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00:19:59 <bjoern_> .wik START-1
00:20:02 <phenny> "START-1 is a Russian orbital (or satellite) launch vehicle based on RT-2PM Topol, a Soviet intercontinental ballistic missile developed by Moscow Institute of Thermal Technology." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/START-1
00:20:22 <bjoern_> huh
00:21:10 <bjoern_> .wik START 1
00:21:13 <phenny> "START-1 is a Russian orbital (or satellite) launch vehicle based on RT-2PM Topol, a Soviet intercontinental ballistic missile developed by Moscow Institute of Thermal Technology." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/START-1
00:21:20 <bjoern_> .wik START I
00:21:23 <phenny> "START (for Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty) is a treaty between the United States of America and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics (USSR) on the Reduction and Limitation of Strategic Offensive Arms." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/START_I
00:21:28 <bjoern_> ahh
00:21:39 <bjoern_> We can start the countdown now for s/is/was/
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00:26:13 <bjoern_> ah http://en.rian.ru/analysis/20070806/70436871.html
00:26:44 <bjoern_> .gc "Land of the Entertained"
00:26:46 <phenny> "Land of the Entertained": 2
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00:57:02 <Monty> bah, it's Morbus again
00:57:42 <thelsdj> he he: http://userpic.livejournal.com/61705294/6894435
00:58:17 * Arnia immanentises it
00:58:36 <bjoern_> that's FORBIDDEN here.
00:58:45 * Arnia flays himself
01:00:07 <thelsdj> the new warren ellis 'Doktor Sleepless: Future Science Jesus' is pretty good
01:01:24 <thelsdj> has its own wiki: http://www.doktorsleepless.com/index.php?title=Main_Page
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01:20:16 <deltab> woo, Arrested Development on BBC2
01:32:31 <bancus> @translate fr to en saliere
01:32:33 <supybot> bancus: saliere
01:32:35 <bancus> ...
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03:10:21 <Monty> But what does __Warped__ have to do with the price of fish?
03:10:23 <phenny> Hush there, Monty.
03:10:26 <Monty> It's scary when you magnify RandWord's roundabout!
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05:13:40 <KragenSitaker> .ety benighted
05:13:43 <phenny> "1575, 'overtaken by darkness,' from be- + night (q.v.)." - http://etymonline.com/?term=benighted
05:13:48 <KragenSitaker> .ety night
05:13:51 <phenny> "O.E. niht (W.Saxon neaht, Anglian næht, neht), the vowel indicating that the modern word derives from oblique cases (gen. nihte, dat. niht), from P.Gmc. *nakht- (cf. O.H.G. naht, O.Fris., Du., Ger. nacht, O.N. natt, Goth. nahts), from PIE *nok(w)t- (cf. Gk. nuks 'a [...]" - http://etymonline.com/?term=night
05:20:34 <KragenSitaker> ,ety apt
05:20:37 <KragenSitaker> .ety apt
05:20:37 <JibbyBot> "1398, 'suited, fitted, adapted,' from L. aptus 'fit, suited,' pp. of *apere 'to attach, join, tie to,' from PIE base *ap- 'to grasp, take, reach' (cf. Skt. apnoti 'he reaches,' Hitt. epmi 'I seize')." - http://etymonline.com/?term=apt
05:20:40 <phenny> "1398, 'suited, fitted, adapted,' from L. aptus 'fit, suited,' pp. of *apere 'to attach, join, tie to,' from PIE base *ap- 'to grasp, take, reach' (cf. Skt. apnoti 'he reaches,' Hitt. epmi 'I seize')." - http://etymonline.com/?term=apt
05:20:49 <KragenSitaker> oh hi jibbybot
05:20:51 <KragenSitaker> that was a typo
05:21:00 <KragenSitaker> ,g apt
05:21:03 <JibbyBot> KragenSitaker: http://www.apt.com/
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07:07:27 <Monty> Thank goodness, danja is back!
07:07:30 <phenny> Be quiet, Monty.
07:07:34 <Monty> the developers suffered from esp: Day Riva Setup <http://wiki.espians.com/Day_Riva_Setup>
07:13:12 <thelsdj> Monty: i'm not going to look at that link, even though you made it bold
07:13:12 <Monty> Is it because you are not going to look at that link that you came to me ?
07:13:23 <thelsdj> Monty: yes, exactly
07:13:24 <Monty> I reckon persona + wellie = FreeBSD :(
07:26:58 <sbp> yo
07:27:08 <thelsdj> sup
07:27:21 <sbp> schnizzle 'n' stuff
07:27:29 * sbp waves
07:27:36 <sbp> I should read news and stuff
07:28:06 <thelsdj> what ever happened with Lo hardcopy?
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07:30:18 <Monty> howdy, libby
07:31:43 <sbp> thelsdj: the printers got back to me saying "we do not know what is wrong, try remaking the file?". just yesterday I figured I'll try it on Windows since that might actually make it differently
07:32:05 <sbp> if I made it the same way on the same system I could only assume that the file would be exactly the same, so I was sorta stuck for what to do
07:32:11 <sbp> either way, I'm a bit worried
07:32:41 <thelsdj> aw, sucks
07:40:07 <sbp> note to Canon: when I install one program, I don't expect to uninstall several
07:41:19 <sbp> ooh! Tuesday today!
07:41:25 <sbp> possible new iMacs
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07:45:27 <thelsdj> I turned down getting an PowerBook for work in exchange for a 4 core 8gb desktop, yet i'm still waiting for my boss to order ram and cpu hehe
07:45:40 <sbp> .t PDT
07:45:43 <phenny> Tue, 07 Aug 2007 00:45:26 PDT
07:45:47 <sbp> ooh, 8GB
07:46:28 <sbp> man, nine and a quarter hours to go
07:47:16 <thelsdj> though, will probably end up with an iphone
07:47:24 <sbp> 'And officials are so worried about "Beijing swearing" at football matches that one local club hired university students to teach fans how to chant politely.' - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6927361.stm
07:47:32 <sbp> oh you're getting one? I don't think I know anybody with one yet
07:47:44 <sbp> at least, they haven't said about it, and I'd say about it if I had one
07:49:41 <thelsdj> for work, to see what kind of business ideas it might give us
07:50:22 <thelsdj> Was going to go with an OpenMoko phone, but really the userbase is very limited from a business idea perspective
07:52:04 <sbp> fun: http://www.macworld.com/weblogs/editors/2007/08/appleeventpredictions/index.php
07:52:24 <sbp> oh, and you're only getting one for work? huh
07:52:33 <sbp> I'm surprised not more people that I know have one
07:52:50 <thelsdj> well my work phone is really my only phone hehe
07:53:05 <thelsdj> boss pays for it and i get free personal use of it
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07:56:32 <sbp> sweet
07:58:16 * sbp gets the latest OOo
08:00:19 <thelsdj> i get a lot of perks with my job, kinda makes up for the super-crap pay
08:00:41 <sbp> this the same job you've been at for a few years now? I remember you getting it
08:00:54 <thelsdj> like i took 3 days off last week, and will be taking 3 days off next week, plus 4 day weekend in sept that i know of, who knows what else will come up
08:00:59 <thelsdj> yea
08:01:07 <thelsdj> almost 3.5 years now
08:01:24 <thelsdj> though for those i usually put in some time on the weekend
08:02:19 <thelsdj> can't sleep tonight so playing with drupal, still not sure i'll end up using it, but trying to figure out how certain things i'd want for my comic site would work
08:09:43 <sbp> sounds from yesterday that you weren't too impressed with it to start with?
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08:12:30 <thelsdj> only really had one issue with it which was automating content addition, having to go through the website for that, but realized i could run a .php script from command line which would add stuff to the database
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08:20:13 <thelsdj> can someone send an email to adam@thelsdj.org? i wonder if my gmail for domains thing is working still
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08:28:52 <Monty> Speak of the devil, it's dulanov!
08:29:48 <dulanov> yes, i am, hello guys ;)
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08:30:53 <Monty> Thank goodness, dulanov is back!
08:30:56 <phenny> Be quiet, Monty.
08:30:57 <Monty> phonological women.
08:31:17 <dulanov> I am come back!
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08:33:55 <Monty> Thank goodness, shawn__ is back!
08:33:57 <phenny> Be quiet, Monty.
08:34:00 <Monty> zope uses them being the situation is terminology
08:34:36 <dulanov> Monty: you should get used to me. I just have added #swhack to my auto-joined channels. Good luck ;)
08:34:38 <Monty> thelsdj: the moment due to bed
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08:50:51 * sbp places an order for another proof copy...
08:51:22 <sbp> thelsdj: sent!
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08:56:21 <sbp> sigh. back to waiting for it to be printed etc. then
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08:58:07 * sbp notices a small error, wonders if he can reorder now
08:59:12 <sbp> apparently not, no
08:59:19 <sbp> "Because of the production expense of print-on-demand manufacturing, Lulu cannot cancel orders, accept returns or provide refunds on these products."
08:59:43 <sbp> at least it's only very minor though. if it prints fine except for that error, I can easily fix it for all the public versions
09:00:18 <sbp> (one of the page numbers is in the wrong font)
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09:04:40 <thelsdj> ok cool, got the email
09:05:08 <thelsdj> takes a little longer to arrive because it goes to a gmail for domains account which then forwards it to my regular gmail account
09:05:19 <thelsdj> (i don't check the gmail for domains account)
09:08:12 <sbp> aha
09:10:29 <thelsdj> though its nicer than having to run email services on my server
09:10:43 <thelsdj> just set MX rcords in the dns, and you're good to go
09:13:21 <sbp> yeah
09:13:28 <sbp> I forward with qmail
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09:14:29 <Monty> welcome, Xanthor[aw]
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09:28:58 <sbp> you know what?
09:29:07 <sbp> this is going to sound possibly the craziest thing ever
09:29:10 <sbp> especially coming from me
09:29:12 <sbp> but...
09:29:21 <sbp> Comic Sans MS actually isn't too bad a font
09:30:00 <thelsdj> its just used in all the wrong places
09:30:00 <sbp> hello sbp and welcome to Swhack. this is a publically logged channel, so please be careful not to say anything that may destroy your future potential typographical career
09:30:10 <sbp> yeah. and at *way* too large a font-size
09:30:23 <sbp> make it small, put it in the right setting, and it's quite effective
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09:50:34 <Talliesin> It's being used as a default choice for "cursive" in some cases is just plain wrong though.
09:50:51 <sbp> yeah
09:51:07 <Talliesin> Strictly it is a cursive script, but it rarely matches what someone is thinking of when they say "cursive".
09:51:10 <sbp> the place where I've found it to be acceptable is... a comic site
09:51:48 <Talliesin> There's a lot to be said for actualy hand lettering in such cases though.
09:52:10 <Talliesin> And not having text-as-text may sound crazy coming from me.
09:52:25 <Talliesin> So maybe we're all showing our typographical dark sides this morning.
09:52:29 <sbp> heheh
09:52:34 <sbp> could always use sIFR or something
09:53:24 <sbp> (if you made a font from the hand-lettering, a la Kragen)
09:53:42 <Talliesin> sIFR is a hack. Its ongoing usefulness is indicative of a problem in web typography.
09:53:56 <sbp> oh, certainly
09:54:17 <sbp> plus it's not really recommended for body text
09:54:26 <Talliesin> Comics are pictures anyway, that's why I allow for the sin of image as text in comics.
09:54:52 <Talliesin> Text could be associated in some sort of alternative stream though.
09:55:04 <sbp> some comics are opening up search engines now
09:55:25 <sbp> see http://www.ohnorobot.com/
10:10:36 <sbp> .weather EGLL
10:10:48 <phenny> EGLL at 10:50 (09:50Z): Clear ☼, 18℃, 1016mb, Light air 3kt (↻)
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10:32:39 <sbp> .gc numpty
10:32:44 <phenny> numpty: 251,000
10:32:48 <sbp> .ety numpty
10:32:50 <phenny> Can't find the etymology for "numpty". Try http://etymonline.com/?search=numpty
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10:47:45 <bjoern_> wow http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/story/0,,2143118,00.html seems a little bit extreme even for the british
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10:58:36 <bjoern_> .gc freedomfox
10:58:38 <phenny> freedomfox: 459
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13:12:23 <Monty> Thank goodness, tego is back!
13:12:25 <phenny> Be quiet, Monty.
13:12:27 <Monty> Please do not imitate home-brewed ogling.
13:12:44 <tego> hi
13:12:46 <tego> :)
13:13:29 <tego> hi monty
13:13:32 <Monty> Moof, I didnt know you could put down, deposit,' from illness then?
13:14:19 <tego> know its hard to fine taxi in that time
13:15:10 <sbp> hello tego
13:15:22 <sbp> what's up?
13:15:25 <tego> hi sbp
13:15:39 <tego> nothing iam just new here
13:15:46 <sbp> oh, well welcome!
13:15:52 <sbp> this is a publically logged channel, blah blah
13:16:03 <tego> and really wanna know and get friends
13:17:00 <sbp> excellent
13:17:06 <tego> ok i love blah blah
13:17:09 <tego> :)
13:17:28 <tego> tell me sw refere to?
13:18:59 <tego> i see the name of the room swhack
13:20:08 <bjoern_> .gc "pi mal Daumen"
13:20:11 <phenny> "pi mal Daumen": 72,000
13:20:37 <sbp> tego: see http://swhack.com/faq/
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13:38:19 <tego> i wanna know about macro on openoffice i used it on windows it was like switch here really iam lost and i think to know language to use it?
13:40:07 <tego> i used glom its easy is there somthing like that for macro
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15:03:36 <sbp> whoo, new power cable on its way
15:03:48 <sbp> after a 25 minute peak rate phone call that should've taken no more than 5...
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16:03:18 <sbp> http://www.macrumors.com/2007/08/06/live-coverage-of-the-apple-media-event/
16:04:31 <sbp> "4:37
16:04:31 <sbp> Jason Chen: Sleeping pills? If you mean those little blue pills you keep taking...those are boner pills."
16:04:31 <sbp> - http://live.gizmodo.com/gadgets/apple/apple-town-hall-07-live-5001042.php
16:05:26 <sbp> "jeez i can already here steve talking for 30 minutes about how well iphone and itunes are doing, yawn."
16:07:02 <Morbus> Jason Chen: We're anxious to see when these will shit shelves too.
16:07:12 <Morbus> i'm anxious to see anything that'd shit shelves, personally
16:08:27 <sbp> yeah. huge moneysaver
16:08:38 <sbp> as long as you don't have to feed it books or anything
16:08:49 <sbp> though that would solve spacing problems at twice the rate
16:10:22 <sbp> "BTW, the bathrooms on campus do not look like giant iPod urinals."
16:12:10 <sbp> man, justin.tv video too
16:12:38 <sbp> "Probably the biggest news would be if Steve Jobs wore a different color turtleneck... like pink!"
16:12:47 <sbp> some woman there has an obnoxious-assed laugh
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16:19:15 <sbp> Gizmodo has by far the best coverage so far
16:24:09 *** sbp changed the topic to: ""You are traveling like a working class person.""
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16:26:24 <sbp> hehe. "be glad we're not taking pictures of the crowd. These people have faces not even fit for radio."
16:29:21 <sbp> Morbus: know of any channels covering this on Freenode?
16:29:25 <sbp> or elsewhere, really
16:29:32 <Morbus> i don't.
16:29:38 <Morbus> haven't been paying attentiong.
16:29:43 <sbp> m'kay
16:41:21 <thelsdj> my guess is they are announcing the iEye!
16:41:33 <sbp> Cap'n!
16:42:08 <thelsdj> (spooky voice) "It seeeeeeeees!"
16:42:58 <sbp> engadget are starting to fire up
16:43:08 <sbp> "It saw what you just did."
16:43:57 <xover_> .t PST
16:43:59 <phenny> Tue, 07 Aug 2007 08:43:42 PST
16:44:03 <sbp> .t PDT
16:44:05 <phenny> Tue, 07 Aug 2007 09:43:48 PDT
16:44:09 <xover_> ah
16:55:57 <bancus> .cp alpha
16:56:01 <phenny> 0251: LATIN SMALL LETTER ALPHA (ɑ)
16:56:05 <phenny> 0252: LATIN SMALL LETTER TURNED ALPHA (ɒ)
16:56:07 <phenny> 0386: GREEK CAPITAL LETTER ALPHA WITH TONOS (Ά) [...]
16:56:07 <bancus> ...
16:56:40 <sbp> .unicode gre sm alpha
16:56:43 <phenny> U+03B1 GREEK SMALL LETTER ALPHA (α)
16:57:06 <bancus> .unicode gre cap eta
16:57:09 <phenny> U+0397 GREEK CAPITAL LETTER ETA (Η)
16:57:12 <bancus> er
16:57:16 <bancus> .unicode gre cap epsilon
16:57:17 <phenny> U+0395 GREEK CAPITAL LETTER EPSILON (Ε)
16:59:08 <bancus> Is there a way to have phenny generate the UTF-8 bytes for that?
17:09:14 <sbp> .pc Ε
17:09:18 <phenny> 0395: GREEK CAPITAL LETTER EPSILON (Ε)
17:09:21 <sbp> er
17:09:22 <sbp> .bytes Ε
17:09:24 <phenny> '\xce\x95'
17:09:42 <sbp> "Brian Lam: we're in, steve is up and he's talking iMacs. The materials? Glass and aluminum."
17:11:01 <sbp> no surprises so far
17:11:17 <sbp> and engadget has the better coverage at the moment, surprisingly
17:13:07 <bancus> no surprises on what?
17:13:16 <bancus> is there a keynote I'm missing?
17:13:54 <thelsdj> its a 'media event' or something like that
17:15:42 <bancus> It's kinda weird to see pictures of IL having been there.
17:22:12 <laplink> New iMac, same as the old iMac.
17:22:17 <laplink> New iPhoto, same as the old iPhoto.
17:24:35 <bancus> They need to put this reporting on twitter.
17:24:45 <bancus> Although I guess that can't have photos.
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17:31:20 <bancus> Heh.
17:31:31 <bancus> The engadget guy is not at all impressed with iPhoto '08
17:32:01 <thelsdj> i love how the stream of features segues into 'seems a bit unnessiary'
17:32:08 <bancus> yeah
17:35:26 <thelsdj> 'did steve just say web 2.0?'
17:35:45 <laplink> New .Mac, same as the old .Mac.
17:36:50 <thelsdj> New new, same as the old new.
17:36:55 <sbp> ha! the keyboard!
17:37:05 <sbp> the keyboard we saw is the new Mac keyboard
17:37:13 <sbp> and they didn't even change the scheme, by the looks of it
17:37:43 <sbp> '10:12AM: "Want to see our new ad?" New iMac ad plays. iMacs rotating slowly, and that's about it.'
17:37:51 <sbp> so, this is a bit of a pile of ass so far
17:39:18 <sbp> "Glass screen? Absolutely no reason to do this *except*for multi-touch, which I bet comes later as an update."
17:39:21 <thelsdj> I have a theory, Apple has never actually had an interesting media event, we have all just had our memories altered to 'remember that one time that apple had that awesome event'
17:39:23 <sbp> - commentor
17:39:35 <sbp> chuckle. I think you're right
17:40:57 <laplink> Are you kidding? Seeing Bill Gates appear in a perfect 1984-esque TV screen appearance at MacWorld to announced they'd bought Apple (stock for $459m) will never ever leave my memory!
17:41:09 <sbp> " 13:09 It has some dedicated keys - Expose, Dashboard, Dimmer, Media Keys."
17:41:15 <sbp> - http://live.macnn.com/
17:41:39 <thelsdj> does it have the 'Empty My Wallet' key?
17:41:51 <sbp> hehe. "13:09 New keyboard (as rumored), jokes (you might have seen on the web.)"
17:42:44 <laplink> New iMovie, not, surprisingly, same as the old iMovie!
17:43:12 <sbp> they should take the "Move" out of it, just call it the ii, sorta like thelsdj predicted
17:43:42 <thelsdj> hehe
17:43:58 <bancus> I had wondered why the mac rumors were churning for the last week or so.
17:44:32 <sbp> "10.12 i can't believe how quickly he's gone through this - they're showing a new ad now - the iMac is significantly thinner than before, and more shiny, but retains the same basic shape. It looks more professional and the shiny display looks gorgeous. But it's not a huge leap forward. What next? "
17:44:38 <sbp> - http://stuff.tv/blogs/live/archive/2007/08/07/live-from-the-apple-launch-at-cupertino.aspx
17:46:07 <sbp> "New sounds! Is Schoom the new boom?" - on the iMovie scroll sound
17:47:45 <sbp> http://cache.gizmodo.com/assets/townhall07/appletownhall0770.jpg
17:47:49 <sbp> ^ what's that all about?
17:47:52 <sbp> the icons, I mean
17:48:19 <sbp> oh, some sort of iPhone demo?
17:49:48 <laplink> Heh. So two gits forgot to turn off their cellphone ringers so far it seems…
17:50:08 <laplink> I'm betting there will be an iPhone software update coming out in the not so distant future, A mandatory one.
17:50:29 <sbp> hehe, yeah. "(Steve just suggested someone answer the cell phone that was ringing -- he didn't seem amused. As this is the second phone that has gone off, my question is WHO DOESN"T REALIZE THEY SHOULD TURN THEIR RINGERS OFF!)"
17:51:24 <laplink> [[[ I feel like this whole apple event where he presents iLife and something new with apple happens alot... ]]]
17:51:54 <sbp> yeah, the dressing up of silly little incremental updates is gahsome
17:52:01 <sbp> all the hype was about the iMac
17:52:06 <sbp> people care about iMac updates
17:52:13 <thelsdj> "WAZZZZUP, HEY YEA I'M AT THAT APPLE THING, NO, ITS OK, I CAN TALK, WHAT? YOU WANNA HANG TONIGHT?...."
17:52:18 <sbp> nobody said "oh man, I hope iLife gets a tune up!"
17:52:43 <laplink> I'm still waiting for the “iLife `08 requires Leopard.” announcement.
17:53:05 <sbp> heh, heh
17:53:59 <laplink> Hmm. DVD quality video in .Mac...
17:54:27 <sbp> better than DVD!
17:54:41 <sbp> er, but maybe not in .Mac
17:54:47 <laplink> Either they expect only Larry Ellison will want to do that, or price _and_ capacity on iDisk will have to plummet by the end of this event.
17:54:55 <sbp> and since Firefox just crashed...
17:56:41 <laplink> «DVD quality, on the web gallery,»
17:56:41 <sbp> ah yes, it is better-than-DVD on .Mac
17:56:44 <sbp> aye
17:56:58 <sbp> "One of things I want to show you is .Mac Web Gallery. put a few movies on there. You can see, it's higher res than a DVD, anyone can see this." was what I saw
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17:58:05 <laplink> New iWeb, same as the old iWeb.
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17:58:25 <sbp> I don't think I've ever even loaded iWeb
17:58:31 * bancus certainly hasn't.
17:58:35 <bancus> I've considered deleting it.
17:58:35 <sbp> I'm not sure if I even have it. I suppose I must do, but...
17:58:45 <laplink> Prolly not. It's a non-entity for most.
17:58:45 <bancus> But I'm afraid I might want it in the future.
18:00:14 <laplink> New iDVD, same as the old iDVD.
18:00:44 <sbp> ah!
18:00:45 <sbp> "[1:55 PM] GarageBand has a host of new features, and I didn't see most of them. There are multitake recordings, and Magic GarageBand, which Steve is showing us now."
18:00:57 <sbp> New GarageBand, possibly a thing or two which is useful
18:01:05 <sbp> multitake sounds potentially very useful
18:01:58 <laplink> New GarageBand, same as the old GarageBand.
18:02:06 <sbp> "[1:56 PM] From today on, all new Macs include this version of iLife (Save $79, Steve quipped, and by a new Mac today)."
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18:02:40 <thelsdj> so its an 80$ price drop on all new macs hehe
18:02:57 <thelsdj> and forcing you to buy iLife for $80
18:02:58 <sbp> "New feature called Magic Garage Band. Which has some basic genres to play with." - sounds not so good
18:03:02 <sbp> yeah
18:03:16 <bancus> oop
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18:03:20 <bancus> looks like macnn went down
18:03:26 <bancus> ah, back up
18:03:56 <laplink> Ah, 10GB on .Mac for $99.
18:04:09 <laplink> That's starting to approach usefull.
18:05:25 <sbp> onto iWork
18:05:49 <sbp> New iWork, same as the old iWork?
18:06:16 <sbp> Gizmodo seems to have crashed, which is a shame
18:07:17 <laplink> New Keynote, same as the old Keynote.
18:08:40 <sbp> "Moving on to something new...Yep, Numbers!"
18:09:04 <laplink> New Numbers, same as uhm...
18:09:35 <sbp> "AppleInsider reports that Apple has requested a standard character mark for "Numbers" and is currently working on a spreadsheet application to possibly supplement the iWork application suite."
18:09:40 <sbp> - http://www.macrumors.com/2005/06/16/apple-developing-numbers/
18:09:46 <sbp> same as the old Excel, I think
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18:10:26 <laplink> New Pages, same as the old Pages.
18:10:56 <thelsdj> when do we get 'Thing'?
18:11:03 <thelsdj> or should that be 'Things'?
18:11:57 <laplink> `Thing, here, would have to be Leopard shipping today (or before October, at any rate), I think.
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18:13:55 <sbp> '[2:10 PM] Numbers definitely seems easy to use, and a lot of folks are going to like it. "This completes our productivity suite," said Steve.'
18:14:05 <sbp> still fifty minutes to go. anything good in the hat, d'ya think?
18:14:36 <laplink> It's scheduled for 2 hours?
18:15:02 <laplink> Hmm. I take back my “must be Leopard” comment, then, I think.
18:15:04 <sbp> yeah, I think so
18:15:29 <sbp> "Jason Chen: Tim Cook COO and Phil Schiller, EVP Product Marketing are invited up on stage for Q&A."
18:15:37 <laplink> Hmm. I think that's a price drop on iWork, BTW. ISTR it was more expensive than iLife.
18:15:42 <sbp> Q. and. A. boring
18:16:07 <laplink> Gah. Gzmodo's liveupdate is really confused.
18:16:33 <sbp> "Formatting, sorting, doing formulas, moving columns around without affecting other sheets. Adding pictures and titles and other junk."
18:16:37 <sbp> yeah, it's a shame
18:16:41 <sbp> it started off so well
18:17:03 <laplink> «This is what we've got for you this morning. We can do something we don't normally do because of this more intimate setting: Q&A.»
18:17:13 <sbp> "There is an iLife '08 demo up on Apple's website as well."
18:17:18 <laplink> So, no more `Thing.
18:17:20 <sbp> that's it?
18:17:22 <sbp> pfft
18:18:32 <thelsdj> i hope everyone asks about why they didn't put out an iphone sdk, or about the iphone hackers heheheh
18:18:57 <sbp> 'Another chap asked why Apple doesn't do Intel Inside. Steve: "Uhhhh...What can I say. [pause] We like our own stickers better."'
18:19:03 <sbp> yeah, that'd be fun
18:19:13 <sbp> or "Why didn't you do something exciting?"
18:19:38 <laplink> «So… Basically you got bubkis?»
18:21:30 <sbp> [[[
18:21:31 <sbp> Q: How thin are the iMacs?
18:21:31 <sbp> A: They're really thin. You can measure it in the next room in just a few minutes. But they're appreciably thinner.
18:21:31 <sbp> ]]]
18:21:45 <laplink> [[[
18:21:45 <laplink> Total allocated: 10240 MB
18:21:45 <laplink> Total in use: 79 MB
18:21:45 <laplink> Total remaining: 10161 MB
18:21:45 <laplink> ]]] — .Mac iDisk settings.
18:21:57 <sbp> ooh:
18:21:59 <sbp> [[[
18:22:00 <sbp> Q: How is the Mac Mini doing? And are you updating it? A: We are refreshing the Mac Mini and making it even faster. It's already in the online store.
18:22:00 <sbp> ]]]
18:22:14 <bancus> wha wha wha
18:22:18 <bancus> t
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18:22:19 <laplink> Oh? Then why the fuck didn't you say so!
18:22:41 <sbp> bizarre, eh?
18:22:45 <jetscreamer> because i didn't want to
18:22:50 <sbp> a tonne of shit about iLife and crap
18:23:00 <sbp> and Mac Mini survival only comes up randomly
18:23:26 <thelsdj> i wonder if the reason there was no mention of the tv thing is that its a total flop
18:23:27 <laplink> Well, it's prolly just a minor bump, but still… Mac mini LIVES ON!
18:23:58 <laplink> My biggest fear was that they'd replace the Mac mini with the Apple TV!
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18:24:39 <sbp> heh, that's a point. you don't hear about it much these days
18:24:44 <sbp> iPhone drowned it out, especially
18:25:38 <thelsdj> running to the bank, hopefully i don't miss jobs announcing the end of the world or whatever
18:25:46 <laplink> heh heh
18:25:53 <sbp> hehe
18:26:14 <laplink> «It's already in the online store.» LIES!
18:26:41 <thelsdj> is the online store even up?
18:27:11 <laplink> No.
18:27:54 <sbp> [[[
18:27:54 <sbp> "How is Apple TV today? How does it fit into Mac?"
18:27:54 <sbp> Steve: "We're here to talk about Mac, we'll have some news for the Apple TV soon, but nothing to talk about today."
18:27:55 <sbp> ]]]
18:28:12 <sbp> hehe:
18:28:12 <sbp> [[[
18:28:14 <sbp> "What about AMD chips?"
18:28:14 <sbp> Steve: "We use Intel chips"
18:28:14 <sbp> ]]]
18:29:24 * laplink senses a Fake Steve Jobs Moment there…
18:30:35 <sbp> "There is no Excel Macro support in Numbers."
18:31:07 <sbp> ah!
18:31:08 <sbp> [[[
18:31:08 <sbp> 11:25AM: "Introduced multitouch on iPhone, what about for the Mac?"
18:31:08 <sbp> Steve: "Makes sense for the iPhone, not sure it makes sense in the Mac. Classify that as a research project."
18:31:09 <sbp> ]]]
18:31:43 <laplink> Hmm. Steve dissing “HD” camcorders as not really having full HD sensors...
18:32:09 <sbp> yeah
18:32:16 <sbp> not the ones under $10k
18:34:04 <sbp> looks like it was only scheduled for 1:30
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18:42:05 * sbp peeks at http://www.apple.com/imac/
18:43:39 <sbp> http://images.apple.com/imac/images/design_keyboard20070807.jpg
18:43:46 <sbp> that button we were debating seems to be a down arrow
18:44:06 <sbp> "Dimmer"?
18:44:46 <sbp> oh!
18:44:50 <sbp> no, it's the Dashboard logo
18:44:51 <sbp> heh
18:44:59 <sbp> http://images.apple.com/imac/images/gallery/keyboard_2_20070807.jpg makes it clear
18:46:29 <sbp> three USB slots, vents are at the bottom
18:53:46 <laplink> Still not liking the white on brushed metal.
18:54:46 <sbp> it's not brushed, it's anodised
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18:56:46 <laplink> Fine, white on metal then.
18:57:14 <thelsdj> back, did i miss anything?
18:57:28 <sbp> yeah, we found out what that mystery key is
18:57:36 <sbp> it's for Dashboard. booOoring
19:13:26 <sbp> http://www.apple.com/ilife/guidedtour/medium.html
19:13:37 <sbp> iPhoto '08 is a bit more Apertureish...
19:15:23 <sbp> actually, a lot more, as it goes on!
19:19:37 <sbp> wow, the .Mac gallery is insane
19:20:23 <thelsdj> is it just me or does pixelmator look like a Cocoa interface for gimp or something
19:21:27 <thelsdj> i thought we had learned that you'll never convince people that a multi window interface like gimp is usable
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19:26:56 <sbp> aha, this skimming in iMovie makes more sense now
19:29:08 <sbp> hmm, easy transition selects
19:35:51 <sbp> ah! GarageBand
19:37:24 <sbp> Magic GarageBand is... really, really weird
19:38:54 <sbp> aha, multitake does look useful. in some settings
19:40:13 <sbp> store's up
19:40:34 <sbp> I... can't remember what the Mac Mini stats were before
19:40:38 <sbp> so not sure what was upgraded
19:47:05 <laplink> Core -> Core 2, bigger HDD, supports more RAM; just guessing based on <http://apple.com/macmini/>.
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20:01:23 <thelsdj> I MADE YOU A GOAT... BUT I EATED IT...
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20:18:10 <bjoern_> thelsdjHasBeenHackedByMonty.
20:18:14 <Monty> Erm, hardcore dastardly Lasagne sleeps with damaged eye-popping injunction.
20:18:36 <thelsdj> http://warehouse.carlh.com/article_141/metalgoat.jpg
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20:27:50 <kpreid> phenny: tell Arnia "is a predicate" is a predicate
20:27:53 <phenny> kpreid: I'll pass that on when arnia is around.
20:28:27 <sbp> Dashboard key... a Spaces key would've been nice
20:28:40 <sbp> predicatep
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21:15:06 <thelsdj> I have a question.
21:15:14 <thelsdj> What is your opinion of cheese?
21:23:52 <bancus> Nasty, horrible stuff.
21:23:55 <bancus> Except mozzarella.
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22:19:02 <bjoern_> w00t!
22:19:17 <bjoern_> I think Alexander's toRegex function is working now
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22:21:18 <thelsdj> what is Alexander?
22:21:52 <bjoern_> A grammar engine, think a regex engine on steroids.
22:22:40 <thelsdj> so what kind of regex does it output?
22:25:15 <bjoern_> Well it takes a regular grammar as input (e.g., "any string that does not contain ']]>'") and you get a PCRE back, ala (((((([\x{0}-\x{5C}\x{5E}-\x{10FFFF}])+|())...
22:27:26 <thelsdj> thats a lot of named grouping results heh
22:27:57 <bjoern_> It does not try hard to make them less verbose...
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23:00:49 <Arnia> This is good: http://www.conceptlabs.co.uk/alicebob.html
23:00:51 <phenny> Arnia: 20:27Z <kpreid> tell Arnia "is a predicate" is a predicate
23:01:43 <Arnia> kpreid: but is 'this is not a predicate in logic X' a predicate?
23:02:04 <kpreid> No.
23:02:13 <kpreid> Well, for any sane logic.
23:02:15 <kpreid> :)
23:02:24 <bancus> dei na bridi
23:03:29 <Arnia> [[[ Against all odds, over a noisy telephone line, tapped by the tax authorities and the secret police, Alice will happily attempt, with someone she doesn't trust, whom she cannot hear clearly,
23:03:31 <Arnia> and who is probably someone else, to fiddle her tax returns and to organise a coup d'etat, while at the same time minimising the cost of the phone call.
23:03:31 <Arnia> A coding theorist is someone who doesn't think Alice is crazy. ]]] -- ibid
23:04:04 *** tommorris (n=tom@i-83-67-98-32.freedom2surf.net) has joined #swhack
23:08:36 <Arnia> [[[ So far so good. But of course the key, the non-standardised part, must be nonstandard in only standardised ways. And also key management must conform to certain standards.
23:08:36 <Arnia> In other words standards are being formulated whereby the nonstandard parts, which must conform to certain standards of non-standardization are also to be handled only in a standardised nonstandard way in order to standardise on the overall non-standardization.
23:08:37 <Arnia> I hope this makes the position clear. ]]] -- ibid
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23:10:25 <tommorris> "o_O" is all I have to say to that.
23:10:35 <tommorris> It's almost as incomprehensible as literary theory.
23:14:22 <kpreid> Ive never examined any literary theory, but I found that quite comprehensible.
23:14:28 <Arnia> tommorris: http://www.conceptlabs.co.uk/alicebob.html
23:14:32 <bancus> I understood it fine.
23:14:35 <Arnia> tommorris: it is a very good speech
23:15:39 <tommorris> Out of context, it looked like some management-speak
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23:40:36 <thelsdj> whats the best way to split a string in python, but leave the character that is being split on?
23:41:04 <bancus> on which side of the split?
23:41:05 <bancus> both?
23:41:24 <thelsdj> hrm, i guess the end
23:41:48 <thelsdj> like foo\nbar split on \n should be ['foo\n','bar']
23:41:58 <bancus> def mysplit(string):
23:42:12 <bancus> well, yeah
23:42:16 <bancus> can't use that varname
23:42:25 <bancus> um, I'd use split, then manually add it back in
23:43:31 <thelsdj> i really only need it for \n, can i turn a string into a stream and use readlines?
23:44:25 <bancus> I think so
23:44:30 <bancus> look up StringIO
23:45:10 <thelsdj> ah found it
23:45:26 <thelsdj> >>> "foo\nbar".splitlines(True)
23:45:27 <thelsdj> ['foo\n', 'bar']
23:45:34 <bancus> ah, there we go
23:54:23 <thelsdj> i keep writing foo[a,b] when i mean foo[a:b]
23:54:39 <thelsdj> haven't written python in a while
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23:56:51 <thelsdj> hey morbus
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