00:07:54 <dumnut> /me go buy and read wjs, i couldn't understand it before but now maybe see some tips there, Fine! Dow Jones Industrial Average
00:07:54 <dumnut> 13,525.65 -14.30 / -0.11%
00:07:54 <dumnut> May 23 4:30pm ET
00:08:11 *** dumnut has quit ("Have a good day all.")
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00:10:01 <Monty> bah, it's cre8radix again
00:10:25 <jsled> Monty: can you sing and dance for me?
00:10:27 <Monty> 22:00 <GReaper> (<something>@24weeks.com)
00:11:08 <cre8radix> hrhr
00:11:10 <cre8radix> promo monty
00:11:13 <Monty> I firmly believe that crash-helmet hates technoirish incubators!!!
00:12:24 <cre8radix> i figures, monty, doesn't it?
00:12:24 <Monty> You say you figures ?
00:12:42 <cre8radix> 'fcourse
00:12:46 <cre8radix> monty
00:12:48 <Monty> yo MoiraA . o with death
00:13:20 <cre8radix> 100% packet loss, monty?
00:13:23 <Monty> depends how is first came off all your gender, guy.
00:13:31 <cre8radix> lol
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01:34:37 <bjoern_> lo Monty
01:34:38 <Monty> Hehehe
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01:41:53 <bjoern_> "Snake bursts after gobbling gator" -- http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/4313978.stm
01:43:00 <jsled> I've felt like that before. At Thanksgiving, naturally.
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01:55:54 <perigrin> We usually go more traditional with Turkey.
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01:56:41 <perigrin> http://www.electric-escape.net/node/958 # probably popular around here too
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02:07:02 *** jsled changed the topic to: "☺☺☺ ‿Ⓤｎ¡ℂ⃝⋑ℇ⁀ ☺☺☺"
02:08:22 <jsled> .pc ☺
02:08:25 <phenny> 263A: WHITE SMILING FACE (☺)
02:08:38 <jsled> .cp SMILING FACE
02:08:41 <phenny> 263A: WHITE SMILING FACE (☺)
02:08:44 <phenny> 263B: BLACK SMILING FACE (☻)
02:09:00 *** jsled changed the topic to: "☺☻☺ ‿Ⓤｎ¡ℂ⃝⋑ℇ⁀ ☻☺☻"
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02:11:58 <Monty> Speak of the devil, it's cori[s]!
02:12:29 <cori[s]> whi yes, Monty. Yes, it is.
02:12:29 <Monty> You seem to be quite positive.
02:12:35 <cori[s]> er, why
02:12:42 <cori[s]> indeed. I am not negative.
02:13:32 <jsled> Monty: you're the negative one, imho.
02:13:36 <Monty> In my opinion, secular sour shaver craves Posh Spice's brilliant towels :(
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02:23:28 <Monty> yo nwalsh!
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02:28:46 <Monty> hi bpt
02:28:57 <bpt> hello Monty
02:29:00 <Monty> ong-term goal (cough cough handball) v Liverpool
02:33:13 <jsled> .gc hairball handball
02:33:16 <phenny> hairball handball: 543
02:35:16 <jsled> Monty: those google results are boring. Can't you be more interesting? PLEASE!
02:35:35 <Monty> another hour, they send all my perl6 extensions don't believe its a case, a bubble in it actually applied in 1949 until 2011 at half the mall there on as if in many tests to less than I really would've liked the Gospel of adhesives used externally, as if the Norwegian Style Police would work too, I bet on as mear-maids, and add you a basque? I did before 24weeks project...
02:35:53 <bpt> Monty: what?
02:35:55 <Monty> symbian is your email of Web site is t@espians.net
02:36:10 <bpt> Monty: oh, okay.
02:36:12 <Monty> A little bird told me that melons is stomping!
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02:55:48 <bjoern_> .gc iso-9059-1
02:55:50 <phenny> iso-9059-1: 0
02:56:09 <deltab> what's that?
02:57:02 <deltab> ah, Solar energy -- Calibration of field pyrheliometers by comparison to a reference pyrheliometer
02:57:07 <bjoern_> you have to ask http://www.landesbibliothek.gl.ch/
02:58:40 <deltab> it's only 7 pages, so it's unlikely to have parts
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03:38:32 <bjoern_> .g "x-wiki-copyright"
03:38:35 <phenny> bjoern_: http://www.iam.unibe.ch/pipermail/smallwiki/2005-October/001448.html
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03:41:12 <bjoern_> what's the purpose of the page-completion-status header?
03:41:17 <bjoern_> (HTTP)
03:41:27 <bjoern_> seems to be IIS specific
03:41:51 <bjoern_> or maybe CF
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04:56:51 * bjoern_ wonders what generates '''Link: </labels.rdf>; /="/"; rel="meta" type="application/rdf+xml"; title="ICRA labels";'''
04:59:48 <bjoern_> .g mod_tsunami
04:59:51 <phenny> bjoern_: http://bertrand.demiddelaer.org/mod_tsunami/
05:05:26 <bjoern_> .gc X-Also-Powered-By
05:05:29 <phenny> X-Also-Powered-By: 0
05:15:09 <bjoern_> I wonder why all blogspot.com blogs report Content-Length:0, e.g. http://googleblog.blogspot.com/
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05:58:07 <deltab> bjoern_: they're blogs, hence content-free :-)
05:58:34 <bjoern_> excellent point!
05:59:23 <deltab> I'm not seeing any Content-Length headers there
05:59:51 <bjoern_> what do you use to check?
06:01:12 <bjoern_> [[[
06:01:12 <bjoern_> % netc googleblog.blogspot.com 80
06:01:12 <bjoern_> HEAD / HTTP/1.1
06:01:12 <bjoern_> Host: googleblog.blogspot.com
06:01:12 <bjoern_> Connection: close
06:01:13 <bjoern_> \~
06:01:15 <bjoern_> HTTP/1.1 200 OK
06:01:17 <bjoern_> Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
06:01:19 <bjoern_> Last-Modified: Thu, 24 May 2007 02:17:39 GMT
06:01:21 <bjoern_> Cache-Control: max-age=0 private
06:01:23 <bjoern_> ETag: "6829517a-890e-4ad4-8a15-db18bf4aed53"
06:01:25 <bjoern_> Content-Length: 0
06:01:27 <bjoern_> Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 05:55:42 GMT
06:01:29 <bjoern_> Server: GFE/1.3
06:01:31 <bjoern_> ]]]
06:01:48 <bjoern_> I see it doesn't do it with GET
06:02:17 <deltab> the View Header Info command in Links 2
06:02:27 <bjoern_> The behavior is still wrong though, HEAD is supposed to return exactly what GET would.
06:02:44 <bjoern_> Right. Above I used Netcat.
06:03:01 <deltab> same ETag
06:04:00 <deltab> only differences are dates and that I see Transfer-Encoding in place of Content-Length
06:04:29 <bjoern_> That's what I see aswell
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06:19:19 <Monty> hi libby, how ya doing?
06:19:21 <phenny> Monty: shh, don't let anyone know you're around!
06:19:21 <Monty> yay
06:19:21 <JibbyBot> Monty: that's a silly question.
06:19:23 <Monty> 've not stolen
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06:24:11 <deltab> "The Content-Length entity-header field indicates the size of the entity-body, in decimal number of OCTETs, sent to the recipient or, in the case of the HEAD method, the size of the entity-body that would have been sent had the request been a GET."
06:25:02 <deltab> "If the new field values indicate that the cached entity differs from the current entity (as would be indicated by a change in Content-Length, Content-MD5, ETag or Last-Modified), then the cache MUST treat the cache entry as stale."
06:25:25 <deltab> so yeah, bad blogspot.com
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07:12:02 <bjoern_> xover, well, that policy is not reflected in the charset cfg...
07:13:19 <bjoern_> it is not a sensible policy either, but you know that already...
07:17:03 <xover> Well, “sensible” can be discussed. And it's not reflected in charset.cfg for all the obvious reasons.
07:18:48 <bjoern_> Yeah, like, it's not a sensible policy...
07:19:13 <xover> Feel free to suggest an alternative.
07:19:22 <bjoern_> I did!
07:20:50 <xover> Ah, you want a whitelist policy that operates based on what the system library happens to support.
07:21:17 <xover> The WTF WG is .... ->that.... way.
07:22:48 * xover goes to get his morning espresso...
07:23:57 <bjoern_> I want however works on the code to spend time in important things, rather than this issue; and having that as a policy frees up a lot of time for more important things.
07:24:48 <bjoern_> And I don't see how "OMG BAD CHARSET, I WILL NOT VALIDATE YOUR CODE !!!!!!!" is better than "Here are the validation results. By the way, your charset sucks, please fix it like so: ..."
07:28:25 <xover> The amount of work is pretty much the same either way.
07:28:50 <xover> And I agree it shouldn't be a fatal error if we otherwise support the charset.
07:31:28 <bjoern_> Well, then there is no disagreement.
07:31:34 <xover> :-)
07:32:00 <bjoern_> See, one espresso and you are all WTF'd up.
07:32:05 <xover> heh heh
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07:41:23 <xover> loggy, pointer?
07:41:23 <loggy> http://swhack.com/logs/2007-05-24#T07-41-23
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07:49:06 <Monty> Thank goodness, libby is back!
07:49:08 <phenny> Be quiet, Monty.
07:49:08 <JibbyBot> Monty, no one likes you!
07:49:10 <Monty> Allied forces can prove why did :)
07:49:12 <Monty> tabs is processing and criticised, apparently.
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08:40:51 <bjoern_> hmm HTML::Parser tells me "Parsing of undecoded UTF-32"; that seems bogus, having Encode::decodeded everything I pass to it...
08:41:22 <bjoern_> it's just 1 ... 2 documents out of 44000 so far though.
08:41:42 <Tene> bjoern_: perhaps those documents were double-encoded!
08:41:44 <phenny> Tene: 23 May 23:03Z <dumnut> tell Tene The reason I broadcast my looking for sizable investments are I am not going to wait for someone even bill & warren to decide to invest in me, plus by having a wide sector of investors such interested bankers they will lend expertise to my company enabling more success and profits in my companies, my synopis of my BP consisting of several bp's are at http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dfwmh5jm_85gjhpnk
08:42:43 <bjoern_> Yeah something like that would be a possibility
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09:01:14 <xover> Since you mention it, I'm also looking for sizeable investments.
09:01:45 * Tene is reminded of a Penny Arcade strip.
09:01:47 * Tene goes to bed.
09:01:53 <sbp> 'night Tene
09:02:11 <xover> `night Tene.
09:02:39 <bjoern_> sbp!
09:02:42 <sbp> yo!
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09:07:58 <bjoern_> .gc <w:balancesinglebytedoublebytewidth>
09:08:01 <phenny> <w:balancesinglebytedoublebytewidth>: 18,700
09:16:04 <sbp> ugh, now ForteanTimes ask you to *register* for their newsblog
09:16:09 <sbp> screw that
09:16:23 * sbp drops what was once one of the best news sites from his rotation
09:17:31 <bjoern_> Probably to help your new generation of robocops with built in cameras...
09:20:18 * bjoern_ launches script to see what are the most used elements on teh intarwebs...
09:20:36 <sbp> phenny: tell d8uv http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rn8ULJGboOE - Line Rider Super Mario Bros. 1-1
09:20:38 <phenny> sbp: I'll pass that on when d8uv is around.
09:20:45 <sbp> they're not cops, just traffic wardens
09:21:06 <bjoern_> sure...
09:21:55 <bjoern_> The winner is: td
09:27:41 * xover is baffled at the concept of a “long-sleeve T-shirt”…
09:28:42 * JibberJim has many of them!
09:28:46 <JibberJim> they're very useful!
09:29:14 <xover> In what way are they different from a “sweater”?
09:29:17 <JibberJim> especially where there are mozzies or very hot sun.
09:29:27 <JibberJim> material weight
09:29:28 <bjoern_> http://www.bjoernsworld.de/temp/top100elements-01.svgz
09:29:55 <xover> Ok, so a thin sweater then?
09:29:59 <JibberJim> they're t-shirt weight cotton, rather than something heavy enough to keep you warm
09:30:08 <JibberJim> they're not designed for warmth, where a sweater is
09:30:19 <JibberJim> (in en-GB usage of the word)
09:30:34 <xover> So... a really thin sweater then?
09:30:46 <JibberJim> yes, a long sleeved T-shirt :D
09:30:50 <xover> heh heh
09:31:20 <sbp> bjoern_: this is from your 100,000 page corpus?
09:31:28 <sbp> surely Hixie's Google survey stole the march on you there?
09:31:46 <xover> .wik T-shirt
09:31:49 <phenny> "A T-shirt (or tee shirt) is a shirt, usually buttonless, collarless, and pocketless, with a round neck and short sleeves, that is pulled on over the head and covers most of a person's torso." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-shirt
09:31:58 <bjoern_> It is. And that survey does not provide this kind of information.
09:32:42 <bjoern_> Besides, as user of google products, I have no faith in numbers coming from there.
09:32:55 <xover> The next time someone refers to such a survey without providing a way to reproduce the results I'm going to scream!
09:32:57 * sbp looks at http://code.google.com/webstats/2005-12/elements.html
09:33:01 <JibberJim> This article needs additional references or sources </wiki/WP:CITE> to facilitate its verification </wiki/WP:V>.
09:33:01 <JibberJim> Please help improve this article <http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=T-shirt&action=edit> by adding reliable references </wiki/Wikipedia:Reliable_sources>.
09:33:01 <JibberJim> Material not supported by sources may be challenged and removed </wiki/WP:V>.
09:33:04 <sbp> oh yeah, only the top ten
09:33:11 <bjoern_> you know, their estimated result count for my name varies between 3.0 and 6.000.000 ...
09:33:14 <JibberJim> See even wikipedia acknowledge it's a load of rubbish :D
09:33:26 <sbp> it says that <head> is the most used
09:33:31 <sbp> you say it's barely used at all!
09:33:38 <dumnut> umm, i'm i completely delusional guys?
09:33:42 <bjoern_> you misread his numbers
09:33:48 <sbp> bjoern_: oh?
09:34:01 <bjoern_> it's # pages that use element X, I have # of X start-tags
09:34:19 <xover> .w prudent
09:34:20 <sbp> aha
09:34:22 <phenny> prudent a. 1: Careful and sensible.
09:34:39 <xover> .w prurient
09:34:41 <sbp> so it figures low because you usually have one per page at most... gotcha
09:34:42 <phenny> prurient a. 1: Characterized by lust.
09:34:54 <bjoern_> that kind of confusion gets pretty bad e.g. for http://code.google.com/webstats/2005-12/element-img.html
09:35:13 <bjoern_> which most people would read like 75% of <img> elements have an alt="" attribute
09:35:38 <bjoern_> while it really says, from what I can tell, 75% of pages with <img> have one or more <img alt="..."> elements.
09:36:14 <bjoern_> iow, it makes no difference if you have 1 element with and 200 without alt on one page, or 200 of 200 with alt on one page.
09:36:42 <sbp> hmm, yeah
09:38:51 <dumnut> me looking for wide sector of expertise investments, will send synonsis to businessmen in las vegas, hmm what are the ways their expertise can help the running of our projects?
09:41:16 <dumnut> well if i'm a scam artist i figure to be eating lunch using my feet to hold the spoon haha.
09:42:04 <sbp> like Daniel Day Lewis
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09:49:54 <bjoern_> I think what I'll do eventually is figure out how many documents validate against XHTML 1.0 transitional after passing the document through HTML Tidy with minimal cleanup options.
09:50:29 <bjoern_> (so, ideally Tidy would only fix the worst syntax errors, ala <b>...<i>...</b>...</i>)
09:51:22 <bjoern_> oh my '''Subject: [httpRange-14]: New Draft Finding "Dereferencing HTTP URIs"'''
09:52:31 <bjoern_> <abstract>This ....</abstract> <abstract-note>The title is deliberately vague at this point [...]</abstract-note>
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09:52:41 <sbp> yeah, that's a good idea
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09:53:17 <Monty> hi danja
09:53:25 * sbp -> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/httpRange-14/2007-05-31/HttpRange-14
09:53:28 <sbp> um... indeed
09:53:50 <bjoern_> It's written in the future!
09:54:06 <sbp> "Information resources are resources, identified by URIs and whose essential characteristics can be conveyed in a message [AWWW]."
09:54:09 <sbp> hehe
09:54:39 <sbp> man, this is great shit!
09:54:40 <sbp> "Even if the Web could deliver a platinum-iridium bar with two marks a meter apart at zero degrees celsius, or 1,650,763.73 wavelengths of the orange-red emission line in the electromagnetic spectrum of the krypton-86 atom in a vacuum [METRE], or even two marks, a meter apart on a screen, such representations are probably less than completely useful in the context of an information space."
09:55:09 *** sbp changed the topic to: ""Even if the Web could deliver a platinum-iridium bar with two marks a meter apart at zero degrees celsius, or 1,650,763.73 wavelengths of the orange-red emission line in the electromagnetic spectrum of the krypton-86 atom in a vacuum...""
09:56:24 <sbp> nice how they start talking about ontologies and RDF eventually
09:56:33 <sbp> because, like, that's the only system in which this matters
09:58:59 * danja tries hard to think of another system...can't
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10:14:35 <bjoern_> the hot new thing seems to be "OSS services" all around
10:14:59 <bjoern_> where they call "services" both "mailing lists / forums / ... for this project" and "buy third party support"
10:15:10 <bjoern_> and the layout is great as ever
10:25:24 <xover> Gah!
10:25:29 <xover> People Suck!
10:25:34 <bjoern_> O RLY!
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10:32:36 <bjoern_> phenny, "Der Weg ist das Ziel."?
10:32:40 <phenny> bjoern_: "The way is the goal." (de)
10:33:13 <edsu> anyone have a sec for an rdflib question?
10:33:17 <xover> phenny, "Fuck all y'all!"?
10:33:20 <phenny> xover: Hmm, got 'frisian'...
10:33:26 <sbp> paging eikeon
10:33:32 <sbp> bwahaha
10:33:37 <bjoern_> The nice people of #Swig surely do...
10:33:38 <sbp> stop swearing in Frisian
10:33:42 <xover> heh heh
10:33:47 <edsu> heh
10:34:24 <edsu> i tried in #redfoot 12 hours ago and it's been dead air ever since :)
10:34:26 <xover> I wonder if I can entice someone to go get really really drunk.
10:34:43 <xover> edsu: There's your answer right there!
10:34:49 <bjoern_> Oh sure! Just send the Vodka over here!
10:35:35 <xover> Hmm. Would Denmark be a good compromise for a pub crawl for .de, .uk, and .no?
10:36:10 <JibberJim> no
10:36:20 <JibberJim> pub crawls in .de are never a good idea!
10:36:22 <xover> We all start at the local pub and see when, and in what shape, we manage to meet up at “The Merry Dane” in Copenhagen!
10:36:38 <JibberJim> oh as a destination...
10:37:18 * bjoern_ 'd be faster for less money in London, than he would be at his former home at the de/dk border...
10:43:02 <darobin> yeah I'd say Copenhagen at least would be a good place for a pub crawl
10:43:19 <bjoern_> who invited the frogs!?!
10:43:38 <darobin> there's good beer, very pretty girls, you can play money games, and you can smoke
10:43:59 <darobin> oh I'm way too busy with my own pub crawls here
10:44:09 <darobin> just speaking out of experience
10:49:59 <xover> http://wilshipley.com/blog/2007/01/cs-omg-wtf.html
10:51:38 <bjoern_> 1. disappointment: CS wasn't for Cyber Sex
10:51:50 <bjoern_> 2. disappointment: soo much text, yet no apparent punchlines.
10:52:12 <xover> Now that's a higher ed course programme I could get behind!
10:53:53 <darobin> today in Cybersex 101: IRL Interaction
10:54:19 <bjoern_> Next week: Turing Tests.
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10:56:04 <xover> .seen Arnia
10:56:06 <phenny> xover: I last saw arnia at 2007-05-22 19:17:50 UTC on #swhack
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11:39:20 * sbp reaches for Facts and Problems II
11:39:45 <sbp> when in doubt, reach out to EKC!
11:41:07 * sbp tries to remember who the original Iago was, looks it up on Wikipedia
11:41:54 <sbp> oh right, John Lowin
11:43:27 <sbp> perhaps he whom Charles GIldon said "was in much esteem for a Comoedian", then
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11:44:27 <sbp> "Lowin, whose portrait in the Ashmolean Museum reveals as a large and imposing figure, is often associated with comic characters, especially those of a "stout blunt humor," including Falstaff and Melantius in Beaumont and Fletcher's The Maid's Tragedy."
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12:03:02 <sbp> .calc 26007776 bytes in GB
12:03:04 <phenny> 26 007 776 bytes = 0.0242216289 gigabytes
12:03:17 <sbp> .calc 26007776 * 512 bytes in GB
12:03:19 <phenny> 26 007 776 * 512 bytes = 12.401474 gigabytes
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12:07:18 * sbp wonders if anyone's prepared a modern version of Holinshed
12:07:59 <dumnut> just finished finely composed letter to limit of my ability to a bank chairman, and i gave him a nice present too, now i go to post office to send it.
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12:08:17 <xover> http://www.shaksper.net/archives/1999/1603.html
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12:08:32 <sbp> not quite, but awesome: http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1419173995/
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12:09:16 <sbp> bwahaha
12:09:17 <sbp> [[[
12:09:17 <sbp> However, since his book is dedicated 'To the Memory of Miss Delia Bacon,
12:09:17 <sbp> A Protomartyr in the Cause of Truth', you may wish to treat his claims
12:09:17 <sbp> with caution! But I think he's right.
12:09:18 <sbp> ]]]
12:09:29 <sbp> - from xover's URI, Judy Kennedy on Theobald
12:09:56 <sbp> and right, thrice blessed. thanks
12:10:15 <sbp> $ grep -i thrice ~/trove/shaks | wc -l
12:10:15 <sbp> 84
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12:15:34 <sbp> relevant ones: Thrice nobler, thrice-crowned, thrice blasted, thrice infected, thrice-gracious, thrice-puissant, thrice gorgeous, thrice-worthy, thrice-valiant, thrice welcome, thrice victorious, Thrice-noble, thrice-famed, Thrice-worthy, thrice-fair, Thrice-blessed, thrice-driven, thrice-gentle, thrice-gracious, thrice worse, thrice noble, thrice-renowned, thrice noble, Thrice-noble, thrice-valiant, thrice-worthy, Thrice-fam'd, thrice-repured, Thrice welcome
12:17:57 <xover> .gc squier
12:17:59 <phenny> squier: 3,240,000
12:20:58 * sbp chuckles at http://www.shaksper.net/archives/2007/0308.html
12:21:07 <sbp> (and wonders when SHAKSPER is going to overcome its woes...)
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12:32:06 <bjoern_> "OpenDNS Says Google-Dell Browser Tool is Spyware" -- http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/07/05/24/0342246.shtml
12:32:13 <bjoern_> of late, I have too many "O RLY!" moments.
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12:46:28 <Monty> welcome, DrBacchus
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12:52:56 <bjoern_> Is there anything like call options for oil?
12:53:19 <bjoern_> .wik Call option
12:53:21 <phenny> "A call option is a financial contract between two parties, the buyer and the seller of this type of option." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Call_option
12:53:33 <bjoern_> ...
12:53:42 <est> commodities futures
12:54:25 <darobin> brought to you by Ikea
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12:56:11 <bjoern_> You can buy furniture at Ikea, not a future.
12:56:20 <bjoern_> last I checked anyway
13:00:06 <bjoern_> "Why is Star Wars related to SVG?" - read it all in http://www.w3.org/mid/465589EA.9030508@stud.uni-regensburg.de ...
13:00:20 <bjoern_> .gc "Star Vars"
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13:00:22 <phenny> "Star Vars": 2,830
13:00:46 <bjoern_> pointers in C, globs in Perl, ...
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13:04:06 <bjoern_> aaah
13:04:19 <bjoern_> @translate german to english "Termingeschaeft"
13:04:21 <supybot> bjoern_: Option dealing
13:06:28 <sbp> know ye all that I am gladde, for I have sushi
13:07:03 <bjoern_> I have hunger. No amount of sushi can ever give you that.
13:07:17 <sbp> incorrect: 0 sushi can give you that, which is an amount
13:08:15 <bjoern_> Explain! There are very many people with 0 sushi but without hunger.
13:08:31 <sbp> % The tour has moved to the press area. The guide proudly points out
13:08:31 <sbp> % each copy contains "a certain percentage" of recycled newsprint.
13:08:31 <sbp> % She seems less proud when Lisa makes her admit that the "certain
13:08:31 <sbp> % percentage" is zero.
13:08:33 <sbp> - http://www.snpp.com/episodes/AABF21
13:08:47 <sbp> bjoern_: but 0 sushi can, along with other factors, cause hunger
13:09:05 <bjoern_> but so can 666 sushi!
13:10:08 <sbp> 666 sushi can't cause hunger, as long as you eat it
13:10:42 <bjoern_> I win!
13:12:28 <sbp> .calc 2.6GB over 235.66K/s
13:12:31 <phenny> (2.6 GB) over (235.66 (K / s)) = 11 846 426 s Bytes / K
13:12:55 *** tav_ is now known as tav
13:12:57 * sbp puzzles the units out
13:16:23 <jsled> I wonder if you could be successful doing SourceForge with less suck.
13:17:01 <xover> Depends on which SF suck you're referring to.
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13:17:31 <jsled> The layout. The mailing lists (searching especially). Bug tracking.
13:17:52 <xover> Hell yes, if you can afford to host it.
13:18:18 <bjoern_> Why, just host it on sf.net.
13:18:47 <sbp> ah
13:18:51 <sbp> .calc 2.6GB over 235.66Kbps
13:18:53 <phenny> (2.6 gigabytes) over (235.66 Kbps) = 1.0711829 days
13:18:59 <sbp> .calc 2.6GB over 235.66kBps
13:19:02 <phenny> (2.6 gigabytes) over (235.66 kBps) = 3.21354871 hours
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13:57:36 <JibberJim> hmm, now "buy jibbering.com people" are phoning up Julian (guy I often work with) to get in contact with me to buy it...
13:58:51 <bjoern_> I don't think selling really pays off. At least in my experience advertizers pay you a lot more than domain buyers.
13:58:51 <xover> ?
13:59:11 <xover> The fuck do they want with jibbering.com?
13:59:18 <xover> The Page Rank?
13:59:24 <bjoern_> precisely
13:59:39 <xover> Dear gods but I hate the world.
13:59:55 <bjoern_> You got no domain they want to buy?
14:00:18 <bjoern_> .gc ".no domain"
14:00:20 <phenny> ".no domain": 455,000
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14:16:21 <xover> World's most annoying CEO making demo using words he does not quite understand: http://news.com.com/1606-2-6186133.html
14:16:55 <bjoern_> what did Jobs this time!?
14:17:10 <xover> Heh. John Chambers (Cisco) this time.
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14:43:15 <bjoern_> Bug of the day: "When you use Microsoft Visual Studio 2005 to build an application, and then you try to run the application, one or more code statements may run incorrectly." -- KB925792
14:45:43 <bjoern_> further down: "This problem occurs when an optimized code statement contains a variable, and the variable is later used in an If statement."
14:49:28 <chandler> sounds like a poorly-worded description of a compiler bug
14:51:20 <bjoern_> it's an optimizer bug
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14:52:22 <glen_quagmire> you have to write codes that is failsafe against hostile environment of visual studip 2005
14:53:07 <glen_quagmire> if(i<2) {//i Meant i >2. but optimizing in VS2005 will make it i<2
14:53:53 <chandler> and I take it you've been lucky enough to never run into a compiler bug in gcc?
14:57:04 <glen_quagmire> once i wrote a program that only compiled with -O3 without that option it gave weird template error
15:02:32 <bjoern_> .gc "enlarge this"
15:02:35 <phenny> "enlarge this": 1,220,000
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15:08:10 <bjoern_> .gc RepairTrustRelationship
15:08:13 <phenny> RepairTrustRelationship: 166
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15:20:21 <sbp> .cp right.*pointer
15:20:24 <phenny> 25BA: BLACK RIGHT-POINTING POINTER (►)
15:20:27 <phenny> 25BB: WHITE RIGHT-POINTING POINTER (▻)
15:20:40 <sbp> .cp white.*rightwards
15:20:42 <phenny> 27A9: RIGHT-SHADED WHITE RIGHTWARDS ARROW (➩)
15:20:45 <phenny> 27AA: LEFT-SHADED WHITE RIGHTWARDS ARROW (➪)
15:20:48 <phenny> 27AB: BACK-TILTED SHADOWED WHITE RIGHTWARDS ARROW (➫) [...]
15:20:54 <sbp> grr
15:20:57 <sbp> .cp white.*rightwards.*index
15:21:00 <phenny> Sorry, no results found for 'white.*rightwards.*index'.
15:21:07 <sbp> .cp rightward.*index
15:21:10 <phenny> Sorry, no results found for 'rightward.*index'.
15:21:18 <kpreid> I'll dig that up for you
15:21:31 <sbp> I use it often enough. you'd think I'd remember. gah
15:21:35 <kpreid> .pc ☞
15:21:37 <phenny> 261E: WHITE RIGHT POINTING INDEX (☞)
15:21:40 <sbp> thanks!
15:21:58 <kpreid> I had no idea of its name either, but I know *where* it is
15:22:19 <kpreid> (broadly, not the codepoint)
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15:29:00 <sbp> when the revolution comes, its name will be first up against the wall
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15:29:46 <bjoern_> What's the revolution ETA?
15:29:53 <bjoern_> I think it's looong overdue.
15:30:16 <JibberJim> well the problem is
15:30:22 <JibberJim> we need to build a massive, massive wall
15:30:32 <JibberJim> because so many people are going to be first up against it
15:30:51 <bjoern_> They are doing it right now, in Iraq, in the middle east, ...
15:30:53 <JibberJim> we either need to rationalise the "first up against the wall" list into something with a better ordering so we can use a small now
15:30:57 <JibberJim> a small wall now
15:31:06 <JibberJim> or really work on constructing the massive wall
15:31:35 <bjoern_> We could outsource the job to china. They've a good wall.
15:35:21 <JibberJim> but probably have a long list of own to be against come the revolution
15:35:39 <JibberJim> in fact some historians actually believe that was the real reason for building the wall originall
15:38:50 <bjoern_> That would also explain why they invented paper.
15:39:54 <bjoern_> In fact, it explains gunpowder, paper, and printing. But where does the compass fit in?
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15:42:04 <JibberJim> well you need a compass to build a really big wall
15:42:16 <JibberJim> otherwise how would the different groups be able to make sure the wall met up
15:43:16 <xover> Didn't they allready have one of those?
15:43:55 <bjoern_> Err well they would add curves to the wall, like, uh, like they in fact did.
15:44:21 <JibberJim> but how much do you curve it?
15:44:51 <bjoern_> well as much as necessary to ensure everyone on the list has a spot for them.
15:46:18 <JibberJim> I think it needs a compass to make sure that you start putting the wall right before you can see the others...
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15:47:35 <bjoern_> you could also take everyone on the list and put them where the wall should be. Then build the wall accordingly.
15:47:50 <bjoern_> That would also save some trouble when the revolution comes.
15:48:44 <JibberJim> that's a very good idea
15:48:45 <JibberJim> I like it
15:50:05 <jewel_> self-bootstrapping execution wall
15:51:40 <JibberJim> I still think it would be easier to move some of the "first up against the wall when the revolution comes" down to 2nd, 3rd, 57th etc. against the wall when the revolution comes
15:51:48 <JibberJim> as we could get away with a much smaller wall
15:52:45 <bjoern_> Would the revolution be televised? I think the huge wall would make the better pictures.
15:53:40 <JibberJim> true, but you'd get more advertising slots in if you spread it over a few days
15:54:31 <JibberJim> true when the 6753rd against the wall when the revolution came probably wouldn't get great ratings, but maybe you could start having gimmicks by then, perhaps competitions and SMS voting etc.
15:55:20 <bjoern_> You could privatize the huge wall for shitloads of money if it's no longer needed. Also, sell parts of it as souveniers.
15:56:33 <_hex_> JibberJim: I had a random wrong number call from an international number today, and I could have *sworn* he was asking for Jim Ley.
15:56:37 <JibberJim> I like it!
15:57:08 <JibberJim> You would also remove the wall from being used by the next revolution! entrenching your power.
15:57:19 <JibberJim> so you're right we do need a giant wall
15:57:41 <bjoern_> I love it when a plan comes together.
15:57:44 * JibberJim suspects he wasn't _hex_
15:58:03 <_hex_> the wall needs to be tall enough that when we pour the africanized bees over it, they can't fly back over.
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16:00:00 <Monty> Speak of the devil, it's martiancode!
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16:23:19 <jsled> .wik drinking philosophers
16:23:22 <phenny> "In computer science, the dining philosophers problem is an illustrative example of a common computing problem in concurrency." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drinking_philosophers
16:28:14 <chandler> "the first philosopher to reach a sufficient level of drunkenness will realize that there's really nothing wrong with eating with your fingers after all"
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16:42:03 <bjoern_> So I'm running Tidy over the data now... already had one crash...
16:43:51 <sbp> bjoern_: chuckle. is it repeatable?
16:44:53 <bjoern_> I haven't checked yet, but I would be rather surprised if not.
16:46:44 <bjoern_> The main problem is to figure out where it crashed, I just have a rough area for candidates; the script wasn't designed for catching crashes...
16:47:04 <bjoern_> #15000 documents now, still only one crash
16:49:34 <bjoern_> I had to patch Tidy a bit to make it make less changes... I actually prepared that long ago, but apparently there is still no config option for it...
16:50:03 <bjoern_> there appear to be very many documents Tidy cannot clean up, i.e., documents with fucked up </form> tags and such Tidy doesn't know how to handle.
16:50:14 <bjoern_> the other common cause is unknown elements
16:52:20 <bjoern_> hmm, POSIX for "how many lines starting with FOO that are followed by an empty line are there in this file"?
16:52:52 <bjoern_> I tried something like grep -c -P "^FOO[^\r\n]+\r\n\r\n" but that killed grep
16:53:00 <bjoern_> .gc "Error while dumping state"
16:53:03 <phenny> "Error while dumping state": 708
16:54:01 <bjoern_> I also take GNU and Win32 solutions fwiw...
16:55:43 <bjoern_> crash #2 at 30000 documents
16:56:25 <bjoern_> http://www.kafka-kring.nl/deutsch/index.html crashes it
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17:00:25 <bjoern_> I take it my patching above caused it....
17:01:13 <bjoern_> you know, I was thinking just before making the change "don't comment out the code that adds the <html> element" and ... guess what happened.
17:04:08 <bjoern_> fatal errors for something like 8% my estimate.
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17:38:32 <xover> Whoever came up with the character «Dr. Rodney McKay» and cast David Hewlett in the role should get a huge raise.
17:39:10 <xover> The McKay Moments are all that's keeping me watching the show.
17:44:18 <bjoern_> @xover++
17:45:29 <bjoern_> hmm I didn't get past 3x16 yet; time go, err, pay my canadian friends a visit...
17:46:11 <xover> Ah, 3x17 has a great McKay Moment. Several, actually.
17:46:23 <bjoern_> Is that Sunday?
17:46:35 <xover> There's also one other thing to greatly recommend the episode, but that would be telling. :-)
17:46:37 <xover> Yeah.
17:47:06 <bjoern_> I know that one is a highlight... the music especially, apparently.
17:47:18 <bjoern_> or so the guy in charge of the music told...
17:47:30 <xover> Hmm. Didn't much notice the music, which is a good sign I suppose.
17:48:01 <xover> The cinematography is just so-so.
17:50:10 <bjoern_> Allright, Tidy's done; tomorrow I shall validate them all!
17:50:13 * bjoern_ -> off
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18:30:45 <xover> Hmm. An NSMatrix with NSButtonCells containing NSImages, all with ScalesWhenResized set to YES, and I'll be damned if I can get the stupid pictures in the stupid buttons to actually resize!
18:31:55 <kpreid> buttons don't resize images
18:32:05 <kpreid> perhaps you should subclass NSButtonCell
18:32:32 <kpreid> override drawRect: to draw the image scaled, in fact
18:36:08 <xover> Hmm. That's likely to be beyond my skills, but sounds promising.
18:36:51 <xover> (this is Perl and CamelBones I'm playing with, btw)
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18:41:30 <jsled> .cp 96
18:41:33 <phenny> 0096: <control> - START OF GUARDED AREA ()
18:41:36 <phenny> 0196: LATIN CAPITAL LETTER IOTA (Ɩ)
18:41:39 <phenny> 0269: LATIN SMALL LETTER IOTA (ɩ) [...]
18:42:08 <xover> Hmm. BTW, kpreid, do I recall correctly you were futzing about with OpenGL a while back?
18:42:59 <kpreid> still am, off and on
18:43:00 <kpreid> http://homepage.mac.com/kpreid/Mac/
18:43:45 <xover> Ah, GLToy is what I was thinking of.
18:43:49 * kwijibo wonders if there's a unicode character that causes Colloquy to crash
18:44:37 <xover> The impetous for picking up CamelBones again was the lack of any decent Flickr ScreenSavers out there.
18:45:19 <xover> I figure while I'm at it I'll see if I can grok OpenGL for effects.
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18:46:43 <xover> By naïvely answering in the affirmative above, you've pretty much ensured I'll be coming to you with any stupid questions! :-)
18:47:17 <KragenSitaker> kpreid: is Objective C's approach to message-passing the same as Smalltalk's?
18:47:19 <phenny> KragenSitaker: 23 May 02:36Z <bjoern_> tell KragenSitaker nope, not at all! I can pretend to understand latin though.
18:47:25 <KragenSitaker> heh
18:47:32 <KragenSitaker> no greek for bjoern_!
18:48:05 <kpreid> KragenSitaker: yes.
18:48:24 <kpreid> KragenSitaker: there is a little bit of funkiness about root metaclasses, though.
18:49:20 <KragenSitaker> metaclasses are always funky
18:50:50 <xover> Oooh! MacPerl Fractal Explorer! In .sea.hqx format!
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18:54:34 <kpreid> xover: those things are all for pre-OSX MacPerl; no guarantees whether they'd still work
18:55:06 <kpreid> KragenSitaker: every root class is an instance of itself, for method dispatch purposes. that's not extra-funky?
18:55:40 <KragenSitaker> it does sound extra-funky, yes
18:56:05 <KragenSitaker> but there's always some funkiness involved
18:56:42 <xover> Yeah, I was just reminiscing. MacPerl and Mandelbrot were a significant time sink in my teens! :-)
18:57:07 <kpreid> xover: MPFE was one of the fancier things I did
18:57:27 <xover> You should so revive it!
18:57:43 <kpreid> In what environment?
18:58:09 <xover> CamelBones.
18:58:22 <kpreid> hmm.
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19:13:41 <Gromgull> http://wikitravel.org/en/Wikitravel:RDF
19:13:46 <kpreid> xover: have you tried my screen savers yet? :)
19:13:46 <Gromgull> Wikitravel uses RDF!
19:14:25 <xover> kpreid: Oooh, screen savers!
19:14:38 <kpreid> xover: well, they're the only OpenGL thing I've released
19:15:46 <xover> Huh? I was sure GLToy was a standalong application?
19:15:55 <kpreid> It is not.
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19:16:31 <kpreid> Of course, you can run it in SaverLab if you like.
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19:23:57 <xover> Ooh. Voroni and Surfaces are really cool.
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19:32:07 <kpreid> A lot of 'em were meant to be more general than they currently are
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19:48:57 <glen_quagmire> hey, in the court, if I can prove i have this algorithm already implemented previos to a company's patent claim, can I win the case?
19:49:55 <jsled> what case?
19:50:21 <glen_quagmire> legal case. let's say company A is sueing me for patent
19:50:32 <jsled> ... patent infringement?
19:50:36 <glen_quagmire> yes
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19:51:02 <jsled> IANAL, TINLA, &c. I don't think so.
19:51:25 <glen_quagmire> let's say the patent was applyed in 2004 and my algorithm was implemented already in 2000. licensed as GPL
19:51:41 <jsled> Only if it was published before hand, and thus would be prior art ... but then you may need to get their patent invalidated, first.
19:52:05 <crschmidt> glen_quagmire: If you can prove that prior art for the specific claims in the patent existed, then their patent is not valid, and you would have to prove that in the court case.
19:52:18 <crschmidt> The most likely scenario is that you would run out of money before they would.
19:52:29 <crschmidt> (If that isn't the case, they wouldn't be sueing you for patent infringement.)
19:52:42 <glen_quagmire> does GNU or FSF have funding for these kind of problems?
19:53:04 <crschmidt> Never heard of a case like that. EFF might be more likely, but the answer is still "I've never heard of a case"
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19:53:32 <glen_quagmire> i see thanks
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19:58:51 <Monty> hey danja
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20:57:03 <sbp> crschmidt: yo! welcome back and stuff
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21:03:03 <deltab> glen_quagmire: you could try finding a company that's also threatened by the patent that's willing to fight it
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21:09:53 <bancus> Does anyone know why text-decoration: underline"
21:10:00 <bancus> ...
21:10:22 <bancus> Does anyone know why "text-decoration: underline;" would work when the element is a block element, but not inline?
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21:11:23 <deltab> what's determining whether it's block or inline?
21:12:16 <bancus> CSS
21:12:23 <bancus> display: block; or display: inline;
21:14:18 <deltab> what's switching between those?
21:14:53 <bancus> Me in CSSMate, or javascript.
21:15:02 <deltab> so that's the only difference?
21:15:12 <bancus> The inline/block thing?
21:15:13 <bancus> yeah.
21:15:27 <bancus> The moment I finish typing block in cssmate, the underline disappears.
21:15:38 <bancus> actually
21:16:01 <bancus> the other way around
21:16:11 <bancus> the moment I finish typing block in cssmate, the underline appears
21:17:07 <deltab> is the text-decoration declaration in the same rule?
21:17:13 <bancus> yep.
21:17:21 <bancus> ins {
21:17:21 <bancus> text-decoration: underline;
21:17:22 <bancus> display: block;
21:17:22 <bancus> }
21:17:55 <kpreid> that's bizarre.
21:18:00 <kpreid> it shouldn't work that way, AFAIK
21:19:43 <kpreid> there's nothing wrong with what you've shown so far
21:19:50 <kwijibo> bancus, I'm not getting that behaviour in firefox
21:20:04 <bancus> This is firefox.
21:20:09 <bancus> 2.0.0.3
21:20:18 <kwijibo> me too
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21:20:46 <bancus> Hm.
21:20:49 * bancus tries Safari.
21:21:07 <kwijibo> I do * {text-decoration: underline; display: inline;}
21:21:13 <kwijibo> and everything gets underlined
21:21:33 <bancus> Hm. Seems to work fine in Safari.
21:21:55 <kwijibo> (same with: * {text-decoration: underline; display: block;})
21:22:04 <bancus> Same thing for me.
21:24:27 <bancus> but ins instead of * makes it not work on ins
21:24:48 <bancus> (In Firefox)
21:24:49 <kwijibo> could be the change in display model is obscuring the underline
21:24:53 <bancus> In Safari it works fine.
21:25:08 <bancus> I'm not actually changing the display model of ins.
21:25:14 <bancus> The JS code is only changing the text-decoration.
21:25:39 <bancus> I started messing with the display model when I found that it didn't work unless it was a block rather than inline.
21:25:59 <bancus> (As an example: http://umbraangeli.org/wiki/show/Shinai
21:26:03 <bancus> That's the page I'm using to test.
21:26:22 <bancus> Clicking [show changes] at the bottom, should underline one para that's already there, then make an old para appear struckthrough.
21:28:48 <bancus> Right now, in firefox, going to that same page, neither the underline nor the strikethrough appears.
21:28:56 <bancus> So, it looks like a bug in firefox, I guess.
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21:31:19 <sbp> "Single Shinai - One Handed (Make sure to wear a thick glove on your off-hand.)"
21:31:54 <bancus> The off-hand is used to defend in that style.
21:32:18 <bancus> Punching a shinai that's moving towards you can hurt like a motherfucker without lots of padding.
21:32:37 <bancus> I actually wear hockey gloves.
21:33:45 <bancus> I switch out my off-hand glove for a welding glove when I do Shinai+Shield.
21:34:02 <bancus> Since the hockey gloves tend not to fit in the shield grips.
21:34:45 <bancus> Realistically, the single shinai styles tend to blend.
21:34:54 <bancus> Since there's nothing keeping you from sticking to one or the other.
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21:35:18 <bancus> So many people fight two-handed but will drop to one-handed to get extra reach.
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21:43:38 <bancus> Hm.
21:43:46 <bancus> I'm having another issue that only shows itself in firefox.
21:43:54 <bancus> FF is getting buggier and buggier, I swear.
21:44:53 <xover> Ash!
21:46:33 <Ash> xover!
21:46:48 <xover> Long time, no stab!
21:46:56 <Ash> indeed
21:47:01 <bancus> Oh, look, another FF bug.
21:47:07 * bancus sighs.
21:47:47 <xover> So how're things over yonder?
21:50:41 <bancus> kwijibo: What platform are you running FF on?
21:51:28 <kwijibo> mac
21:52:01 <bancus> Okay, that's just weird.
21:52:06 * bancus tries restarting his browser.
21:52:14 <bancus> I've found at least three problems that don't exist in Safari so far.
21:53:00 <bancus> Restarting fixes nothing.
21:53:02 <bancus> Wonderful.
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22:05:22 <jsled> emacs imap email client?
22:05:31 *** perigrin has quit ("Leaving")
22:05:41 <jsled> I'm aware of gnus and wanderlust, but I couldn't get gnus to work with more than one account.
22:06:16 <jsled> Actually, reading seemed okay, but there wasn't an easy version of sending "personailty"
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22:11:47 <bpt> jsled: gnus-posting-styles wasn't enough?
22:13:58 <KragenSitaker> bancus: did you read my kragen-tol post about when my firefox started crashing randomly?
22:14:10 <bancus> Nope.
22:14:21 <KragenSitaker> one of its .so's got a flipped bit
22:14:23 <KragenSitaker> in the file on disk
22:14:33 <jsled> bpt: I think that's where I hit the wall. It seemed fine for setting the From: line, headers, &c. Now I recall ... I didn't figure out how to change the outbound server via that.
22:14:37 <jsled> (home vs. work)
22:16:37 <KragenSitaker> heh, maybe you should configure postfix on your local machine too relay htruogh a smarthost
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22:17:31 <Ash> xover: things over here are great!
22:19:22 <jsled> bpt: looking in ~/.emacs, I think I started to write a custom message-send-mail-function, but I just didn't grok it. :/
22:24:54 <bpt> somebody's tried to do it before: http://groups.google.com/group/gnus.ding/browse_thread/thread/ee41826354047dc9/eb2105607928a9c6
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22:26:04 <bpt> also http://groups.google.com/group/gnus.ding/browse_thread/thread/7c5083c95be11242/a3e67700b7cdc6c7
22:30:01 <jsled> bpt: awesome, thanks.
22:32:39 <bpt> No code, but maybe there'll be some hints
22:33:17 <jsled> aye. it looks promising, but I mostly just made notes for some other weekend excursion.
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22:35:19 <bancus> .ety norway
22:35:21 <phenny> "O.E. Norweg, Norþweg from O.N. Norvegr 'north way,' contrasted with suthrvegar 'south way,' i.e." - http://etymonline.com/?term=norway
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23:22:16 <d8uv> Does anyone here have a joost invite I can have
23:28:40 <bancus> I might.
23:28:51 <JibberJim> sure
23:29:01 <JibberJim> just need an email address...
23:29:05 <bancus> Go for it.
23:29:15 <bancus> I'd have to wait until five anyway to send any out.
23:29:17 <bancus> (Still at work here.)
23:29:25 <bancus> I didn't realize you needed invites.
23:29:37 <JibberJim> or sign yourself up on http://www.joost.com/presents/techcrunch/
23:29:47 <bancus> http://www.joost.com/presents/gigaom-newteevee/
23:30:02 <JibberJim> http://www.joost.com/presents/indycar-series/
23:30:02 <bancus> or any of those, heh
23:30:23 <JibberJim> http://www.joost.com/presents/mos/
23:30:40 <JibberJim> or #joost
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23:37:06 <Monty> bah, it's BigJibby again
23:37:16 <d8uv> d8uv@d8uv.org and THANK YOU
23:37:34 <BigJibby> screw you too Monty
23:37:36 <JibbyBot> BigJibby: 14:57Z <chrisjdavis> tell BigJibby that I have fixed that silly problem, thanks!
23:37:37 <Monty> if (pedals == car parks) { clicks smacks bovine felt-tip pen;}
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23:51:28 <BigJibby> (A&&B)||(C&&D) -> reduces to single parenthetical?
23:55:22 <bancus> It might depend on the language, and what you mean by "single parenthetical".
23:56:02 <bancus> I would imagine it would first test A&&B, if true, then the entire expression is true. If false, then the truth of the expression rests on the truth of C&&D.