 <Monty> hi JibberJim, how ya doing?
17:12:08 <sbp> there's really hardly any point in talking to you today
17:12:12 <sbp> both of you, really
17:12:27 <sbp> Ash is too busy working and sneezing, and Jim is too busy dropping off of the network
17:12:49 <JibberJim> hmm, ping's out fine great response time, then drops 3 pings, and I'm kicked off.
17:12:54 <sbp> either of you got anything interesting going on at work today? are either of you even at work? it's a glorious spring day here
17:13:01 <JibberJim> * JibberJim is working.
17:13:10 <JibberJim> * JibberJim has way too much stuff to do, it's depressing.
17:13:22 <sbp> JavaScripting the world together
17:13:24 <JibberJim> I also need a task tracker app, anyone know of one?
17:13:40 <sbp> no. I just use text files
17:13:41 <JibberJim> Javascript - it's a generic...
17:14:01 <JibberJim> I need one!
17:14:02 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
17:14:03 <sbp> though I did write a little script that takes a random line from a file...
17:14:16 <libby> *** libby (~libby@adsl164-249.dsl.uva.nl) has joined #swhack
17:14:16 <sbp> ASH. what are you doing?
17:14:20 <sbp> hey libby
17:14:40 <libby> hia sbp
17:14:41 <Ash> sbp, i'm looking up information on writing plugins for Evolution
17:14:46 <sbp> if you sit back and watch for a bit, you'll see Jim coming in and out whilst randomly swearing
17:14:54 <Ash> and snagging the latest source for iFolder to see if I can build it on my machine here
17:15:01 <libby> * libby pleased the ams hotel still has free wireless :)
17:15:07 <sbp> aha. though you were up to something. but I guess that means that you're at home, then?
17:15:19 <Ash> yes
17:15:20 <sbp> free wireless: cool! is XML Europe over now? just starting?
17:15:25 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
17:15:33 <Ash> car died yesterday
17:15:33 <Ash> heh
17:15:34 <sbp> * sbp times Jim
17:15:38 <libby> starts mon
17:15:48 <sbp> you're there a bit early, aren't you?
17:15:59 <sbp> Ash: lucky that it didn't go before you had to pick your family up... that'd've sucked
17:16:13 <Ash> yes
17:16:17 <libby> we were going to be at a workshop tomorrow, got cancelled
17:16:21 <JibberJim> the client doesn't realise I've been kicked off until I type, it's crap!
17:16:22 <Ash> and it only conked out about 5 blocks away from hoem
17:16:24 <Ash> home
17:16:29 <sbp> or *during* because that'd've been even worse
17:16:51 <sbp> Jim: that's why I have #sbp!
17:16:56 <JibberJim> I need a tool that exists on my webserver, and on my local machines and stops me opening Spider Solitaire if I have tasks outstanding.
17:17:06 <libby> heh
17:17:14 <sbp> libby: oh, I see. at least you get to wander around AMS though (I hope)
17:17:26 <JibberJim> or sit in the hotel and geek on the free wifi
17:17:31 <libby> yeah. lovely. great weather today too
17:17:33 <sbp> just rm -rf it for the time being, surely?
17:17:35 <libby> both :)
17:17:38 <sbp> hehe
17:17:38 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
17:17:43 <sbp> there he goes!
17:17:49 <thelsdj> blurg
17:18:11 <sbp> he was in for 2' 13"
17:18:12 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
17:18:24 <sbp> welcome back, jim. you were in for 2 minutes 13 seconds last time
17:18:36 <sbp> now try to *break* that record. I think you can go for at least 3 minutes
17:18:40 <sbp> what's up thelsdj?
17:18:59 <thelsdj> i'm not sure, the sky possibly?
17:19:13 <sbp> ah, one of the many things that is up but doesn't come down
17:19:20 <JibberJim> I wonder if it's regular...
17:19:27 <sbp> really I was wondering what's behind your "blurg", though
17:19:31 <sbp> we'll soon see...
17:19:48 <JibberJim> rats, I don't know the ADSL modem password
17:20:15 <sbp> can't you guess it?
17:20:24 <sbp> networklikeamofo, perhaps
17:20:37 <thelsdj> blurg had to do with the general state of the universe
17:20:38 <JibberJim> I could, but I need to guess the username too, that's too much effort
17:20:48 <sbp> thelsdj: ah
17:20:50 <JibberJim> am I gone?
17:20:52 <sbp> JibberJim: ah
17:20:57 <sbp> no, you're still here
17:21:05 <JibberJim> usenet died that time
17:21:21 <sbp> it's kicking off random protocols? strange...
17:21:34 <sbp> random ports, more likely
17:21:48 <JibberJim> hmm, it seems local...
17:22:11 <sbp> check the back of your box. if there is a young man fiddling with your wires, tell him to stop
17:22:14 <JibberJim> I can't keep a reliable connection to those too.
17:22:59 <sbp> "those"? the other boxen in your network, you mean?
17:23:05 <JibberJim> yeah sorry.
17:23:16 <sbp> can't you switch to another box?
17:23:44 <JibberJim> no, it's all laptops here (and they're not here) other than inside the rack, which is locked.
17:24:01 <JibberJim> okay, something is pretty f'in screwy then!
17:24:02 <sbp> you've been on a lot longer this time. over three minutes
17:24:15 <sbp> (I knew you could do it)
17:24:50 <thelsdj> i want a tshirt that says 'don't mind the balrogs'
17:25:27 <thelsdj> er i mean 'never mind the balrogs'
17:25:34 <sbp> or a gate sign that says BEWARE OF THE BALROG
17:26:50 <JibberJim> yeah I can see it from jibbering fine, but not from here!
17:26:51 <thelsdj> hehe even google knows about 'never mind the balrogs'
17:27:04 <sbp> .g "never mind the balrogs"
17:27:20 <sbp> just do all your proxying through jibbering, perhaps?
17:27:24 <sbp> .google "never mind the balrogs"
17:27:25 <xena> "never mind the balrogs": http://www.d-generation.ca/archives/000016.html
17:27:43 <thelsdj> http://www.enjolrasworld.com/Jess%20Nevins/Smax/Notes%20to%20Smax%203_copy(1).html is another good one
17:29:40 <thelsdj> smax is a work of genius
17:29:40 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
17:29:48 <sbp> how many do you have?
17:29:49 <thelsdj> bye bye jim
17:30:03 <sbp> in, out, in, out, jibber it all about
17:30:10 <thelsdj> i have all 5 downloaded heh
17:30:26 <sbp> downloaded? wait, it's a comic, no? scans of it?
17:30:33 <thelsdj> ya
17:30:47 <sbp> ooh. how big is #3? can you bung it online?
17:31:10 <thelsdj> i'll stick it on my linode heh
17:31:18 <sbp> thanks!
17:31:49 <sbp> .gc "coito ergo cum"
17:31:50 <xena> "coito ergo cum": 22
17:31:58 <sbp> all the best jokes have been taken
17:32:22 <sbp> heh, I was just about to suggest that we'll have to start in other languages, but...
17:33:15 <thelsdj> i've been collecting alan moore comics, he's just so freakin amazing its hard to believe he really exists
17:33:22 <sbp> heh, heh
17:33:52 <kandinski> *** kandinski (~kandinski@80-26-155-221.adsl.nuria.telefonica-data.net) has joined #swhack
17:33:54 <libby> *** libby has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
17:34:11 <sbp> hi kandinski!
17:35:04 <thelsdj> 10 minutes till smax 3 is up
17:35:06 <sbp> kandinski = SoberPerson()
17:35:15 <sbp> kandinski.nickname = "kandinski"
17:35:19 <sbp> kandinski.talk()
17:35:25 <sbp> thelsdj: good grief, how big is it?
17:35:28 <kandinski> hello world
17:35:42 <thelsdj> 11 megs, i can only upload at like 15kps right now heh
17:35:59 <sbp> wow, I think I just wrote a hello world program without realising it
17:36:04 <sbp> oh, that's not bad
17:36:27 <kandinski> better than that
17:36:46 <sbp> better than what? wait. what's better than what?
17:37:11 <kandinski> better than a hello world program
17:37:31 <kandinski> are you sure you are not an Elizabot with the sbp personality module, yourself?
17:37:57 <sbp> why are you sure that I'm not are you Elizabot with and sbp personality module myself?
17:38:12 <thelsdj> hmm what to read, what to read
17:38:22 <sbp> how does what to read make you feel?
17:42:17 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
17:43:25 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
17:45:30 <kandinski> For the record, Shade the Changing Man is a revealing look at american weirdian conspiranoia from the perspective of yet another british comic-book writer, and one of the few collections that I bought while I was a comic-book store guy
17:46:31 <kandinski> The other collections were Grant Morrison's Doom Patrol (X-men parody supergroup against all manner of crazy situationist dada supervillians)
17:46:54 <thelsdj> haha
17:46:55 <kandinski> and Hellblazer (freelance investigator of the occult against -- all odds?)
17:47:58 <thelsdj> grr where did my backup cds go
17:48:07 <kandinski> the Vertigo imprint of DC Comics was, in the very late 80's - early to mid 90's, a veritable hotbed of creativity, and ushered in a renovation of the comic-book genres
17:48:19 <kandinski> Sandman was also good, very good.
17:48:43 <kandinski> Some day I will buy the Sandman comics, I only have the Death miniseries for some reason
17:48:43 <sbp> heh: "Madelyn Boudreaux compiled annotations for V for Vendetta for a '94 graduate class she took in Literary Research."
17:49:22 <sbp> is Gaiman the new Shakespeare or something?
17:50:16 <thelsdj> i have a hard time these days deciding wether its gaiman or moore
17:50:36 <sbp> Gaiman is good, but given what people are saying about him you'd think he was some kind of superlegend
17:50:45 <sbp> he is just good
17:50:59 <thelsdj> moore is 'moore' than good though hehe
17:51:05 <sbp> hold back your fluids
17:51:11 <sbp> heh, oh man...
17:51:14 <thelsdj> ah found my backups
17:52:13 <thelsdj> at one time i had dr strange v1 but can't find it anymore
17:52:26 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
17:52:31 <sbp> try under your bed
17:52:42 <sbp> oh, is Smax#3 done yet?
17:52:49 <thelsdj> haah no i think it might be at my dads house as i got the dr strange stuff for him
17:52:53 <thelsdj> ya probably lemme check
17:52:59 <sbp> (welcome back Jim, just in case you stay on long enough to read this)
17:53:01 <sbp> ta
17:54:26 <JibberJim> NAH!
17:54:57 <sbp> ooh, this one has got to be original:
17:55:09 <sbp> .gc "all your Soviet Russia are belong to base"
17:55:10 <xena> no results found.
17:55:12 <sbp> whoo!
17:55:20 <thelsdj> ugh got a few megs to go as the scp stalled, decided to resume with plain ol ftp
17:55:35 <sbp> thanks
17:56:15 <kandinski> Well, the fact that at the time I bought Doom Patrol (Morrison), Shade (Milligan) and Hellblazer (Delano, Ennis, Ellis, Morrison, Gaiman) but not Sandman (Gaiman) should tell you that I basically agree with yous. I do own a first edition paperback of Mostly Harmless, however. DNA is thicker than blood. And one question: since you don't agree with the "Gaiman is the next Shakespeare" chestnut, what do you make of the "Ala
17:56:16 <kandinski> n Moore is the new Joyce" one?
17:56:35 <kandinski> I hate line lenght limits on IRC
17:56:44 <kandinski> * kandinski shoots the sheriff
17:56:51 <kandinski> but I don't shoot the deputy
17:57:02 <thelsdj> i think alan moore is the new alan moore everytime he comes out with something!
17:57:04 <thelsdj> haha
17:57:08 <sbp> that's good. DNA sci-fi supremacy is inarguable with
17:57:27 <kandinski> thelsdj, hah
17:57:33 <kandinski> have you read Top 10?
17:57:38 <thelsdj> ya
17:57:44 <thelsdj> just read top 10 and smax in the past week
17:57:49 <kandinski> most loveliest of meta-self-hommage to comicbookhood
17:58:02 <thelsdj> have you read smax?
17:58:23 <kandinski> I spent a long time without buying comics because I had no money, but my friend Lorenzo is now letting me borrow all the stuff I missed
17:58:28 <kandinski> no, not read smax yet
17:58:42 <kandinski> but I've been told it's quite good
17:59:26 <thelsdj> arg smax003 upload restarted itself :\
17:59:31 <thelsdj> hehe
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18:00:12 <kandinski> Hellblazer is the mostest completest series ever, look at the all stars in the writer roster
18:00:25 <kandinski> and I forgot that it was Moore who created John Constantine
18:00:39 <thelsdj> really? heh i didn't know that
18:00:51 <kandinski> yes, he was a side character in Swamp Man
18:01:00 <thelsdj> ah
18:01:07 <thelsdj> been meaning to read moore's run on swamp thing
18:01:50 <kandinski> I didn't like it as much as I thought I would
18:02:06 <kandinski> but the character retconning and the plot angles are unparalelled
18:02:14 <kandinski> hehe, he said retconning, hehe
18:02:29 <sbp> .gc retcon
18:02:30 <xena> retcon: 9,340
18:02:31 <sbp> .gc retconning
18:02:32 <xena> retconning: 925
18:02:37 <sbp> I think we're propogating that word
18:03:09 <kandinski> this friend of mine Lorenzo can wax lyrical about Moore's Swamp Thing for hours
18:03:22 <thelsdj> haha
18:03:31 <kandinski> we might be propagating "propogating" as well
18:03:40 <sbp> well bugger
18:03:42 <thelsdj> i just got around to reading his 'whatever happened to the man of tomorrow'
18:03:46 <kandinski> .gc propogating
18:03:46 <xena> propogating: 15,500
18:03:55 <kandinski> well, add one to that
18:04:02 <kandinski> or rather, add three
18:04:05 <sbp> (and thanks!)
18:04:09 <kandinski> .gc propagating
18:04:10 <xena> propagating: 590,000
18:04:58 <thelsdj> i still need to read watchmen, started it but only got like 2 issues into it
18:06:39 <kandinski> ah, Watchmen is indoubtedly GOOD
18:06:45 <kandinski> so cleverly contrived
18:06:46 <sbp> undoubtedly
18:07:04 <kandinski> you guys read "Life A Users Manual" by Georges Perec?
18:07:23 <kandinski> seen "Drowning By Numbers", by Peter Greenaway?
18:07:32 <kandinski> or Memento?
18:07:48 <sbp> nope
18:07:59 <kandinski> those works of art where everything has been crafted as by a master watchmaker, and EVERYTHING FUCKING FITS?
18:07:59 <sbp> wasn't Memento a film? :-)
18:08:00 <thelsdj> i've seen memento
18:08:12 <kandinski> yes, Memento was a film, Drowning too
18:08:13 <thelsdj> yes
18:08:19 <thelsdj> you see his second line where he said 'seen'?
18:08:22 <thelsdj> heh
18:08:23 <sbp> oh, missed that
18:08:24 <kandinski> Watchmen is like that
18:08:56 <sbp> * sbp gets ever more anticipent from smax
18:08:59 <sbp> ...for
18:09:05 <sbp> man, I can't type for shit today!
18:09:08 <thelsdj> my favorite moore title so far has been Promethea
18:09:18 <kandinski> sbp, are you very tired?
18:09:24 <kandinski> incredibly knackered?
18:09:31 <sbp> not enough to use it as an excuse, unfortunately
18:09:32 <kandinski> do you need to get some sleep?
18:09:45 <kandinski> s/anticipent/anticipant/?
18:09:51 <thelsdj> sbp: maybe just grab this? http://66.90.75.92/torrents/1525/Smax.torrent
18:09:57 <sbp> .gc anticipent
18:09:58 <xena> anticipent: 17,300
18:10:01 <sbp> .gc anticipant
18:10:02 <xena> anticipant: 31,300
18:10:06 <kandinski> unless you wanted to mean anticipatittudinous
18:10:08 <sbp> hmm. too close to call, that one
18:10:23 <sbp> I'd say both are accepted, -pant favoured
18:10:24 <thelsdj> kandinski: http://66.90.75.92/torrents/1571/transmetropolitian(1).torrent
18:10:33 <sbp> thelsdj: hmm. I'd rather HTTP
18:10:44 <thelsdj> ya its still uploadin for ya
18:10:48 <kandinski> well, that only means the schwa misleads native speakers a little bot
18:10:52 <sbp> thanks...
18:10:53 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
18:11:14 <sbp> right. I was saying to deltab a while ago that we need a character for it
18:11:19 <sbp> y kinda works
18:11:31 <kandinski> I don't know if I have enough space
18:11:34 <sbp> yr, kynda wyrks
18:11:38 <kandinski> sbp, there is a character for the schwa
18:11:47 <sbp> not in the English alphabet there isn't
18:11:48 <thelsdj> smax is only 54m
18:11:59 <thelsdj> transmet is 565m
18:12:01 <sbp> phonetic alphabet, sure. inverted e
18:12:06 <kandinski> I don't have a Unicode keyboard, but I have UTF-8 in my machine
18:12:13 <kandinski> yes, I knew you knew
18:12:23 <kandinski> I canoe you canoe that
18:12:24 <sbp> and I quasi-knew that you knew that I knew!
18:12:27 <sbp> let's codepoint it
18:12:36 <kandinski> ah, let's learn something new
18:12:37 <JibberJim> This is crap...
18:12:38 <sbp> $ codepoint schwa
18:12:38 <sbp> 018F: LATIN CAPITAL LETTER SCHWA
18:12:38 <sbp> 0259: LATIN SMALL LETTER SCHWA
18:12:39 <JibberJim> okay, do people think I should just quit my contract leave the people up the swanny, offer to work remotely on 3 day weeks, or try and find a replacement (of which I only know a few of in the country)
18:12:57 <sbp> hmm
18:13:00 <kandinski> sbp, how do you codepoint the schwa?
18:13:03 <sbp> have they been nice to you and so forth?
18:13:15 <sbp> sploge: grep UnicodeData
18:13:21 <sbp> splodge: grep UnicodeData
18:13:30 <splodge> I'm logging. I found 8 answers for 'UnicodeData' (showing 0...4)
18:13:31 <splodge> 0) 2004-04-17 18:13:21 <sbp> splodge: grep UnicodeData
18:13:32 <splodge> 1) 2004-04-17 18:13:15 <sbp> sploge: grep UnicodeData
18:13:33 <splodge> 2) 2004-04-15 11:26:10 <datum> UnicodeData.txt: http://www.unicode.org/Public/UNIDATA/UnicodeData.txt
18:13:34 <splodge> 3) 2004-04-15 11:26:08 <sbp> .g UnicodeData.txt
18:13:35 <splodge> 4) 2004-04-15 11:26:03 <sbp> grep -i "$@" ~/UnicodeData.txt \
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18:14:10 <sbp> kandinski: see http://notabug.com/swhack/chatlogs/2004-04-15.html#T11-24-16
18:14:12 <supybot> Title: IRC log of swhack on 2004-04-15 (at notabug.com)
18:14:25 <sbp> it's got the source and data file required
18:14:29 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
18:14:37 <sbp> just a really small bash script and standard UnicodeData.txt
18:14:55 <sbp> welcome back, jim. so, have they been kind? if so, try option two. else, option one, I reckon
18:15:18 <xover> *** xover (~link@thumper.tj.unn.no) has joined #swhack
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18:16:07 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
18:17:04 <sbp> welcome back, xover!
18:17:04 <xover> *** xover has left #swhack
18:17:08 <sbp> ...
18:17:20 <kandinski> bye, xover!
18:17:24 <kandinski> that was quick
18:17:27 <sbp> yeah!
18:17:30 <thelsdj> 73% of smax3
18:17:34 <sbp> oooh
18:17:43 <sbp> I'm ever more anticip[ae]nt
18:17:43 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
18:17:44 <deltab> need a character for what?
18:17:48 <kandinski> * kandinski goes learn how to use bittorrent from the CLI
18:17:53 <sbp> the schwa--obscure vowel
18:18:11 <deltab> schwa is a character, isn't it?
18:18:12 <thelsdj> kandinski: btdownloadcurses.py <url>
18:18:15 <kandinski> although what I would like is to be able to use from KDE as if I were a first-class citizen of the point-and-click word
18:18:23 <sbp> need a character in the English alphabet
18:18:26 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
18:18:40 <thelsdj> kandinski: btdownloadgui.py <url> heheheh
18:18:46 <sbp> hehe
18:18:55 <sbp> @*.py++
18:19:13 <kandinski> url means I use the torrent file without downloading, but I would rather save it to disk first, I guess
18:19:24 <kandinski> sbp, @*.py++?
18:19:35 <kandinski> does that mean you like anything made in python?
18:19:53 <sbp> I don't like the schwa for the obscure vowel in any case. if you try replacing all obscrube vowels in a common sentence with it, it looks rather odd. there must be a nicer fit
18:19:57 <sbp> yep
18:20:39 <kandinski> and the @ would mean?
18:20:46 <JibberJim> <JibberJim> <JibberJim> not option 3, I might be able to get a nice but poor javascript guy a decent wage?
18:20:48 <JibberJim> <JibberJim> <JibberJim> and leave the product in a good state.
18:20:50 <JibberJim> why doesn't that appear in the logs?
18:20:52 <JibberJim> MOO!
18:20:54 <JibberJim> I can't talk!
18:20:58 <JibberJim> HELP!!!!
18:21:06 <kandinski> hi Jim
18:21:12 <kandinski> how can I help you?
18:21:23 <JibberJim> <JibberJim> <JibberJim> <JibberJim> not option 3, I might be able to get a nice but poor javascript guy a decent wage?
18:21:23 <JibberJim> <JibberJim> <JibberJim> <JibberJim> and leave the product in a good state.
18:21:31 <JibberJim> Why doesn't that ever appear in the logs?
18:21:31 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
18:21:53 <sbp> (.*)\.py > $1.(\w(?<!p)\w|\w(?!y)\w)... or something. perhaps I am tired
18:21:57 <sbp> and poor jim
18:22:04 <sbp> kandinski: the @ is supybot's command prefix
18:22:09 <sbp> it's keeping track of karma in here
18:23:03 <sbp> I guess ((?!py)\w\w) would be better
18:23:13 <sbp> i.e. work and be legible
18:23:15 <kandinski> sbp, what is that?
18:23:26 <sbp> and two \w characters except for py
18:23:30 <sbp> argh. any
18:23:34 <kandinski> can you spell it out for the regexp impaired?
18:23:54 <sbp> (?!py) means "not followed by 'py'"
18:24:10 <sbp> \w varies on the locale, but is generally a "word character"
18:24:19 <sbp> stuff you'd be likely to find in a suffix
18:24:47 <deltab> sbp: that just forces a match elsewhere
18:24:47 <kandinski> piotr had the o'reilly regexp book
18:24:50 <kandinski> I took it to bed
18:25:01 <kandinski> fell asleep in under thirty seconds
18:25:07 <sbp> oh man. can you do what I'm trying to achieve, deltab?
18:25:29 <deltab> not really
18:25:40 <sbp> I fail to believe that
18:26:09 <deltab> not in a simple regex
18:26:41 <deltab> notice how where regexes are used there's usually a (separate) way to invert
18:26:55 <kandinski> * kandinski "listens" raptly
18:27:04 <sbp> that's a point
18:27:09 <kandinski> * kandinski eggs deltab on: "go go go"
18:27:23 <sbp> oh!
18:27:23 <deltab> grep's -v, vi's :v, etc.
18:27:41 <sbp> how about [^\Wp]y|p[^\Wy]?
18:27:48 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
18:28:21 <deltab> \W meaning what?
18:28:32 <sbp> er. [^\Wp][^\Wy] rather. any non-word character
18:28:43 <sbp> opposite of \w. [^\w] == \W
18:29:18 <deltab> * deltab gets tangled up in the double negatives
18:29:35 <xover> *** xover (~link@dns0.tj.unn.no) has joined #swhack
18:29:39 <sbp> hmm. no, the above still doesn't work. third time... [^\Wp]\w|\w[^\Wy]
18:30:07 <sbp> me too. so basically, [^\Wp] would be (\w - p)
18:30:16 <sbp> and [^\Wy] would be (\w - y)
18:30:20 <JibberJim> It means you shoudl Slash george W bush.
18:30:32 <sbp> so [^\Wp]\w|\w[^\Wy] is (\w - p)\w OR \w(\w - y)
18:30:34 <deltab> okay
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18:30:51 <sbp> which appears to be what I wanted. yay
18:31:13 <sbp> welcome back again, xover!
18:31:47 <deltab> sbp: what are you trying to match, again?
18:32:35 <xover> *** xover has quit (Client Quit)
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18:33:08 <sbp> everything other than py
18:33:16 <sbp> that is, \w\w except for py
18:33:17 <sbp> >>> for test in ('nm', 'pq', 'py', 'qy'):
18:33:17 <sbp> print test, re.compile(r'[^\Wp]\w|\w[^\Wy]').match(test)
18:33:17 <sbp>
18:33:17 <sbp> nm <_sre.SRE_Match object at 0x00654410>
18:33:17 <sbp> pq <_sre.SRE_Match object at 0x00654410>
18:33:19 <sbp> py None
18:33:21 <sbp> qy <_sre.SRE_Match object at 0x00654410>
18:33:23 <sbp> >>>
18:33:38 <sbp> that's quite nifty, really
18:33:41 <deltab> sbp: what about shorter and longer strings?
18:33:58 <sbp> oh crap, I hadn't thought about that. you're right
18:34:12 <sbp> so that's just r'[^\Wp]\w|\w[^\Wy]|\w{3,}'
18:34:24 <deltab> is it?
18:34:30 <sbp> oh, rather: r'\w|[^\Wp]\w|\w[^\Wy]|\w{3,}'
18:34:40 <kandinski> * kandinski watches it all swoosh over his head
18:34:55 <deltab> sbp: I suspect that's not all
18:35:03 <sbp> really? what's it lacking?
18:35:21 <deltab> sbp: does it work how you want with longer strings?
18:35:44 <sbp> sure. I don't mind it matching "pyw" or "pyn" etc.
18:35:56 <sbp> any extension except for .py is what I'm going for
18:36:23 <sbp> (okay, pyc and pyw are Python extensions too, and pyo probably can be counted as one, but we'll ignore those)
18:36:51 <xover> *** xover has quit (Client Quit)
18:36:52 <sbp> \w{3,} is equivalent to \w\w\w+, no?
18:36:59 <xover> *** xover (~xover@dns0.tj.unn.no) has joined #swhack
18:37:00 <deltab> yes
18:37:19 <sbp> seems okay then... am I missing anything?
18:37:30 <deltab> I can't tell
18:38:07 <sbp> I'm just saying that any python file (*.py) is better than the equivalently named but differently extensioned file
18:38:40 <deltab> I'd use some sort of external negation for that :-)
18:38:51 <sbp> hence: (.*?)\.py > $1\.(\w|[^\Wp]\w|\w[^\Wy]|\w{3,})
18:38:58 <sbp> heh
18:39:02 <deltab> py > regex
18:39:08 <sbp> chuckle
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18:40:12 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim has quit (Remote closed the connection)
18:40:12 <sbp> how would you assert that in Python, though?
18:40:25 <deltab> face it, regex doesn't allow you to say some things nicely
18:40:32 <sbp> I think my pseudocode is pretty good. it's got universal quantification built in
18:40:44 <sbp> perl5 regexp doesn't. I'll bet it's easy in perl6!
18:40:49 <sbp> * sbp grins
18:41:44 <deltab> you're trying to use an existential operation to get a universal result
18:41:49 <deltab> or something
18:42:21 <deltab> I'm not sure even perl 6 can help with that
18:42:23 <sbp> { ?fn str:endsWith ".py"; :basename ?base } => { ?fn :greaterThan [ :basename ?base; :ext [ :complementOf ".py" ] ] }?
18:44:07 <xower> *** xower has quit (Remote closed the connection)
18:44:53 <sbp> apparently English > regexpinous pseudocode > N3 > python for this
18:45:22 <sbp> I still think perl6 has a chance of beating regexpinous pseudocode, if not English. I kid, of course
18:47:37 <deltab> heh, surprising headline: http://www.wired.com/news/culture/0,1284,10465,00.html
18:47:39 <supybot> Title: Wired News: Aliens Land on AOL (at www.wired.com)
18:47:49 <sbp> great. didn't even have to download it
18:48:09 <deltab> though I first misread it as "Weird news"
18:48:46 <sbp> heh
18:49:01 <sbp> you were looking for something to do with "schwa"?
18:49:15 <thelsdj> sbp: tell me what kinda speed you get from that server
18:49:31 <deltab> yeah
18:49:51 <thelsdj> hehe
18:50:45 <sbp> deltab: I'm pretty certain that schwa has never been a character in the English alphabet :-)
18:50:50 <thelsdj> http://jathey.home.comcast.net/comical-0.4.tar.gz is a linux comic book reader, though it depends on exteral 'unrar' binary
18:51:03 <sbp> in fact, AFAIK there have only been 29 characters in the English alphabet
18:51:29 <sbp> deltab: try 'n' name the non-obvious three
18:51:32 <Ash> stab
18:51:39 <sbp> or more that I don't know of, if you do
18:51:47 <sbp> hmm
18:51:47 <deltab> thorn
18:51:53 <sbp> might get that after anyway
18:52:00 <sbp> thorn--that's one, yep
18:52:06 <Ash> STABINATED
18:52:13 <deltab> I've seen ampersand in one nursery rhyme book
18:52:14 <sbp> DESTABINATED
18:52:39 <sbp> that's a ligature, not an alphabetical character. you can't count fi or fl either!
18:53:41 <deltab> I take it you're not counting long s
18:53:44 <sbp> I'll save you Googling. the others that I know about are eth (okay, I cheated a bit) and wynn
18:53:48 <sbp> nope
18:54:01 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-147.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
18:54:01 <sbp> oh, actually, I guess there's another: minuscule i
18:54:19 <sbp> 'twas used for the first person singular pronoun in Middle English
18:54:21 <deltab> yeah, I thought of eth but couldn't remember its name
18:54:25 <sbp> so that's 30 characters. any more?
18:54:39 <JibberJim> A
18:54:41 <JibberJim> B
18:54:43 <sbp> (wynn took the place of w)
18:54:43 <JibberJim> C
18:54:45 <JibberJim> D
18:54:48 <JibberJim> there's 4
18:54:48 <sbp> no, no, we know about those
18:54:58 <sbp> they're included in the 30 we know about
18:54:58 <thelsdj> hahah
18:55:00 <deltab> were j and u in use then?
18:55:09 <sbp> they weren't, no
18:55:15 <sbp> er, u was. v wasn't
18:55:24 <JibberJim> oh right, have you got X, that's often missed/
18:55:32 <sbp> yep, even X!
18:55:38 <JibberJim> I'm no use thenm
18:55:46 <kandinski> ah, great news, job offer for a wee class at Cuenca Art School
18:55:50 <JibberJim> J, that's another one!
18:56:34 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim has quit (Client Quit)
18:57:00 <sbp> deltab: 'The letter "j" was first distinguised from "i" in the middle of the 16th century by the philosopher Pierre de la Ramée. In fact, a long "i" was used by the Romans, and an "i" with a long tail was often used by writers in the middle ages.' - http://miscoranda.com/30
18:57:02 <supybot> Title: miscoranda: I Into J, Analogue into Digital (at miscoranda.com)
18:57:08 <sbp> must tell jim that you already spotted j, too
18:57:36 <sbp> kandinski: congratulations!
18:57:39 <sbp> are you going to take it up?
18:57:46 <kandinski> yes, definitely
18:58:12 <kandinski> it is a six-hour seminar about net.art and game.art and stuff
18:58:30 <kandinski> but with a view to better/bigger things
18:58:56 <kandinski> * kandinski does a little dance
19:00:00 <kandinski> this is funny, I just typed a thorn by mistake and deleted it before I realised
19:00:06 <kandinski> but now I can't reproduce the event
19:00:23 <kandinski> KDE can type thorns, guys, which is not so strange since trolltech is norwegian
19:00:24 <sbp> Þ
19:00:35 <deltab> what OS are you using?
19:00:38 <sbp> so can Windows. it's not all that elite
19:00:39 <deltab> ah
19:00:41 <kandinski> did you codepoint it?
19:00:47 <kandinski> no, I wasn't being elite
19:00:50 <sbp> nope. Alt+0222
19:00:55 <deltab> that's not a KDE-specific thing, afaik
19:00:55 <kandinski> I was amazed that it could be done
19:01:06 <kandinski> but I typed it
19:01:12 <kandinski> not encoded it
19:01:13 <sbp> heh. if I do Alt+022, it pastes in from my clipboard
19:01:14 <deltab> þ
19:01:19 <kandinski> if you know what I mean
19:01:22 <xover> The use for the Thorn in Norwegian is... Well, "isn't" actually. :-)
19:01:29 <deltab> that's alt-gr+p for me
19:01:47 <kandinski> «»¢“nµ~łjĸŋŋßæ@ł€¶ŧ←↓→øþþþþþ
19:01:50 <kandinski> yes, altgr p
19:02:00 <kandinski> it is part of latin1 probably
19:02:03 <sbp> what's U+0016?
19:02:20 <deltab> a control char
19:02:24 <kandinski> what about eth and wynn?
19:02:24 <sbp> what does it do?
19:02:32 <sbp> we've got eth and wynn
19:02:34 <kandinski> I press the wynn key but nothing happens
19:02:36 <sbp> oh, you're askign what they are?
19:02:38 <sbp> heh
19:02:39 <kandinski> * kandinski ducks
19:02:40 <deltab> I don't recognise it
19:02:42 <sbp> wynn isn't widely supported
19:02:44 <Ash> quack
19:03:00 <sbp> me neither. but that's the character that seems to be pasting from clipboard for me
19:03:04 <deltab> ah, SYN
19:03:11 <sbp> * sbp throws some duck food to Ash
19:03:15 <deltab> synchronous idle
19:03:18 <sbp> hmm. should that be pasting from clipboard? :-)
19:03:42 <deltab> probably not
19:04:05 <sbp> oh, there's another I missed! yogh
19:04:13 <kandinski> sbp, I was asking how to produce them
19:04:37 <sbp> should've remembered that. I was spending ages trying to work out how best to represent a yogh in HTML
19:04:46 <deltab> U+0016 is ctrl-v
19:04:53 <sbp> "Yogh is a letter used in Middle English, representing y (SAMPA /j/) and various velar phonemes." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yogh
19:04:54 <sbp> aha
19:05:09 <sbp> hence Alt+022
19:05:11 <kandinski> @ł€¶ŧ←↓→←↓→øþ[æßðææßðđŋħjĸł~€{}|«|||»«»«»¢“”nµ·
19:05:12 <supybot> kandinski: Error: Missing "]". You may want to quote your arguments with double quotes in order to prevent extra brackets from being evaluated as nested commands.
19:05:14 <kandinski> wow
19:05:22 <sbp> kandinski: the codes for wynn, yogh, and eth are...
19:05:30 <deltab> sbp: also a principal ingredient of yoghurt
19:05:39 <sbp> hahaha
19:05:53 <kandinski> yhoghourth (hommage to the 'zilla)
19:06:18 <deltab> pardon?
19:06:36 <sbp> 01BF: LATIN LETTER WYNN; 021C: LATIN CAPITAL LETTER YOGH; 00D0: LATIN CAPITAL LETTER ETH
19:07:40 <kandinski> deltab, grep the logs for "ophthalmologist"
19:07:47 <kandinski> also for "orgasms"
19:07:52 <kandinski> and read between the lines
19:07:54 <kandinski> literally
19:08:07 <kandinski> "hehe", he said "literally" literally
19:08:10 <sbp> phthality but the phthul
19:08:26 <sbp> er, by
19:09:27 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim (JimLey@dsl-217-155-144-135.zen.co.uk) has joined #swhack
19:09:52 <JibberJim> it seemed to be better then, might stick around this time.
19:10:17 <deltab> kandinski: can't find it
19:10:19 <sbp> I'm somewhat cynical
19:10:36 <sbp> .google phth orgasm
19:10:57 <xover> .g "Weird Sexual Fetish"
19:11:14 <sbp> @google phth orgasm
19:11:18 <supybot> sbp: Search took 0.16596 seconds: Hawes Publications Funny Items from the Internet: <http://www.hawes.com/humor.htm>
19:11:36 <xover> @google "Weird Sexual Fetish"
19:11:38 <supybot> xover: Search took 0.270471 seconds: Agony Advice: I Have Weird Sexual Dreams: <http://magazines.ivillage.com/cosmopolitan/experts/agony/qas/0,12750,412835_286210,00.html>; Elon Pendulum: <http://www.elon.edu/pendulum/Issues/2003/110603/A&E/In%20the%20Cut.html>; Congenital Adrenal Hyperplasia dot Com: (1 more message)
19:11:42 <xena> phth orgasm: http://www.cheapthrills.ca/catalog/NU_MUSIC.TXT
19:12:03 <sbp> splodge: grep topic.*phth
19:12:05 <splodge> I'm logging. I found 3 answers for 'topic.*phth'
19:12:06 <splodge> 0) 2004-04-17 19:12:03 <sbp> splodge: grep topic.*phth
19:12:07 <splodge> 1) 2004-04-14 14:17:55 <hamm_> *** hamm_ has changed the topic to: More J-people Than Any Others || <jillzilla> to laugh aloud in all our swhacking warmth || <sbp> phthisicky! phthisiogenesis! naphthinduline!
19:12:08 <splodge> 2) 2004-04-14 10:55:34 <jillzilla> *** jillzilla has changed the topic to: #swhack: More J-people Than Any Others || <jillzilla> to laugh aloud in all our swhacking warmth || <sbp> phthisicky! phthisiogenesis! naphthinduline!
19:12:21 <thelsdj> kandinski: any error message?
19:12:25 <sbp> deltab: try grepping 2004-04-14.txt for "phth"
19:12:35 <sbp> http://notabug.com/swhack/chatlogs/2004-04-14.txt
19:12:37 <kandinski> @google "naked lesbians slapping each other with large trouts"
19:12:38 <supybot> kandinski: No matches found (Search took 0.138007 seconds)
19:12:52 <kandinski> thelsjd: bash: syntax error near unexpected token `('
19:13:00 <kandinski> @google "naked lesbians slapping each other with"
19:13:01 <supybot> kandinski: Search took 0.26702 seconds: AlarminglyStrangeStories.com - The Evil Lesbians: <http://theweirdcrap.com/stories/print/evil.html>; Life on Brian's Beat -- gay-on-gay violence: <http://www.web.apc.org/~jharnick/violence.html>; Who gets hurt if gays, lesbians get married?: <http://www.post-gazette.com/columnists/20030715tony2.asp>
19:13:11 <kandinski> great
19:13:23 <kandinski> I have contributed to a clichéwatch
19:13:39 <sbp> hmm
19:13:45 <sbp> bot results tend to clutter a channel
19:13:59 <sbp> bots should be terser
19:14:09 <thelsdj> kandinski: put ''s around the filename, and you can download the file and then just btdownload<whicheverversion>.py <filename>
19:14:19 <kandinski> should we have a bot-answer channel? or is this a Bad_Idea?
19:14:31 <sbp> probably a bad idea
19:14:33 <kandinski> thelsjd, thanks
19:14:49 <sbp> hmm
19:15:02 <kandinski> care to explain to me? You are the one who introduced me to the OutOfBandConcept the other day
19:15:03 <sbp> no way around it
19:15:13 <sbp> OOBC? what's that?
19:15:28 <kandinski> you told me about Out of Band Markup
19:15:39 <deltab> you probably want results from a bot sometimes, like when you've asked it for something
19:16:01 <kandinski> and I took it to be an example of a more general concept, call it outofbandness
19:16:21 <sbp> right. but @google is bad because it returns too many results, and splodge: grep is bad because it returns the grep in its results, and so forth
19:16:56 <kandinski> damn
19:17:07 <sbp> so you want the signal without the noise
19:17:58 <kandinski> ok
19:18:19 <kandinski> [off] Smax is doing nicely though, 1% down, 20 hours to go
19:20:55 <sbp> I don't think that [off] works when you put spaces in front of it
19:21:52 <sbp> ah, indeed it doesn't
19:22:38 <kandinski> I will be damned
19:22:47 <kandinski> I'll be damned, rather
19:23:07 <kandinski> regexp!
19:23:16 <kandinski> gesundheit!
19:23:22 <kandinski> bless you!
19:23:57 <sbp> hmm. perhaps I should include the long s: "Eszed (ß): not used in modern English, but it appears frequently in medieval and Renaissance Scots manuscripts, with its modern German value ("ss" or "sz," from which it gets its name)." - http://www.ualberta.ca/~sreimer/ms-course/course/eng-chrs.htm
19:23:58 <supybot> Title: Manuscript Studies: Paleography: Special Characters in English Manuscripts (at www.ualberta.ca)
19:24:09 <sbp> .gc Paleography
19:24:10 <xena> Paleography: 23,400
19:24:13 <sbp> .gc Paeleography
19:24:13 <xena> Paeleography: googlewhack!! (only 1 result found!)
19:24:15 <deltab> that's not long s
19:24:23 <sbp> no?
19:24:27 <sbp> reference to long s?
19:24:29 <sbp> .google Paeleography
19:24:30 <xena> Paeleography: http://www.bl.uk/concord/medical-0701proj09int1.html
19:24:57 <deltab> long s is the thing sometimes confused with f
19:25:31 <deltab> but unlife f it doesn't have a cross bar
19:25:47 <kandinski> wow, the Emmeriches love to blow up cities and shit
19:25:55 <kandinski> I am watching the End of Days trailer
19:26:06 <xover> *** xover has quit ("Caught signal 15, Terminated")
19:26:12 <kandinski> inane as hell, but boy, does the kibble fly
19:27:27 <xover> *** xover (~link@thumper.tj.unn.no) has joined #swhack
19:27:36 <deltab> kandinski: you just noticed that, huh? :-)
19:27:58 <thelsdj> anyone seen eternal sunshine yet?
19:28:08 <kandinski> well, one is an event, two is a coincidence, three is a trend
19:28:27 <kandinski> thelsdj, the mule is working on it as we speak
19:28:43 <thelsdj> hehe i'm thinkin of going and seeing it today
19:28:55 <kandinski> ah, it is not out in Spain yet
19:29:04 <thelsdj> its got a 8.7 on imdb which is pretty good
19:29:12 <thelsdj> like #46 of all time
19:29:12 <kandinski> Human Nature bombed, Adaptation did not go very well
19:29:20 <sbp> hmm, there's also Ezh: http://www.evertype.com/standards/wynnyogh/ but there's nothing in there that says it was used in English
19:29:22 <sbp> Hwair too
19:29:22 <supybot> Title: Reminder about 4 medieval English Latin characters (at www.evertype.com)
19:29:38 <sbp> deltab: oh, that thing
19:29:44 <sbp> (long s)
19:29:47 <sbp> hmm
19:29:47 <kandinski> so although Malkovitch did well, Eternal Sunshine is not coming for a time
19:30:09 <thelsdj> thats too bad
19:30:22 <deltab> sbp: it was part of a joke in a Vicar of Dibley episode
19:30:28 <sbp> http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_110.html
19:30:30 <supybot> Title: The Straight Dope: Why did 18th-cent. writers use F inftead of S? (at www.straightdope.com)
19:30:41 <sbp> oh? hmm, I don't rememebr that!
19:31:14 <deltab> sbp: Alice was reading from a very old bible, and mispronoucing things
19:31:24 <kandinski> yes, thelsdj, the illustration for the dictionary page of "this sucks" should be a photograph of a cinema showing any other film than Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind
19:31:28 <deltab> the vicar stopped her just before she got to 'succour'
19:31:38 <sbp> so we've got: thorn, eth, wynn, yogh, ezh, hwair, eszed, minuscule i, long s...
19:32:05 <sbp> hehe. okay, I vaguely remember it. I'm starting to wonder how long it's been since I watched them all... about five years, I think
19:32:45 <kandinski> I haven't seen Vicar of Dibley
19:32:54 <kandinski> remember Father Ted quite fondly, though
19:32:56 <sbp> go buy the whole lot on DVD now
19:33:07 <kandinski> "those funds were only resting in my account!"
19:33:13 <sbp> heheh
19:33:19 <kandinski> and the Demian episode
19:33:23 <kandinski> and the old demented priest
19:33:29 <sbp> "chewing gum for the eyes" "er, no thanks ted"
19:33:32 <sbp> Father Jack
19:33:33 <kandinski> "DRINK! DRINK! DRINK! DRINK!"
19:33:45 <sbp> Feckarse Industries
19:34:06 <kandinski> my friend Kole's Mother is from Northern Ireland
19:34:06 <sbp> .gc thorn, eth, wynn, yogh, ezh, hwair, eszed, minuscule i, long s
19:34:07 <xena> no results found.
19:34:27 <kandinski> and she reverts to the strong version of her accent when she is excited, or telling Irish stories
19:34:28 <sbp> these were from Ireland
19:34:30 <kandinski> quite fun
19:34:35 <sbp> heh
19:35:07 <kandinski> I want Ab Fab
19:36:23 <sbp> ooh, interesting: "Firstly, Old English did not use a YOGH. Old English used the insular letter g, which the Saxons had been given by the Irish." - http://www.evertype.com/standards/wynnyogh/ezhyogh.html
19:36:25 <supybot> Title: On the derivation of YOGH and EZH (at www.evertype.com)
19:36:38 <sbp> Ab Fab's nuts. the best episodes were so great
19:37:18 <sbp> odd that Joanna Lumley gets all the credit usually, though
19:37:27 <sbp> didn't Jennifer Saunders do most of the writing?
19:37:43 <sbp> * sbp doesn't know, is just asking
19:37:49 <kandinski> I remember the one in which you discover that the Lumley character puts a cig in her mouth before she goes to sleep so it is there when she wakes up
19:38:02 <sbp> heh
19:38:12 <kandinski> and the one where they go "skiing"
19:38:44 <kandinski> I have a VHS of the Christmas special and the episode with Mariane Faithfull as God
19:41:52 <kandinski> http://www.patent.freeserve.co.uk/pedrick.html
19:41:56 <supybot> Title: Patently Absurd! - A.P. Pedrick (at www.patent.freeserve.co.uk)
19:42:06 <kandinski> you know you'll love it
19:51:54 <kandinski> I want to be a trophy wife
19:52:08 <kandinski> I sooo wannaaa beee a trophy wiiiife!
19:52:39 <xover> Who's?
19:53:54 <kandinski> a beautiful naked lesbian's trophy wiiiife!
19:54:21 <kandinski> <grammar nazi=true> Shouldn't that have been "whose"?
19:56:56 <kandinski> I rilly suck: I just switched domain registrars and I have forgotten the new password for the registrar's website
19:58:00 <sbp> yes. pronouns in English do not have apostrophes
20:02:25 <kandinski> AARRRGGGHHH!!!!!!
20:02:30 <kandinski> * kandinski breaks things
20:03:16 <kandinski> * kandinski has had no email for a week now
20:03:26 <JibberJim> and has done lots of work!
20:03:37 <kandinski> not much, no
20:03:59 <kandinski> AAARRGGHH!
20:07:04 <kandinski> nice.
20:07:17 <kandinski> usability/accessibility/common-sense tip
20:07:20 <xover> * xover hates "whose"...
20:08:16 <kandinski> when doing a secure service, consider not changing domains when dealing with some of its areas, because users may have cookie management tools that do not grasp that
20:12:01 <xover> "cookies"? "security"?
20:12:59 <kandinski> well, I treat them as session cookies, but the system has to recognise me, right?
20:13:01 <JibberJim> yeh, if you don't secure them, that blue muppet will be along, and they'll be lost!
20:13:14 <kandinski> or wrong? (the question is not retorical)
20:13:15 <sbp> heheh
20:13:38 <kandinski> Did you know that the Cookie Moster is called Alastair after Alastair Cooke?
20:13:42 <patparazzi> *** patparazzi has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
20:13:42 <sbp> (rhetorical)
20:13:47 <kandinski> thanks
20:13:54 <sbp> hmm, nope
20:13:59 <kandinski> it isn't rhetorical either
20:14:03 <kandinski> neither of both
20:15:08 <xover> * xover doesn't grasp the relationship of "cookies" to "security"...
20:16:23 <kandinski> how do they know it is me all the time if they don't get my cookie?
20:16:41 <kandinski> I would have to enter my password every time
20:16:49 <xover> Didn't your mother ever tell you not to take cookies from strangers?
20:16:52 <kandinski> hence I need the cookies
20:17:18 <sbp> *** sbp has changed the topic to: <kandinski> I want to be a trophy wife
20:17:23 <xover> Funnily, with regular HTTP authentication, I don't have to enter my password all the time.
20:17:24 <kandinski> she wanted them all for herself, the bloody selfish cow
20:17:35 <kandinski> regular HTTP authentication?
20:17:52 <kandinski> * kandinski thought cookies were THE regular HTTP authentication
20:17:56 <kandinski> proves what I know
20:18:14 <sbp> Basic Cookies are hard to Digest
20:18:26 <xover> Cookies come in chocolate chip and similar flavours. HTTP-flavoured cookies are just plain weird.
20:19:20 <JibberJim> SVG 1.2 is getting a horrible javascript version of cookies for storing data on the client.
20:19:22 <xover> http://httpd.apache.org/docs/howto/auth.html
20:19:24 <supybot> Title: Authentication, Authorization, and Access Control (at httpd.apache.org)
20:19:32 <sbp> DanC made me support digest auth in QuickPut... heh:
20:19:32 <sbp> # 2001-07-19 14:08:03 <DanC_tst> pls support digest auth as well as
20:19:32 <sbp> # basic. Don't encourage users to send their passwords in the clear.
20:19:44 <sbp> wasn't hard, thankfully
20:19:56 <xover> Digest is not much more secure than Basic BTW.
20:19:59 <kandinski> sbp, are you writing a PUT handler then?
20:20:12 <xover> (a little, but not enough to warrant the monicer "secure")
20:20:24 <sbp> handler? PUT client, and did so yeeeears ago. it's not all that great, but it works! http://infomesh.net/2001/QuickPut/QuickPut.txt
20:20:35 <deltab> JibberJim; hmm? hasn't there always been a javascript interface to cookies? is SVG's different?
20:20:37 <sbp> I've written a couple of PUT handlers for Apache too...
20:20:43 <kandinski> you have?
20:20:50 <sbp> yes
20:20:53 <kandinski> ah, what you wanted is mod_PUT
20:20:59 <sbp> * sbp nods
20:21:03 <kandinski> remember you told me someone should write it
20:21:08 <sbp> yep
20:21:18 <JibberJim> no, SVG 1.2 is having a client-store only accessible to javascript, not send back to the server
20:23:19 <deltab> what's horrible about it?
20:23:31 <JibberJim> er, that it exists.
20:23:40 <deltab> why?
20:24:15 <JibberJim> * JibberJim detests re-invaention of something that has privacy implications without the spec requiring account be made of those privacy implications to the user.
20:25:40 <deltab> * deltab looks at SVG 1.2 draft, spots a typo within 20 seconds
20:26:16 <sbp> hey, it's hard editing a large WD
20:26:29 <JibberJim> especially when you do it in a text file!
20:27:05 <sbp> when you haven't got seven members of the WG arguing over slightly conflicting versions of a text and its semantics, you've got Amaya complaining that the indentation has gone all wrong, and can't figure out where its insanity lies
20:27:20 <sbp> it's not like you have time to actually *read* the thing
20:27:26 <sbp> that's what Last Call is for! :-)
20:27:58 <JibberJim> nah, it's what REC is for, then you realise what actually ended up in the thing!
20:28:15 <sbp> heheh. I spotted a typo in the XLink REC on the day it was published
20:28:31 <sbp> I think Grosso or someone replied saying, essentially, "oh crap"
20:29:10 <JibberJim> they should say, we'll get the Errata out today.
20:29:37 <JibberJim> Mind you I quoted the SVG 1.1 errata yesterday on the subject of gzipping, but the actual one linked on the site is empty!
20:29:43 <JibberJim> it was a verbal only errata!
20:30:02 <kandinski> how long do DNS records take to propogate?
20:30:09 <kandinski> hehe
20:30:13 <sbp> oh, it was Daniel Veillard
20:30:23 <sbp> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-xml-linking-comments/2001AprJun/0151
20:30:25 <supybot> Title: XLink - Minor Erratum, Major Congratulations from Sean B. Palmer on 2001-06-27 (www-xml-linking-comments@w3.org from April to June 2001) (at lists.w3.org)
20:30:30 <sbp> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-xml-linking-comments/2001AprJun/0152
20:30:31 <supybot> Title: Re: XLink - Minor Erratum, Major Congratulations from Daniel Veillard on 2001-06-27 (www-xml-linking-comments@w3.org from April to June 2001) (at lists.w3.org)
20:31:00 <JibberJim> was the typo "xlink:href" when they meant just "href" ???
20:31:05 <sbp> heh, heh
20:31:22 <sbp> 2000 instead of 2001 in the link to the REC's datestamped version
20:32:33 <deltab> kandinski: as long as spelling corrections?
20:32:33 <kandinski> the propogate joke is not really that funny until you realise that in Spanish "propagar" is the proper word and Spaniards very rarely misspell vowels (they are quite univocal, or unequivocal, pick one or both)
20:33:03 <kandinski> any Spaniard would have noticed it is a voluntary error, not a mistake
20:33:16 <thelsdj> sbp: you finish getting smax yet?
20:33:22 <kandinski> but I haven't slept so I tried to make the joke anyway
20:33:35 <kandinski> thelsdj, bittorrent crapped out with a load of errors
20:33:38 <deltab> kandinski: what's the joke?
20:34:09 <kandinski> the self-deprecating joke of making an error after having corrected it for someone else
20:34:18 <deltab> oh
20:34:26 <kandinski> not a very good joke, as is being slowly but surely hammered across
20:34:30 <kandinski> by all and sundry
20:35:15 <kandinski> thelsdj: and the console even stops responding
20:35:19 <thelsdj> kandinski: doh :(
20:35:26 <kandinski> so you can say it crashes hard
20:35:41 <thelsdj> i don't think i've run into that before
20:36:06 <kandinski> I think I did it by scaling the konsole
20:36:16 <kandinski> and bt craps out because it can't print
20:36:17 <thelsdj> ah might be
20:36:26 <deltab> so should I point typos and the like as soon as possible, or leave it until the draft is reasonably final?
20:36:26 <kandinski> I am trying to restart it
20:36:36 <kandinski> but anyway it said 20 hours to go
20:36:38 <sbp> thelsdj: yep, got it! thanks
20:36:43 <thelsdj> if you run it from the same directory again it should resume properly
20:36:46 <thelsdj> sbp: great
20:37:22 <JibberJim> I woulnd't worry too much about 1.2 typos at the moment unless there in stuff that looks like it's in spec form, a lot is still in flux.
20:37:35 <kandinski> thanks, thelsdj, it is working fine
20:37:36 <thelsdj> ooh did i tell everyone i'm famous now? i got a patch into MaxDB hehe
20:37:48 <kandinski> musta bin the window size
20:37:56 <kandinski> w00!
20:38:09 <kandinski> * kandinski does the air punch
20:38:16 <kandinski> o/
20:38:28 <thelsdj> tho its kinda sad cause the patch is only for windows hahah
20:38:48 <thelsdj> but it was adding a feature that already existed in the *nix code
20:42:56 <kandinski> sean, did you close your bittorrent?
20:43:17 <kandinski> because I am getting exactly 0 download bandwidth
20:44:23 <thelsdj> i duno if he ever had that bittorrent open hehe
20:44:37 <kandinski> rrrrr
20:45:07 <thelsdj> i think there is 1 seed and 31 leechers on that .torrent right now
20:45:12 <sbp> yeah, I didn't have it open
20:45:56 <kandinski> thelsdj, I thought leechers are not possible with bittorrent
20:46:18 <deltab> of course they are
20:46:34 <deltab> it wouldn't be much use otherwise
20:47:11 <thelsdj> by leechers i just mean people who are also downloading
20:47:21 <thelsdj> 1 seed means that one person isn't downloading anymore, just uploading
20:48:21 <kandinski> ah
20:48:44 <kandinski> by leechers I always understood people who download and don't upload
20:48:59 <kandinski> hey, know any good package for doing ascii graphics?
20:49:02 <deltab> that's the usual meaning too
20:49:10 <deltab> that's the usual meaning
20:49:30 <kandinski> I just got the urge for doing a two by two matrix of downoaders vs uploaders, and to paste it in the channel
20:49:35 <kandinski> how to do it
20:49:47 <deltab> sometimes it's not possible to contribute
20:51:03 <deltab> I remember when 'seed' meant an initial uploader
20:51:58 <deltab> but that didn't last, because words are lacking for some of the other roles
20:52:04 <kandinski> Iñtërnâtiônàlizætiøn
20:53:59 <kandinski> about encoding: isn't latin-1 good enough?
20:54:27 <kandinski> why should I éscape my "special" characters at all?
20:54:54 <deltab> latin-1 only covers some characters
20:55:19 <kandinski> good
20:55:26 <deltab> (that's not escaping, that's referring to by name)
20:55:30 <kandinski> so I am talking about everyday Spanish here
20:55:42 <kandinski> sorry for assuming too much
20:56:05 <kandinski> isn't the & techically an escape character and the ; the end of the escape sequence?
20:56:22 <deltab> I take it you're talking about HTML?
20:56:33 <deltab> kandinski: yes
20:56:36 <kandinski> yes, another implicit assumption
20:57:05 <deltab> prior to HTML 4, HTML's document character set was indeed latin 1
20:57:25 <deltab> HTML 4 changed that to UCS
20:57:47 <kandinski> so, let me rephrase: for Spanish text in HTML, is there any reason why I should &-and-; encode my "special" characters when writing documents?
20:58:25 <kandinski> or is this just a roundabout way to allow Ash et al to do it if they need to and only have access to ASCII systems, or to US keyboards?
20:58:38 <deltab> not if they're representable in the ncoding you're using
20:58:50 <kandinski> I ask this because I dislike textile, texturize, Markdown in that they render legible text into illegible code
20:58:52 <deltab> that's part of it
20:59:19 <kandinski> I mean, for me accents are as natural as letters
20:59:25 <deltab> * deltab nods
21:00:50 <kandinski> so I am thinking of one of my projects for the homespun CS course could be add some kind of switch to textile-markdown for an option to encode in &-; format, or to leave in latin-1 or UTF-8
21:01:01 <kandinski> or UCS
21:01:04 <kandinski> .define UCS
21:01:18 <kandinski> s/of/that/
21:01:24 <xena> sorry couldn't find an appropriate definition for 'UCS'
21:01:30 <kandinski> .google define:UCS
21:01:40 <kandinski> Unicode Character Set?
21:01:45 <deltab> it's the character set defined by ISO 10646 and Unicode
21:01:58 <deltab> Universal
21:02:39 <xena> no results found.
21:03:08 <kandinski> ah, Superset!
21:04:06 <kandinski> * kandinski looks at the skies for Superset
21:04:19 <deltab> as the document character set of HTML 4, it's what numeric character references refer to
21:04:47 <deltab> they *don't* depend on the encoding used
21:06:21 <kandinski> eh?
21:07:31 <deltab> the byte 0xD0 can code for various characters, depending on encoding
21:08:01 <kandinski> I am afraid I do not grok the what
21:08:06 <deltab> but Ð always means capital eth
21:08:20 <kandinski> ah good
21:08:56 <kandinski> but is there a legacy thing for ordinary latin-1 text on UCS?
21:09:04 <deltab> and — is always a control character, despite what some programmers think
21:09:42 <kandinski> I mean, am I grasping at straws or is my idea of a Markdown/Textile that leaves acutea, acutee, ntilde and 10 other characters well enough alone basically misguided?
21:09:43 <deltab> all the characters in latin 1 are in ucs
21:09:57 <deltab> they even have codepoints with the same numeric value
21:10:02 <kandinski> yes, but are they in the same codepoints/bytes etc?
21:10:09 <kandinski> ok, so my idea is sane
21:10:25 <kandinski> the benefit is that then the HTML becomes readable
21:11:04 <deltab> the UCS is just thousands of mapping between codepoints (numbers) and characters
21:11:14 <kandinski> or rather stays readable, because Spanish speakers usually have keyboards with accent keys and OS's with ES locales and can type ntildes and uumlaut quite naturally
21:11:23 <deltab> you need an encoding to describe how those codepoints are stored in bytes
21:12:00 <kandinski> ok, encoding is what turns codepoints into bytes and back
21:12:14 <kandinski> and UCS is what turns codepoints into characters and back
21:12:21 <deltab> right!
21:12:30 <kandinski> UCS would be an...?
21:12:33 <libby> *** libby (~libby@adsl164-249.dsl.uva.nl) has joined #swhack
21:12:58 <kandinski> I mean, encoding is to ASCII what ... is to UCS?
21:13:40 <deltab> coded character set (CCS)
21:13:58 <kandinski> thanks, deltab
21:14:30 <deltab> ASCII has a CCS that's a subset of UCS
21:14:45 <kandinski> ASCII would both be a CSS and an encoding
21:14:51 <deltab> yeah
21:14:59 <kandinski> * kandinski is enjoying this
21:15:38 <kandinski> ASCII's CCS is a subset of UCS because, of course, UCS was designed to be backwards-compatible, right?
21:15:55 <kandinski> the same with ASCII and Latin-1, I guess
21:16:38 <deltab> yes
21:17:41 <deltab> it also includes the repertoires of many others, but of course has to give different codes
21:18:20 <kandinski> ok, I think I have it and it seems my idea is not only feasible but also sensible, if you are Spanish/French/Norwegian etc
21:18:40 <deltab> yes
21:19:08 <deltab> even languages that can't be represented in latin-1, if you don't insist on using that
21:19:16 <kandinski> deltab, re subsets: I now realise I was not being precise enough: What I meant is that the bytes for ASCII chars and UCS chars are the same because not only the CCS, but also the encoding are the same for backwards compatibility reason
21:19:35 <deltab> the bytes might be different
21:20:10 <deltab> consider ASCII-repertoire text in UTF-16, for example
21:20:55 <deltab> see the IETF RFC on the character model, and http://www.unicode.org/glossary/
21:20:56 <supybot> Title: Glossary (at www.unicode.org)
21:21:02 <deltab> I'm going to dinner
21:21:17 <kandinski> well, I would insist on using Latin-1 because it is manageable enough, and it is what my desktop uses natively, but I could also have a UTF-8 mode and a UCS mode
21:21:29 <kandinski> thank you very much, deltab
21:21:58 <kandinski> with your bootstraping I might be able to read the IETF RFC now
21:22:43 <deltab> you can't have a UCS mode - it's just a CCS, with no single CEF or CES
21:23:21 <kandinski> * kandinski is stumped again
21:23:44 <kandinski> ok, will read the unicode.org glossary and the character model RFC
21:25:57 <kandinski> but a diagram is sorely needed here
21:30:03 <kandinski> another reason, numeric character references do not work in forms, so it appears
21:44:19 <libby> *** libby has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
21:45:04 <qopi> *** qopi (~chatzilla@82-35-55-133.cable.ubr03.camd.blueyonder.co.uk) has joined #swhack
21:45:26 <qopi> sbp, we're talking about RDF and FOAF at #esp atm
21:45:32 <qopi> join us...
21:46:46 <sbp> sure
21:46:57 <kandinski> qopi, mind if I join in just for the wordage?
21:48:19 <qopi> kandinski: all are welcome :)
21:49:10 <qopi> see topic for log details
21:50:39 <kandinski> wow, amazing page about Unicode
21:51:10 <kandinski> http://intertwingly.net/stories/2004/04/14/i18n.html
21:51:12 <supybot> Title: Survival guide to i18n (at intertwingly.net)
21:51:24 <kandinski> the best thing is the links at the bottom
21:53:58 <sbp> heh. my little iso-8859-1 => utf-8 script is linked
21:54:57 <kandinski> Sean, you are indispensable
21:55:18 <sbp> phew
21:55:33 <JibberJim> *** JibberJim has quit ("Bye!")
21:55:36 <kandinski> *** kandinski is now known as kandi_dinner
21:55:53 <sbp> enjoy your dinner, kandi!
21:56:16 <kandi_dinner> will get the takeaway and eat it in front of the computer
21:56:27 <kandi_dinner> so if it smells funny, it is only kebab and garlic
21:56:28 <sbp> even better
21:56:32 <kandi_dinner> thanks
21:56:43 <sbp> thankfully, IRC does not enable transmission of smells yet
21:56:55 <kandi_dinner> will be using #esp as "text radio"
21:57:00 <sbp> otherwise we'd all whimper when Morbus joined with... good greif, the things he must have
21:57:03 <sbp> heh
21:57:17 <kandi_dinner> yes, but Wired put internet smells on their cover
21:57:27 <kandi_dinner> worse than PUSH, even
21:57:42 <kandi_dinner> I mean, come on, we are not Luddites by any stretch
21:57:51 <sbp> speak for yourself
21:57:55 <kandi_dinner> but a machine whereby anyone can send you SMELLs?
21:58:09 <kandi_dinner> two words: goatse. cx.
21:58:13 <sbp> well, on the one hand: Morbus. on the other: Porn
21:58:21 <sbp> hmm
21:58:29 <sbp> there are clearly many pros and many cons
21:58:34 <kandi_dinner> I have not in my life destroyed a steam loom. Never
21:58:42 <kandi_dinner> And I bet neither have you.
21:58:54 <kandi_dinner> * kandi_dinner bets his dinner money
21:59:19 <sbp> steam looms are fine. I think ludditishness has moved on now--it's the technology of the time that you have to rebel against. steam looms are traditional craft, not technology
21:59:45 <kandi_dinner> yes, I was backtracking furiously
22:00:01 <xover> No no, it's _change_ you must strive at all cost to prevent.
22:00:07 <sbp> being a luddite against contemporary ludditeidity, eh?
22:00:09 <kandi_dinner> you might be a luddite unbeknownst to me
22:00:27 <sbp> but things have tended to change quite a lot, so resisting change would be a change in itself...
22:00:57 <kandi_dinner> so I was trying to prove that, by my weirdly anachronistic and restrictive, pathologically literal definition of "Luddite", you weren't one
22:01:25 <kandi_dinner> Have you ever met Neal Ludd? In the flesh? Spoken to him? Is he on your FOAF?
22:01:49 <sbp> no
22:02:18 <kandi_dinner> bah, some Luddite
22:02:21 <kandi_dinner> * kandi_dinner gloats
22:02:32 <sbp> have you?
22:03:00 <kandi_dinner> of course not, but I was the one who said "we are not Luddites by any stretch"
22:03:32 <kandi_dinner> this is getting silly
22:04:12 <kandi_dinner> partying begets sleeplessness, sleeplessness begets testiness, testiness begets un-jokes and bad social-fu
22:04:22 <sbp> no it doesn't
22:04:23 <kandi_dinner> * kandi_dinner rilly goes get some dinner now
22:04:27 <sbp> :-)
22:27:31 <kandi_dinner> sbp, I am thinking that with space not being at a premium but bandwith still being scarce, for most ordinary applications for Latin-alphabet languages storing in UTF-16 but transmitting in utf-8 might make a lot of sense
22:27:36 <kandi_dinner> am I right?
22:27:53 <kandi_dinner> if not, where am I wrong'
22:28:00 <kandi_dinner> s/'/?/
22:29:28 <sbp> why would you want to store in UTF-16?
22:29:48 <sbp> if you're using a Latinate language, use UTF-8
22:30:26 <kandi_dinner> that is right
22:30:39 <kandi_dinner> don't know what I was thinking
22:30:46 <kandi_dinner> yummy
22:31:08 <kandi_dinner> the guy at the kebab place keeps asking me if I am single, if I live alone...
22:31:26 <kandi_dinner> the woman there just cracks up everytime he asks
22:31:46 <kandi_dinner> she told me the other day that he has two wives in two different countries
22:32:05 <kandi_dinner> and he answered, angrily: "the first had no children"
22:32:14 <kandi_dinner> ah, the humanity
22:32:19 <d8uv> He's just seeing if he should spy on you to make sure to call the cops if anything happens to you.
22:32:25 <kandi_dinner> the shawerma is tasty though
22:32:29 <deltab> sbp: oh yeah, I meant to ask you about that
22:32:46 <deltab> sbp: why not simply use s.encode('utf-8')?
22:33:11 <deltab> s.decode('iso-8859-1').encode('utf-8')
22:33:29 <sbp> ooh
22:34:03 <deltab> and please don't use argv to refer to sys.argv[1:]
22:34:08 <sbp> you need me to answer that? because I'm an idiot, clearly
22:34:13 <xover> d8uv! d8! uv!
22:34:29 <sbp> why not? oh, because it's not. what do you suggest--args? argvfromoneonwards?
22:34:30 <d8uv> Hi xover!
22:34:39 <deltab> call it args or something, but please don't change the meaning of argv
22:34:40 <xover> You /kicked my IRC client! Prepare to DIE!
22:34:44 <kandi_dinner> d8uv, I have an inkling that he is checking to see if he could rent with me
22:35:11 <sbp> I call it "args" in some code and "argv" in others. "argv" more recently... I'll revert to "args"
22:35:19 <kandi_dinner> argh!
22:35:23 <deltab> thanks
22:35:42 <kandi_dinner> please call it argh!
22:35:50 <xover> * xover fires up the old Thermonuclear Missile and begins calculating ICBM coordinates for d8uv...
22:35:52 <d8uv> kandi_dinner: In that case, accept.
22:35:59 <kandi_dinner> although I assume variables can't have a ! in the title
22:36:04 <kandi_dinner> d8uv, why?
22:36:16 <kandi_dinner> so I can tell you good anecdotes afterwards?
22:36:45 <d8uv> kandi_dinner: No, so you can have shawerma for dinner every couple of days.
22:36:57 <kandi_dinner> I do that anyway
22:36:59 <deltab> kandi_dinner: they can in Prothon (only and the end)
22:37:07 <deltab> ^at
22:37:19 <kandi_dinner> ah, I am starting to like Prothon already
22:37:34 <d8uv> xover: 'Twasn't me! It was George Washington!
22:37:51 <kandi_dinner> I would call my kid James! or Carlos!
22:37:56 <kandi_dinner> Carlos! Candeira
22:38:16 <kandi_dinner> well, I wouldn't, but I do love the bang
22:38:17 <deltab> kandi_dinner: but that's bad style for anything but a callable that modifies one of it's arguments
22:38:28 <kandi_dinner> ah
22:38:33 <xover> * xover begins calculating maximum payload vs. fuel requirements...
22:38:47 <d8uv> if child !Carlos!
22:39:09 <kandi_dinner> in Spanish you have an opening exclamation sign, with the dot on top
22:39:30 <xover> ¡?
22:39:31 <kandi_dinner> charset iso-latin-1
22:39:45 <kandi_dinner> ¡Yes! ¿How did you know?
22:39:46 <d8uv> I know, but then that wouldn't be saying "Not Carlos!".
22:40:41 <kandi_dinner> yes, it would be saying: Wow! Yes Carlos! but tapering off at the end because there wouldn't be any final exclamation sign, it would be part of Carlos!'s name
22:40:56 <eikeon> *** eikeon has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
22:41:29 <deltab> kandi_dinner: you're right, many programs do use UTF-16 internally
22:41:42 <kandi_dinner> thelsdj, Sfax is done, transmet does not
22:41:42 <d8uv> I'm glad to see that you can't make sense of me either.
22:42:05 <kandi_dinner> deltab, I thought it makes sense since you can count characters without reading them, and jump to their position
22:42:20 <sbp> hmm, that's a point
22:42:36 <kandi_dinner> but then when sbp told me that Latin-1 wouldn't need utf-16 I forgot that argument
22:43:20 <kandi_dinner> so 16 for storage and munging/mangling, but 8 for bandwidth saving in transmission, where you have to read them one by one anyway
22:43:29 <deltab> latin-1 can't represent any other characters, though
22:43:34 <kandi_dinner> and that was the reason why I had thought of that
22:44:02 <kandi_dinner> sorry, deltab: bad wording. He said that if I was using latinate languages I wouldn't need utf-16
22:44:30 <deltab> you don't ever *need* utf-16 except to talk to things that expect utf-16
22:44:39 <sbp> right. you can use surrogate pairs
22:44:45 <deltab> but it can often be useful
22:44:54 <deltab> sbp: that's UTF-16
22:44:58 <sbp> oh
22:45:12 <kandi_dinner> surrogate pairs IS UTF-16?
22:45:13 <sbp> then I don't understand your statement about ASCII earlier
22:45:18 <deltab> yes
22:45:32 <sbp> <deltab> the bytes might be different
22:45:32 <sbp> <deltab> consider ASCII-repertoire text in UTF-16, for example
22:45:36 <sbp> then explain the above
22:45:48 <deltab> UTF-16 calls the code units for non-BMP codepoints 'surrogates'
22:46:59 <deltab> UTF-16LE for 'ABC' is 41 00 42 00 43 00
22:47:47 <Ash> NARF
22:48:01 <deltab> but in ASCII just 41 42 43
22:48:59 <sbp> ah
22:49:25 <kandi_dinner> eh?
22:49:49 <sbp> some really weird fetishes are devloping behind this channel
22:49:51 <kandi_dinner> LE?
22:49:58 <sbp> Let's Eat
22:49:58 <deltab> little endian
22:50:18 <deltab> LSB first
22:50:28 <xover> @google "Weird Sexual Fetish"
22:50:30 <supybot> xover: Search took 0.199825 seconds: Agony Advice: I Have Weird Sexual Dreams: <http://magazines.ivillage.com/cosmopolitan/experts/agony/qas/0,12750,412835_286210,00.html>; Elon Pendulum: <http://www.elon.edu/pendulum/Issues/2003/110603/A&E/In%20the%20Cut.html>; Congenital Adrenal Hyperplasia dot Com: (1 more message)
22:50:32 <kandi_dinner> little endian is WRONG
22:50:43 <xover> Argh!
22:51:02 <kandi_dinner> I am only starting to learn and I already know that
22:51:22 <deltab> kandi_dinner: indeed - I originally wrote it in BE, then rewrote to make the difference a bit more obvious
22:52:00 <deltab> code units 0041 0042 0043, bytes 00 41 00 42 00 43
22:52:23 <kandi_dinner> the codepoints are the same, but the bytecodes are different
22:52:34 <deltab> right
22:52:35 <kandi_dinner> codepoints=codeunits?
22:53:02 <deltab> no, code units are the bit patterns used to represent (parts of) codepoints
22:53:25 <deltab> in UTF-8, the code units are 8 bits wide
22:53:45 <xover> * xover does a double-take...
22:53:46 <deltab> in UTF-16, 16, and in UTF-32, 32
22:55:58 <xover> * xover carefully reads back deltab's latest lines...
22:56:20 <d8uv> * d8uv 's head explodes
22:56:30 <xover> Ah, my ICBM has arrived then?
22:56:32 <deltab> xover: how did I confuse you?
22:56:41 <kandi_dinner> so in UTF-8 code units are bytes outright, but in utf-16 they have to be assigned into bytes LE or BE?
22:56:42 <sbp> * sbp thought it pretty straightforward
22:56:47 <xover> By introducing the concept of a "code unit" here...
22:56:50 <d8uv> Wow. I never knew I had a creamy feeling! Excellent!
22:56:51 <Ash> all your icbm are belong to us
22:56:53 <deltab> kandi_dinner: yes
22:56:53 <Ash> make your time
22:57:06 <d8uv> s/feeling/filling/
22:57:26 <d8uv> In short, xover, yes.
22:57:33 <kandi_dinner> what I don't understand now is the line about not *needing* UTF-16
22:57:36 <d8uv> ASHSA
22:58:10 <deltab> you could use UTF-32, or UTF-8
22:58:16 <kandi_dinner> isn't being able to reference them more easily due to their fixed size an obvious advantage?
22:58:29 <deltab> it is, and that's why UTF-16 is often used
22:58:37 <sbp> but in latinate texts you'll take up double the storage
22:59:04 <kandi_dinner> well, then it depends on the time/storage tradeoff
22:59:06 <sbp> small, regular: pick one
22:59:26 <deltab> there are tradeoffs in the UTF-8/16/32 choice
22:59:33 <xover> * xover rejects any argument depending on the necessity to conserve storage space for text...
22:59:37 <kandi_dinner> as in my idea of using utf-16 for storage/manipulation and utf-8 for transmission
23:00:19 <deltab> with UTF-32, all codepoints use the same number of code units (1 each), which simplifies algorithms
23:00:33 <sbp> * sbp sends xover a W3C document to review with all of the glyphs encoded in BMPs, 1MB for each character
23:01:07 <kandi_dinner> I think, since transmission is serialized anyway, you don't get any advantage from using utf-16 but you do get the smaller size advantage from utf-8 for transmission
23:01:08 <deltab> but since non-BMP characters are usually rare, it's very wasteful
23:02:06 <deltab> by BMP I mean the Base Multilingual Plane, the codepoints from U+0000 to U+FFFF
23:02:46 <kandi_dinner> right, BMP contains living languages, further characters are historical (dead) ones like Egyptian hyeroglyphs
23:02:58 <sbp> or Chinese, no?
23:03:08 <sbp> which is expanding at a frightening rate
23:03:16 <kandi_dinner> CKJ is supposed to fit in BMP
23:03:22 <kandi_dinner> but you might be right
23:03:29 <kandi_dinner> the bloody Chinese, expanding expanding
23:03:33 <deltab> all the most used CJK chars are in the BMP
23:03:40 <sbp> I thought that the growth of Chinese prompted UTF-32
23:03:57 <kandi_dinner> despite their legislation that rules all ideograms can have at most one offspring ideogram
23:04:17 <xover> Aren't the Chinese doing their own thing and ignoring UNICODE?
23:04:19 <kandi_dinner> *** kandi_dinner is now known as kandi_dessert
23:04:33 <xover> * xover has kandi for dessert...
23:04:40 <kandi_dessert> you wish
23:04:41 <sbp> [[[
23:04:42 <sbp> > > utf-32 more memory for most people.
23:04:42 <sbp> >
23:04:43 <sbp> > For *all* people. Almost all characters fit in
23:04:43 <sbp> > UTF-16 without
23:04:43 <sbp> > using surrogates, and certainly all the most
23:04:44 <sbp> > commonly characters
23:04:46 <sbp> > do. Surrogates will be very rare.
23:04:48 <sbp> Most Chinese documents will have a couple since many
23:04:50 <sbp> common Chinese names require characters that are very
23:04:52 <sbp> uncommon outside of family names.
23:04:54 <sbp> ]]] - http://www.abisource.com/mailinglists/abiword-dev/02/Apr/0771.html
23:04:55 <supybot> Title: abiword-dev Mailing List Archive: Re: utf-8 vs. utf-32 (at www.abisource.com)
23:06:50 <deltab> xover: no, there was a recent standard, but as I recall it has a well-defined mapping to and from UCS
23:15:08 <sbp> well, I think I am turning in and so forth
23:15:24 <sbp> phth and so forth everyone and so forth
23:15:28 <sbp> night
23:15:37 <kandinski_> *** kandinski_ (~kandinski@80.26.152.122) has joined #swhack
23:15:51 <sbp> kandinski_!
23:15:59 <sbp> wait, I'm not meant to be here and so forth
23:16:09 <sbp> so hard to leave ya'll
23:16:10 <sbp> shucks
23:16:16 <sbp> I'm really going now
23:16:20 <sbp> ...
23:16:40 <sbp> really
23:16:58 <kandinski_> bye then
23:17:04 <kandinski_> see ya
23:18:35 <kandi_dessert> *** kandi_dessert has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
23:23:42 <deltab> xover: do you understand what I meant now?
23:27:00 <xover> No.
23:29:14 <xover> I do not see any meaningfull use of a "code unit" concept in relation to UTF-8 where its value is 8 bits.
23:29:15 <kandinski_> did I miss anything while I was down?
23:29:38 <deltab> xover: well, 'byte' is shorter :-)
23:30:14 <xover> I do not see any meaningfull use of a "code unit" concept in relation to UTF-8 where its value is 1 byte, either. :-)
23:30:28 <deltab> kandinski_: what was the last you saw?
23:31:50 <bjoern_> *** bjoern_ has quit ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org")
23:32:08 <kandinski_> I said "deflated, or something" and came back to <sbp> kandinski_!
23:33:05 <deltab> 230440Z #swhack <kandi_dessert> you wish
23:33:05 <deltab> 230441Z #swhack <sbp> [[[
23:33:05 <deltab> 230442Z #swhack <sbp> > > utf-32 more memory for most people.
23:33:56 <kandinski_> sorry, deltab
23:34:14 <deltab> looks like we missed what you said
23:34:48 <deltab> logger, pointer?
23:34:59 <kandinski_> "deflated, or something" is the last thing I read, and "kandinski_!" the first I read when i came back, but I just realised there is a public log!
23:35:08 <kandinski_> I will go look for myself
23:35:50 <deltab> no-one said "deflated" until you just now
23:36:14 <kandinski_> ah, my client echoed it in my screen but the line got lost
23:36:53 <kandinski_> you said: "<deltab> xover: no, there was a recent standard, but as I recall it has a well-defined mapping to and from UCS", but don't bother telling me, I am looking for it on the logs at notabug.
23:37:29 <kandinski_> You could tell me if there is a way to check the logs by querying the bots, though. Thank you.
23:38:20 <deltab> I forgot that it was possible
23:45:20 <kandinski___> *** kandinski___ (~kandinski@80.28.218.238) has joined #swhack
23:46:27 <kandinski___> hey again
23:46:29 <kandinski___> deltab, before I fell I told you I was checking the logs at notabug myself, but could you plese tell me if there is a way to check the logs by bot
23:46:52 <kandinski_> *** kandinski_ has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
23:46:59 <d8uv> I think grep works.
23:47:07 <d8uv> splodge: grep looser
23:47:10 <splodge> I'm logging. I found 12 answers for 'looser' (showing 0...4)
23:47:11 <splodge> 0) 2004-04-17 23:47:07 <d8uv> splodge: grep looser
23:47:12 <splodge> 1) 2004-04-17 06:01:43 <AthlonRob> @dict looser
23:47:13 <splodge> 2) 2004-04-17 05:59:49 <sbp> in any case, d8uv: "looser" means "more loose". "loser" means "person who sucks"
23:47:14 <splodge> 3) 2004-04-17 05:59:44 <AthlonRob> @dictionary looser
23:47:15 <splodge> 4) 2004-04-17 05:59:34 <AthlonRob> @define looser
23:47:46 <kandinski___> d8uv, thankyous muchas
23:48:05 <d8uv> No problem.
23:48:50 <kandinski___> sbp, if you read the logs, "tree filez" in French is "fichiers d'arbre"
23:48:59 <kandinski___> although I am sure they have coined a better term
23:49:10 <kandinski___> they are crafty that way, the French
23:51:03 <kandinski___> #debian-fr