2007-08-17 Swhack IRC Log

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00:25:22 <Monty> hi perigrin, how ya doing?
00:25:25 <phenny> Monty: shh, don't let anyone know you're around!
00:25:26 <Monty> jeffarch: I don recall if the system.?? ++
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01:14:12 <Monty> hi l7_
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02:11:45 <Monty> welcome, coax
02:12:08 * coax pets Monty
02:12:08 <Monty> kind of passing them in progress... it's close...
02:14:51 <kpreid> [[[
02:14:51 <kpreid> <Binkley> but anyway
02:14:52 <kpreid> <Binkley> how about those local sports teams
02:14:52 <kpreid> <Pseudonym> My local sports teams are far superior to your local sports teams.
02:14:52 <kpreid> <Binkley> I beg to differ with that proposition, my good sir.
02:14:55 <kpreid> <Pseudonym> My local sports teams would clearly beat yours in the appropriate sporting contests.
02:14:58 <kpreid> <Binkley> I hazard a guess that my local sports teams would beat yours approximately 50 percent of the time
02:15:02 <kpreid> <ricky_clarkson> I disagree with both of you, and proffer a chair to you, albeit with great speed and airborne.
02:15:05 <kpreid> ]]] -- #haskell
02:15:13 <kpreid> sbp:
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02:41:37 <bjoern_> "US anti-war group ordered to take down Iraq demo ... Washington city authorities said the posters have to come down because they were stuck on with adhesive that did not meet city regulations. " - http://rawstory.com/news/afp/US_anti_war_group_ordered_to_take_d_08152007.html
02:46:04 <bjoern_> "Homeland Security Enlists Clergy to Quell Public Unrest if Martial Law Ever Declared" - http://www.ksla.com/Global/story.asp?S=6937987
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03:20:09 <bjoern_> .calc 2**23 times 64 bit
03:20:11 <phenny> (2 ** 23) times 64 bit = 64 megabytes
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06:28:15 <bjoern_> "Why should I report paid links to Google?" - http://www.google.com/support/webmasters/bin/answer.py?answer=66736
06:43:22 <bjoern_> Can you write a regular expression like this?
06:43:22 <bjoern_> 1. You only use the forms (a), ab, a|b, a*, <empty>.
06:43:22 <bjoern_> 2. There is no shorter equivalent regex in this form.
06:43:22 <bjoern_> 3. There is a shorter equivalent regex if you use "a+"
06:43:22 <bjoern_> 4. The regex is not of the form aa* (where a equals a).
06:44:51 <bjoern_> So e.g. "[0-9][0-9]*" would match all but the last requirement.
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06:51:52 <KragenSitaker> .ety paean
06:51:56 <phenny> "1592, from L. paean 'hymn of deliverance,' from Gk. paian 'hymn to Apollo,' from Paian, a name of the god; originally the physician of the gods (in Homer), later merged with Apollo; lit. 'one who touches,' from paio 'to touch, strike.'" - http://etymonline.com/?term=paean
06:53:01 <KragenSitaker> bjoern_: does #2 mean "there is no shorter equivalent regex that follows these four rules"?
06:53:32 <bjoern_> yes
06:53:38 <bjoern_> err
06:54:11 <bjoern_> well yes, but following the first rule is sufficient
06:54:41 <KragenSitaker> well, (a|a)a* has a shorter equivalent regex aa*, but that shorter equivalent regex doesn't obey rule #4, so it's disqualified
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06:55:33 <bjoern_> you have to start with aa* because that's the shortest way to write that
06:55:53 <bjoern_> (a|a)a* does not obey #2 so to speak
06:57:08 <KragenSitaker> oh, so #2 does not mean "there is no shorter equivalent RE that follows these four rules", but rather, "there is no shorter equivalent regex that obeys rule #1".
06:57:20 <bjoern_> yes
06:58:11 <bjoern_> Put differently, I have the shortest regex using only *; is it sufficient to recognize aa* = a+ to find the shortest regex using + where possible?
06:59:03 <KragenSitaker> that does seem to be an equivalent statement
07:00:25 <KragenSitaker> i suspect that you are correct, but it's not clear to me how to prove it
07:01:05 <est> KragenSitaker: hail
07:01:58 <KragenSitaker> hail, sir tiedemann
07:02:09 <KragenSitaker> how goes the struggle for the soul of the lambda-calculus?
07:02:55 <est> it goes well..my co-conspirators inspire me
07:03:39 <KragenSitaker> today i have been reading the codex of kranz
07:03:45 <est> ..though it may not be for the soul..more for one avatar of the lisp principle :)
07:04:01 <est> KragenSitaker: oh..ive got that here..nicely bound by yale
07:04:22 <est> ..and i groveled his code in the 80s
07:04:38 <KragenSitaker> it mentions that the first pass in the compilation is alpha-conversion --- renaming lexical variables to remove naming conflicts
07:05:00 <est> yes
07:05:16 <KragenSitaker> i am puzzled as to why he does this
07:05:48 <KragenSitaker> will it become clear as i read more of the book?
07:05:58 <bjoern_> Well if true, you could show that, assuming you have the shortest a+ regex, turning a+ into aa* would increase the length my the mininmal amout...
07:06:04 <bjoern_> by
07:06:36 <est> KragenSitaker: i think so..it makes later operations cleaner
07:06:42 <KragenSitaker> if you were reducing lambda-expressions lexically rather than by using environments, is this preemptive alpha-conversion sufficient to avoid later alpha-renaming?
07:07:11 <KragenSitaker> that is, to avoid later name captures if you don't continue alpha-renaming as you beta-reduce
07:07:21 <KragenSitaker> i have the feeling that it isn't sufficient, but i haven't been able to construct an example
07:07:38 <est> well, i think you may be right
07:08:16 <est> my LC is hazy..but i think that renaming has to occur on every application
07:08:38 <est> so this alpha conversion may be a different thing..confusingly named
07:09:26 <KragenSitaker> well, it's the same transformation, probably to avoid the same problem
07:09:47 <KragenSitaker> i'm just not clear why it's (a) necessary when you're using environments or (b) helpful when you aren't
07:10:38 <KragenSitaker> bjoern_: yes, that is true. you can construct some other variants because * distributes over ab and |, and ab distributes over |
07:10:40 <est> well, in the context of compilation, it makes a lot of transformations easier
07:11:12 <KragenSitaker> oh no it doesn't
07:11:36 <KragenSitaker> (a|b)* is not equivalent to a*|b*
07:11:41 <est> like constant folding..you can just go over the code replacing a symbol with the constant on the basis of eq()
07:11:56 <KragenSitaker> nor is (ab)* equivalent to a*b*
07:12:41 <KragenSitaker> oh, that makes sense, est
07:13:47 <est> you may want to check out appel's _compiling with continuations_
07:14:04 <KragenSitaker> i have a copy, and i have begun reading it in the past, but sadly it is in storage now
07:14:09 <est> it's sort of the next chapter after rabbit and orbit
07:14:29 <est> well, ive got a copy hanging loose here
07:14:45 <KragenSitaker> i haven't read rabbit
07:14:45 <est> though kranz alone is worthy also
07:14:56 <KragenSitaker> kranz comes highly recommended by shivers
07:15:02 <KragenSitaker> it's quite clear so far
07:15:39 <est> pleasantly terse too
07:15:40 <KragenSitaker> although maybe if i hadn't read partway through shivers' own dissertation, it would be more difficult
07:15:44 <KragenSitaker> yes
07:16:02 <KragenSitaker> i may have actually read the whole thing (shivers'), but i don't feel that i understand it
07:16:05 <KragenSitaker> at all
07:16:51 <est> well, shivers is one groovy guy..but the research track he was following may not have delivered much meat
07:17:12 <est> ..which can make it hard to see the point of things
07:17:33 <est> i think it's been built on and improved a bit since then
07:17:55 <KragenSitaker> really? i thought he succeeded in doing dataflow analysis for higher-order languages
07:18:02 <KragenSitaker> although not during the orbit project
07:19:09 <est> i think he wrote a retrospective piece on it
07:20:04 <est> anyhow, i second the kranz rec..and i know that dissertation pretty well and would be happy to discuss
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07:20:13 <KragenSitaker> thanks!
07:20:48 <est> some of the things he describes werent implemented and are not clearly flagged as such btw
07:20:53 <KragenSitaker> so you don't think dataflow analysis for scheme produced much useful?
07:21:02 <KragenSitaker> kranz?
07:21:07 <est> yes
07:21:12 <est> (kranz)
07:21:45 <KragenSitaker> i sort of had the impression that a lot of cmucl's optimizations were contingent upon the ability to do shivers-style dataflow analysis on CL
07:22:06 <KragenSitaker> and perhaps that stalin might have been useful to somebody
07:22:12 <KragenSitaker> although i myself haven't found it useful
07:22:37 <est> well, i think ill just partially plead ignorance :)
07:23:01 <KragenSitaker> i should probably take the time to implement something orbitlike
07:23:27 <KragenSitaker> before i go off and try to simultaneously learn how to write good compilers, and how to optimize bicicleta's language
07:25:21 <est> KragenSitaker: http://www-static.cc.gatech.edu/~shivers/citations.html#cfa-retro
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07:29:16 <est> actually, back in the 80s i figured out a linear-time implementation of the "escape analysis" kranz characterizes (exponentially) in his dissertation :o
07:29:29 <KragenSitaker> awesome!
07:29:47 <est> i think that escape analysis was one of the unimplemented things
07:30:05 <KragenSitaker> thanks!
07:30:10 <KragenSitaker> stalin does use escape analysis
07:30:43 <est> i guess that's an example of a tractable sub-space of cfa
07:31:14 <est> i think there are a lot of those going around :)
07:34:12 <KragenSitaker> help! i need to be inoculated against tractable subspaces of control-flow analysis!
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07:43:50 <Monty> yo Morbus!
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08:04:35 <Monty> hi alienbrain, how ya doing?
08:04:38 <phenny> Monty: shh, don't let anyone know you're around!
08:04:39 <Monty> basically: for them around it...
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08:28:44 <sbp> yo
08:28:58 <sbp> overnight I had like twenty emails from Peru
08:29:07 <sbp> up to three videos of the lights now
08:29:14 <sbp> just munging them now into managable clips
08:30:03 <sbp> (and using iMovie HD! ooh)
08:30:22 <laplink> Not `08?
08:30:41 <bjoern_> SAY NO TO ANACHRONISMS!
08:31:57 <thelsdj> sbp: did you see: http://swhack.com/logs/2007-08-16#T21-28-22 ?
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08:33:28 <bjoern_> I don't think your question is very clear
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08:34:57 <bjoern_> Are you asking whether there is a term for, <1> if you imagine that you imagine that you imagine ... to ask whether there is a term for <goto 1>?
08:37:24 <thelsdj> that was an example of the more general idea of just imagining a conversation where you explain that you were imagining the conversation, etc
08:38:21 <thelsdj> and when this happens you then have to imaging that you are explaining that you were imagining the conversation, and then you have to explain that you were imagining explaining that you were imagining...
08:39:04 <thelsdj> so the question is, is there a term for this sort of situation, and if not, there really should be one
08:41:41 <bjoern_> So, like filming the monitor that's showing what you are currently filming?
08:42:04 <thelsdj> and in a mental way that you can't really break out of, while maintaining the current thought process
08:42:43 <thelsdj> as soon as you make the initial mention of imagining the conversation, you're screwed
08:43:13 <bjoern_> Well you have to start at the bottom, and add layer upon layer...
08:43:59 <bjoern_> .wik Video feedback
08:44:02 <phenny> "Optical feedback is the optical equivalent of acoustic feedback." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_feedback
08:44:33 <thelsdj> so maybe Mental Feedback, or Cognitive Feedback or something like that
08:45:04 <bjoern_> Well it's a feedback loop up to some point.
08:45:56 <laplink> Temporal Feedback Loop.
08:46:20 <bjoern_> Thinking under the influence...
08:47:11 <bjoern_> .g apod
08:47:14 <phenny> bjoern_: http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/
08:49:46 <bjoern_> http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ap070814.html is great
08:52:44 <laplink> .wik Strange loop
08:52:46 <phenny> "A strange loop arises when, by moving up or down through a hierarchical system, one finds oneself back where one started." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strange_loop
08:52:51 <bjoern_> .calc c over 100km/s
08:52:53 <phenny> the speed of light over (100 (kilometers / second)) = 2 997.92458
08:53:13 <laplink> .calc c in fiber optic cable
08:53:15 <phenny> laplink: Sorry, no result.
08:53:46 <laplink> For reference, the speed of light in optical fibre is about 30% less than in a vacum.
08:54:26 <bjoern_> .calc c*.7
08:54:28 <phenny> the speed of light * .7 = 209 854 721 m / s
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08:55:12 <laplink> For really long hauls of fibre — transatlantic, say — the speed of light is a significant limiting factor.
08:56:54 <laplink> .wik Image:DrawingHands.jpg
08:56:57 <phenny> "Image" - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:DrawingHands.jpg
08:57:10 <laplink> thelsdj: That about sum it up?
08:57:29 <sbp> the main thing that that definition loses is that you always feel like you're ascending, but you find that you get back where you started
08:57:53 <sbp> it's as if you were adding numbers successively starting at 0 and after 1000 you went back to 0 again
08:58:03 <bjoern_> OVERFLOW
08:58:16 <sbp> hence: strange
08:58:16 <sbp> heh, aye
08:58:16 <sbp> MININT
09:00:10 <bjoern_> Hmm Monty's brain http://www.mi.sanu.ac.yu/vismath/visbook/szilassi/Image1196.gif
09:00:12 <Monty> Title: FBJS - provides specific product
09:00:53 <thelsdj> the important thing about what i was bringing up was the conversational aspect of it, theres no way to actually finish explaining, even if you say ", etc" you've left out one loop in the explanation
09:00:56 <laplink> Speaking of rollover; network traffic has grown to the point where network equiment has had, for some years now, to switch from 32bit to 64bit counters.
09:01:28 <sbp> .calc 2 ** 32
09:01:30 <phenny> 2 ** 32 = 4 294 967 296
09:01:31 <sbp> .calc 2 ** 64
09:01:35 <phenny> 2 ** 64 = 1.84467441e19
09:02:04 <laplink> Hmm. Actually, the Escher drawing does have a termination condition; just an impossible starting condition.
09:02:15 <sbp> or vice versa?
09:02:19 <bjoern_> Speaking of 64, http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ap070802.html
09:04:15 <bjoern_> Ah...
09:04:22 * bjoern_ arrives at the disturbing http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ap070717.html again
09:05:18 <sbp> er...
09:05:26 <sbp> wow, that's disturbing
09:05:38 * sbp had to verify it with DigitalColor Meter
09:05:55 * laplink was about to fire up Photoshop…
09:06:10 <laplink> That's… really creepy.
09:07:11 * bjoern_ notes clicking on it gives http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/image/0707/samecolor_wikipedia_connected.jpg
09:07:19 <sbp> yeah, but even then... :-)
09:07:28 <sbp> (enclosing the region with your hands helps)
09:07:35 <laplink> Yeah, that doesn't seem persuasive to me; it looks like a gradient.
09:08:17 <bjoern_> drawing the line myself in 'shop worked for me...
09:08:19 <sbp> .eval 0xFFF
09:08:22 <phenny> 4095
09:08:33 <sbp> .calc 4096 ** 3
09:08:37 <phenny> 4 096 ** 3 = 68 719 476 736
09:10:16 <laplink> thelsdj: I suppose I don't have to remind you of…
09:10:17 <laplink> .wik The Neverending Story
09:10:20 <phenny> "The Neverending Story (German: Die Unendliche Geschichte) is a fantasy novel by Michael Ende, first published in Germany in 1979." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Neverending_Story
09:10:31 <thelsdj> yep
09:11:02 <sbp> 21:37:14 <thelsdj> woo, ordered my Sony Reader for $59.49
09:11:09 <sbp> thelsdj: Sony Reader?
09:11:21 <thelsdj> .g Sony Reader
09:11:24 <phenny> thelsdj: http://www.learningcenter.sony.us/assets/itpd/reader/
09:11:30 <thelsdj> hrm
09:11:43 <sbp> see, I was thinking that
09:11:52 <sbp> but I don't think it's available for $59.49...
09:12:01 <thelsdj> it is
09:12:06 <sbp> really? where?
09:12:09 <thelsdj> you need to get a sony credit card though
09:12:15 <sbp> aha
09:12:29 <est> sbp: peruvian lights?
09:12:38 <sbp> est: earthquake lights
09:12:45 <sbp> see http://inamidst.com/lights/earthquake
09:14:16 <thelsdj> interestingly, people have reported being able to order more than 1 sony reader for that low price!
09:14:23 <sbp> wow
09:14:45 <sbp> did yours arrive yet? whaddya think of it?
09:14:55 <sbp> oh, wait
09:14:59 <thelsdj> not yet, just ordered it today, as i just got the sony card today
09:14:59 <sbp> yesterday's Swhack logs
09:15:01 <sbp> guess not then :-)
09:15:07 <sbp> aye
09:15:14 <est> sbp: i seem to remember there was this guy in the 70s who thought that some "contact experiences" were the product of not-yet-understood geophysical processes
09:15:27 <sbp> est: oh? can you remember his name?
09:15:42 <sbp> Prof. Michael Persinger?
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09:16:04 <est> hmm..that doesnt ring a bell..but i may be able to dig it up
09:16:10 <thelsdj> oooh, ipv6
09:16:11 <sbp> that'd be very cool if you could
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09:17:09 <laplink> Dr. Albert Hofmann?
09:17:22 *** Xavier_ is now known as xavier
09:20:31 <bjoern_> I still haven't got an answer to this: suppose you have a regex using one or more + operators; you can write no shorter expression matching the same set of strings. Now you turn all "a+" bits into "aa*". Can you shorten the resulting expression without using "+"?
09:22:54 <laplink> bjoern_: No, due to CSMJ.
09:25:00 <bjoern_> What if you weren't limited by CSMJ?
09:26:14 <laplink> Then you could use the IAP to shorten it.
09:26:35 <bjoern_> the International Association of Prosecutors?
09:27:41 <laplink> The Improbable Algorithmic Proof.
09:29:18 <bjoern_> Wouldn't that perturbate the force?
09:29:52 <laplink> Not by a SSF.
09:29:58 <sbp> @title http://science.slashdot.org/science/07/08/16/1621233.shtml
09:30:29 <bjoern_> Tag: crystalineentity
09:30:54 <bjoern_> It's the whole Data vs Lore story again
09:31:24 <sbp> no supybot. huh
09:31:42 <laplink> Karma underflow?
09:31:47 <sbp> hehe
09:31:50 * bjoern_ was going to say just that...
09:32:02 <laplink> It's retreated to its secluded mountain IRC channel to meditate?
09:36:18 <sbp> .title http://science.slashdot.org/science/07/08/16/1621233.shtml
09:36:22 <phenny> sbp: Slashdot | Interstellar Dust Could Be "Alive"
09:36:31 <sbp> .title http://slashdot.org/articles/07/08/16/1541244.shtml
09:36:31 <laplink> neato
09:36:35 <phenny> sbp: Slashdot | Adobe May Launch Office Rival
09:36:44 <sbp> feel free to bugtest it. try to break it!
09:37:15 <laplink> .title sbp
09:37:18 <phenny> Can't connect to sbp
09:37:31 <sbp> we just can't connect
09:40:12 <laplink> .title ftp://ftp.avocent.com/public/product-upgrades/$DS1800/ACS/ACS%203.1.0-1/DSView%20Firmware.pkg
09:40:45 <phenny> laplink: No title found
09:40:52 <laplink> .title http://global.avocent.com/us/olh/ACS/v_3.1.0
09:40:55 <phenny> laplink: Document Moved
09:41:08 <laplink> Yes phenny, that's a redirect.
09:41:15 <laplink> Quite a few of them, actually.
09:42:35 <laplink> .title http://www.cisco.com/application/pdf/en/us/guest/products/ps7087/c2001/ccmigration_09186a0080859187.pdf
09:43:34 <phenny> laplink: No title found
09:43:44 * sbp fixes these bugs...
09:45:22 <laplink> .title http://web.archive.org/web/20050215180435/http://www.damowmow.com/playground/html-not-xml-2.html
09:45:31 <phenny> laplink:
09:46:23 <laplink> .title http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/ps8333/products_installation_guide_book09186a00808592c1.html
09:46:27 <phenny> laplink: Cisco TelePresence 3000 Assembly, Use & Care, and Field Replacement Unit Guide &nbsp; [Cisco TelePresence System 3000] - Cisco Systems
09:48:14 <sbp> .title http://www.cisco.com/application/pdf/en/us/guest/products/ps7087/c2001/ccmigration_09186a0080859187.pdf
09:48:18 <phenny> sbp: Document isn't HTML
09:48:25 <sbp> .title http://web.archive.org/web/20050215180435/http://www.damowmow.com/playground/html-not-xml-2.html
09:48:42 <phenny> sbp: [Title is the empty document, "".]
09:54:18 <bjoern_> GET YOUR OWN FREE COPY AT DATA:,
09:54:54 *** danja has quit ()
09:54:59 <sbp> hehe
09:55:16 *** Talliesin (n=Talliesi@83.70.80.115) has joined #swhack
09:55:16 <Monty> But what does Talliesin have to do with the price of fish?
09:55:18 <phenny> Hush there, Monty.
09:55:19 <Monty> he's got that doesn't like
09:56:58 <laplink> .title http://neutri.no/tmp/a.cgi
09:57:01 <phenny> laplink: Document isn't HTML
09:57:11 <laplink> Hmm.
09:57:36 <bjoern_> that makes IE blink a lot...
09:57:41 <sbp> .head http://neutri.no/tmp/a.cgi Content-Type
09:57:43 <phenny> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
09:57:47 <sbp> Firefox says it's "Not redirecting properly"
09:57:54 <bjoern_> .head http://neutri.no/tmp/a.cgi Location
09:57:57 <phenny> Location: http://neutri.no/tmp/b.cgi
09:57:59 <bjoern_> .head http://neutri.no/tmp/b.cgi Location
09:58:03 <phenny> Location: http://neutri.no/tmp/a.cgi
09:58:05 <bjoern_> there is why
09:58:08 <sbp> loope
09:58:40 <sbp> (which was obvious because that's the only reason that Firefox ever barfs on redirects; if there are too many)
09:59:12 <sbp> I haven't added redirects yet, at any rate :-)
09:59:20 <laplink> heh heh
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10:04:02 <bjoern_> I have two numbers a,b and need to turn them into a third number c.
10:04:17 <bjoern_> the best a is the smallest. the best b is the biggest. the best c is the biggest.
10:04:39 <bjoern_> a and b are >= 0
10:05:00 <bjoern_> with only "a" I would do c = a * -1
10:05:09 <bjoern_> I want to store b as fractional part
10:05:18 <bjoern_> gimme the math!
10:05:48 <bjoern_> I would be something like (a + (1 - 1/b)) * -1 or something...
10:05:59 <bjoern_> but my brain is not in math mode.
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10:09:30 *** phenny has quit (Remote closed the connection)
10:09:31 <bjoern_> add criterion: c < a + 1
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10:11:56 <sbp> .title http://neutri.no/tmp/a.cgi
10:12:08 <phenny> sbp: Too many redirects
10:12:09 <sbp> .title http://global.avocent.com/us/olh/ACS/v_3.1.0
10:12:12 <phenny> sbp: No title found
10:12:46 <sbp> (which is correct. there is no title)
10:13:41 <sbp> it barfs out after 25 redirects, incidentally
10:16:25 <sbp> .title http://inamidst.com/whits/2007/08
10:16:33 <phenny> sbp: Gallimaufry of Whits (2007-08)
10:16:41 <sbp> hmm, I thought I used a middot
10:16:56 <sbp> .title http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/ps8333/products_installation_guide_book09186a00808592c1.html
10:16:59 <phenny> sbp: Cisco TelePresence 3000 Assembly, Use & Care, and Field Replacement Unit Guide &nbsp; [Cisco TelePresence System 3000] - Cisco Systems
10:17:10 <sbp> .title http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/ps8333/products_installation_guide_book09186a00808592c1.html
10:17:13 <phenny> AttributeError: '_socketobject' object has no attribute 'output' (file "/home/sbp/phenny/modules/head.py", line 107, in e)
10:17:19 <sbp> sweet
10:17:55 <sbp> .title http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/ps8333/products_installation_guide_book09186a00808592c1.html
10:17:58 <phenny> sbp: Cisco TelePresence 3000 Assembly, Use & Care, and Field Replacement Unit Guide   [Cisco TelePresence System 3000] - Cisco Systems
10:18:36 <sbp> .title http://inamidst.com/data/%3Ctitle%3E%26middot%3B%26%23x203D%3B%3C/title%3E
10:18:39 <phenny> sbp: ·‽
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10:30:18 <sbp> huh: http://www.w3.org/TR/clipboard-apis/
10:30:23 <sbp> hadn't seen that before!
10:32:27 <sbp> wow, xkcd does a sci-fi joke that I just about get and actually find funny
10:32:33 <sbp> xkcd is truly special
10:46:17 <bjoern_> .gc "life is not a picnic"
10:46:19 <phenny> "life is not a picnic": 4,760
10:46:25 <bjoern_> .gc "Das Leben ist kein Picknick"
10:46:28 <phenny> "Das Leben ist kein Picknick": 2,240
10:46:46 <bjoern_> .gc "life is no picnic"
10:46:48 <phenny> "life is no picnic": 15,000
10:50:07 <sbp> .gc "life ain't a picnic"
10:50:09 <phenny> "life ain't a picnic": 43
10:50:10 <sbp> .gc "life ain't no picnic"
10:50:13 <phenny> "life ain't no picnic": 888
10:50:18 <sbp> ...
10:51:42 <bjoern_> .compare "picnic ne life" "life ne picnic"
10:51:45 <phenny> "picnic ne life" (0), "life ne picnic" (0)
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11:12:09 <bjoern_> .calc 1/0.1111
11:12:12 <phenny> 1 / 0.1111 = 9.00090009
11:12:14 <bjoern_> .calc 1/0.1000
11:12:15 <phenny> 1 / 0.1000 = 10
11:12:22 <bjoern_> .calc 1/0.0909
11:12:22 <phenny> 1 / 0.0909 = 11.0011001
11:13:40 <bjoern_> .g cpan dbl_epsilon
11:13:42 <phenny> bjoern_: http://search.cpan.org/src/EGROSS/Meschach-0.03/meschach-1.2/MACHINES/GCC/machine.h
11:13:48 <bjoern_> .g cpan posix dbl_epsilon
11:13:51 <phenny> bjoern_: http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?POSIX
11:14:37 <sbp> .calc 1/0.11111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111
11:14:40 <phenny> 1 / 0.11111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111 = 9
11:15:33 <sbp> .calc 1/0.1111111
11:15:34 <phenny> 1 / 0.1111111 = 9.0000009
11:15:38 <sbp> .calc 1/0.111111111
11:15:41 <phenny> 1 / 0.111111111 = 9.00000001
11:15:44 <sbp> .calc 1/0.11111111111
11:15:47 <phenny> 1 / 0.11111111111 = 9
11:15:52 <sbp> .calc 1/0.1111111111
11:15:54 <phenny> 1 / 0.1111111111 = 9
11:23:22 <bjoern_> lisppaste2: url?
11:23:22 <lisppaste2> To use the lisppaste bot, visit http://paste.lisp.org/new/swhack and enter your paste.
11:24:22 <lisppaste2> bjoern_ pasted "Algorithm::Evolve compressing regexn (boring)" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/46273
11:26:03 <lisppaste2> themaskedbandit annotated #46273 with "THE MASKED BANDIT SPEAKS" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/46273#1
11:26:43 <lisppaste2> bjoern_ annotated #46273 with "q" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/46273#2
11:27:35 <bjoern_> I'd like a heatmap that shows how often (a comes before b) for all pairs
11:27:47 <lisppaste2> themaskedbandit annotated #46273 with "THE MASKED BANDIT SPEAKS AGAIN" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/46273#3
11:28:41 <lisppaste2> bjoern_ annotated #46273 with "that's ... (read more inline!)" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/46273#4
11:29:31 <lisppaste2> themaskedbandit annotated #46273 with "THE MASKED BANDIT SPEAKS YET AGAIN" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/46273#5
11:30:24 <bjoern_> the numbers on the left, by the way, are the number of character classes in the resulting regex + 1 / the number of times where *maybe* "+" instead of "*" can be used.
11:31:36 <lisppaste2> bjoern_ annotated #46273 with "But why would MASKED BANDITS ..." at http://paste.lisp.org/display/46273#6
11:31:41 <sbp> why do the numbers start at 3?
11:32:31 <bjoern_> The numbers are states in the automaton; state 0 is unused, state 1 the initial state, and 2 the final state
11:33:17 <lisppaste2> themaskedbandit annotated #46273 with "THE MASKED BANDIT CONTINUES TO SPEAK" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/46273#7
11:33:46 <sbp> I see
11:34:12 <sbp> ooh, Firefox display bug
11:34:22 <sbp> your .svg numbers keep disappearing on scroll
11:34:23 <bjoern_> you don't remove the initial and final states (the algorithms works so that you remove a state by connecting its predecessors directly with its successors)
11:34:32 <bjoern_> huh?!
11:34:44 <sbp> the numbers are there. you scroll down. you scroll back. the numbers are gone
11:34:53 <sbp> the MASKED BANDIT has rustled them?
11:35:32 <sbp> hovering over an adjacent tab also causes the state of the numbers to change
11:35:34 <sbp> once it brought the numbers back, and once it removed them
11:36:53 <lisppaste2> bjoern_ annotated #46273 with "sucks!" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/46273#8
11:37:14 <sbp> if two people were MASKED BANDITS and they wanted to identify themselves to one another online, but without divulging that they were MASKED BANDITS to third parties, could they do that?
11:37:17 <bjoern_> the labels by the way are character classes; except "2", which is the empty string
11:37:45 <bjoern_> would they have a private comm channel?
11:38:03 <sbp> yes, but they don't know whether one another are MASKED BANDITS yet
11:38:30 <sbp> so crowd C contains MASKED BANDITS A and B
11:38:51 <lisppaste2> bjoern_ annotated #46273 with "q" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/46273#9
11:38:51 <sbp> A and B are unknown to one another. how do they make themselves known to one another, but not the rest of the group C?
11:39:28 <bjoern_> LET ME THINK ABOUT IT FOR A MOMENT!
11:39:46 <bjoern_> I expect myself to find the answer any moment now.
11:40:07 <lisppaste2> themaskedbandit annotated #46273 with "THE MASKED BANDIT ANSWERS" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/46273#10
11:40:24 <sbp> hmm
11:40:29 <bjoern_> So having thought about your question,
11:40:40 <sbp> perhaps we should've said "were masked bandits to hypothetically want to identify themselves..."
11:41:07 <sbp> I was thinking cryptographically it might be possible
11:41:15 <sbp> but... I can't think of a way
11:41:48 <bjoern_> I think the moment one determines the other is a MASKED BANDIT, he'd know the other ISNT a MASKED BANDIT
11:41:56 * crschmidt has an OLPC
11:42:00 <bjoern_> because MASKED BANDITS do not find out about each other online
11:43:44 <sbp> that's a good point
11:43:47 <sbp> but hypothetically
11:43:51 <sbp> MASKED BANDIT', say
11:43:55 <sbp> crschmidt: woah. how'd you score that?
11:43:58 <sbp> what's it like?
11:44:06 <crschmidt> Extremely hard to type on
11:44:16 <crschmidt> It's a loaner for the moment -- developing a mapping application for it
11:44:24 <crschmidt> borrowed it from sj klein (OLPC manager of content)
11:46:15 <Talliesi1> http://downloadcenter.samsung.com/content/EM/200603/20060328092233531/EN/sub03.html Love the "anykey" on the remote.
11:51:26 <crschmidt> It's also trivial to set up an emulator for it on a mac
11:51:51 <sbp> why hard to type?
11:52:05 <crschmidt> The keyboard is ridiculously tiny
11:52:09 <bjoern_> too sm.. right
11:52:26 <bjoern_> Well it might be okay for CHILDREN
11:52:30 <crschmidt> Yep.
11:52:35 <crschmidt> ANd small handed adults
11:55:56 <sbp> aha
11:56:26 <sbp> Talliesi1: heh!
12:01:26 *** Talliesi1 is now known as Talliesin
12:05:59 <bjoern_> .calc (2 * 1024^2) times 16 bit
12:06:01 <phenny> (2 * (1 024^2)) times 16 bit = 4 megabytes
12:07:02 <bjoern_> .calc (2 * 25^2) times 16 bit
12:07:03 <phenny> (2 * (25^2)) times 16 bit = 2.44140625 kilobytes
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12:23:50 <bjoern_> oooh with some luck the bugs in YAPE::Regex and Regexp::Parser that prevent them from parsing \x{...} escapes might be fixed today.
12:24:11 <bjoern_> I wrote the author this morning after my bug reports went unanswered for over a year...
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12:36:47 * sbp responds to dozens of Peruvians
12:40:28 <bjoern_> .calc 9!
12:40:30 <phenny> 9 ! = 362 880
12:41:30 <bjoern_> .calc phi!
12:41:32 <phenny> the golden ratio ! = 1.4492296
12:41:47 <bjoern_> .calc e!
12:41:49 <phenny> bjoern_: Sorry, no result.
12:47:58 <bjoern_> "Diebold Election Systems is now Premiere Election Solutions."
12:49:52 <bjoern_> .gc +donotwant
12:49:54 <phenny> +donotwant: 99,300
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12:59:34 <bjoern_> .gc "Classification: UNCLASSIFIED"
12:59:37 <phenny> "Classification: UNCLASSIFIED": 55,700
13:02:26 <sbp> still replying to people...
13:14:28 <sbp> whoo, done!
13:14:55 <crschmidt> .calc phi
13:14:58 <phenny> the golden ratio = 1.61803399
13:15:02 <sbp> it took me an hour and two minutes to reply to them all, apparently
13:15:20 <crschmidt> how do you do a factorial on a non-integer?
13:15:37 <sbp> hmm, dunno
13:15:39 <sbp> .wik Factorial
13:15:41 <sbp> .calc 5.5!
13:15:42 <phenny> "In mathematics, the factorial of a non-negative integer n is the product of all positive integers less than or equal to n. For example," - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Factorial
13:15:44 <phenny> 5.5 ! = 287.885278
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13:25:01 <bjoern_> .wik Gamma function
13:25:03 <phenny> "In mathematics, the Gamma function is an extension of the factorial function to real and complex numbers." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gamma_function
13:27:12 *** JibberJim (n=jim@81-86-174-182.dsl.pipex.com) has joined #swhack
13:29:48 <sbp> I... heh, now Peruvian radio is wanting to interview me
13:30:34 <perigrin> I'm on a Peruvian Radio ... woah oh ...
13:30:43 <perigrin> no just doesn't work like Mexican Radio ...
13:31:17 *** tommorris (n=tom@i-83-67-98-32.freedom2surf.net) has joined #swhack
13:32:03 <sbp> Dow opens, already up 1.1%
13:33:13 <perigrin> gonna be an interesting day if it's up 1.1% in 30 minutes ...
13:33:20 * perigrin is happy he's not in that industry anymore.
13:44:45 <sbp> .t -4
13:44:48 <phenny> Fri, 17 Aug 2007 09:44:32 -4
13:45:08 <Talliesi1> What you going to talk to the Peruvian listening public about?
13:46:14 <sbp> Talliesi1: http://inamidst.com/lights/earthquake
13:48:09 <perigrin> I like that you mention the Haiku is quoted ... and then proceed to quote it :)
13:48:29 <bjoern_> "Tanya Andersen Brings Class Action Against RIAA" - http://recordingindustryvspeople.blogspot.com/
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13:49:55 <Monty> yo JimJibber!
13:49:59 <Jabberwock> JIBBA
13:50:00 <bjoern_> phenny, de "Wortschoepfung"?
13:50:02 <phenny> bjoern_: "Word creation" (de)
13:50:04 <Jabberwock> Monty: Shut it
13:50:06 <Monty> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
13:50:24 <bjoern_> .compare "word creation" "Wortschoepfung"
13:50:27 <phenny> "word creation" (84,500), "Wortschoepfung" (1,500)
13:50:50 <Jabberwock> .compare .compare
13:50:52 <phenny> .compare (351,000,000)
13:50:54 <sbp> perigrin: yeah. *everybody* quotes it
13:50:58 <sbp> it's like a rule
13:59:11 <bjoern_> "This class action is flaming ridiculous. I was cought massively distributing their premium music files and was requested to pay the settlement fee - which I gladly did. In fact, the Settlement Centre was very generous indeed and reduced it from $20k to $10k!" - http://www.p2pnet.net/story/13077
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14:01:21 * perigrin updates his phenny
14:01:30 *** kpreid (n=kpreid@cpe-24-59-154-165.twcny.res.rr.com) has joined #swhack
14:02:18 <sbp> perigrin: you might wanna get http://inamidst.com/phenny/modules/head.py again too for .title stuff
14:02:34 <Jabberwock> .compare sbp jabberwock
14:02:37 <phenny> sbp (3,770,000), jabberwock (965,000)
14:02:43 <Jabberwock> You son a A. Gun
14:02:50 <perigrin> is it not in the 8-11 tarball?
14:02:50 <Jabberwock> -a
14:03:06 <sbp> perigrin: nope, I wrote it this morning
14:03:08 <Jabberwock> stupid byte pointers
14:03:12 <perigrin> getting :)
14:03:19 *** schepers (n=schepers@cpe-069-134-123-228.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #swhack
14:03:35 <bjoern_> phenny, "Wundertuete"?
14:03:43 <sbp> http://inamidst.com/phenny/modules/weather.py has been updated with a minor bugfix too
14:03:46 <bjoern_> still broken!
14:03:57 <sbp> bjoern_: oh yeah, I didn't investigate that
14:04:02 *** jetscreamer has quit ()
14:05:33 <bjoern_> .title http://science.slashdot.org/science/07/08/17/1153252.shtml
14:05:37 <phenny> bjoern_: Slashdot | German Physicists Claim Speed of Light Broken
14:05:40 <bjoern_> Us again!
14:05:50 <perigrin> now I gotta remember how you reloaded her modules on the fly
14:06:07 <bjoern_> .reload perigrin
14:06:20 * perigrin reloads and keeps firing
14:06:46 <phenny> IOError: [Errno socket error] (110, 'Connection timed out') (file "/home/sbp/phenny/web.py", line 19, in get)
14:07:15 <sbp> phenny, "Wundertuete"?
14:07:46 <bjoern_> Impressive.
14:08:02 <sbp> bjoern_: sounds like the EPR effect
14:08:12 <sbp> the phenny error seems like a network thing
14:08:14 <sbp> so not her fault
14:08:20 <sbp> she is replying, when the error happens
14:08:26 <bjoern_> phenny, de "Wundertuete"?
14:08:28 <phenny> bjoern_: "Miracle bag" (de)
14:08:31 <sbp> she just has a long timeout. she tries 'n' tries
14:08:41 <sbp> the timeout must be to the language guesser
14:08:48 *** littledan (n=littleda@c-66-31-46-131.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #swhack
14:08:51 *** JibberJim has quit (Connection timed out)
14:08:53 <bjoern_> that could make sense
14:09:18 <bjoern_> I thought you were using some crappy 20 lines python code thingy to guess the language
14:09:30 <bjoern_> I mean, you don't need much more for the great results we tend to get...
14:10:00 <sbp> indeed
14:10:06 <sbp> the site I'm using sucks balls
14:10:10 <sbp> I'll try using a different one
14:10:17 <crschmidt> language detection on short strings sucks, period
14:10:27 <phenny> IOError: [Errno socket error] (110, 'Connection timed out') (file "/home/sbp/phenny/web.py", line 19, in get)
14:11:04 <bjoern_> Well avoding misdetection of german as japanese isn't that hard really...
14:11:50 <bjoern_> "We shall call this new Technology: -- Way to go Anywhere Really Phast -- Or WARP"
14:11:59 <marnanel> I THINK WE SHOULD CALL IT YOUR GRAVE
14:12:34 <sbp> phenny, "Wortschoepfung"?
14:12:37 <phenny> sbp: "Word creation" (de)
14:12:40 <sbp> phenny, "Wundertuete"?
14:12:41 <bjoern_> Good nobody asks you, then.
14:12:43 <phenny> sbp: "Miracle bag" (de)
14:12:45 <laplink> .weather ENTC
14:12:48 <phenny> ENTC at 15:50 (13:50Z): Cloudy, 14℃, 989mb, Light breeze 3m/s (5kt) (↑)
14:12:50 <sbp> bjoern_: how's that?
14:12:56 <laplink> .weather *
14:12:58 <laplink> .weather .*
14:13:02 <bjoern_> phenny, "Objekt der Begierde"?
14:13:05 <phenny> bjoern_: Hmm, got 'dutch'...
14:13:12 <bjoern_> [28 Jul 06 19:59] * phenny * bjoern_: Hmm, got 'frisian'...
14:13:15 <bjoern_> for the same...
14:13:22 <sbp> hehe
14:13:27 <sbp> well this is using a new service of course
14:13:29 <bjoern_> phenny, "Heute ist das Ende aller Tage..."?
14:13:32 <phenny> bjoern_: "Today is the end of all days..." (de)
14:13:36 <sbp> so it's shitty in an entirely new way
14:13:38 <bjoern_> [15 Aug 06 02:58] * phenny * bjoern_: Hmm, got 'middle_frisian'...
14:13:52 <bjoern_> phenny, "Fuck all y'all!"?
14:13:53 <sbp> there you go, that's some improvement
14:13:55 <phenny> bjoern_: "Fuck all y'all!" (de)
14:13:56 <bjoern_> [24 May 07 12:28] * phenny * xover: Hmm, got 'frisian'...
14:13:58 <sbp> phenny, "testing 2"?
14:14:02 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got 'tagalog'...
14:14:02 <bjoern_> it's better
14:14:11 <chris2> phenny, "gemütlichkeit"?
14:14:15 <phenny> chris2: "cosiness" (de)
14:14:21 <perigrin> .wik KPWF
14:14:24 <phenny> Can't find anything in Wikipedia for "KPWF".
14:14:26 <perigrin> grr
14:14:28 <perigrin> .weather KPWF
14:14:30 <phenny> KPWF: no such ICAO code
14:14:34 <perigrin> hmm
14:14:37 <bjoern_> phenny, "OH NEIN NICHT DAS UMLAUTUNGEHEUER!"?
14:14:39 <phenny> bjoern_: "OH NO NOT THE UMLAUT MONSTER!" (de)
14:14:40 <bjoern_> [04 Aug 06 19:13] * phenny * bjoern_: Hmm, got 'chinese-big5'...
14:14:54 <bjoern_> phenny: "puttin' tha maether toung on the wab!"?
14:15:00 <bjoern_> [09 Aug 06 17:33] * phenny * perigrin: Hmm, got 'scots'...
14:15:20 <bjoern_> phenny, "yr adenydd yn yr awyr"?
14:15:24 <phenny> bjoern_: Hmm, got 'welsh'...
14:15:25 <bjoern_> [15 Aug 06 02:49] * phenny * kpreid: Hmm, got 'welsh'...
14:15:29 <sbp> phenny: "puttin' tha maether toung on the wab"?
14:15:37 <sbp> phenny: "puttin tha maether toung on the wab"?
14:15:38 <sbp> DO IT
14:15:42 <bjoern_> phenny, "ゼルダの伝説 ãƒ\~ジュラの仮面"?
14:15:46 <phenny> bjoern_: "?????? ?~??????" (es)
14:15:54 <sbp> heh
14:15:55 <perigrin> si!
14:16:18 <bjoern_> phenny, "×ullet יליאם שייקספיר"?
14:16:20 <phenny> bjoern_: Hmm, got 'latin'...
14:16:29 <bjoern_> [23 May 07 16:06] * phenny * bsh: Hmm, got 'yiddish-utf'...
14:16:49 <perigrin> phenny "mork mork mork"?
14:16:55 <sbp> phenny: "יליאם שייקספיר"?
14:16:57 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got 'esperanto'...
14:16:58 <sbp> perigrin: try a colon
14:17:00 <perigrin> phenny, "mork mork mork"?
14:17:02 <sbp> esperanto!
14:17:02 <phenny> perigrin: Hmm, got 'dutch'...
14:17:06 <sbp> heh!
14:17:18 <perigrin> silly phenny ... it's sweedish!
14:17:28 <sbp> phenny: "bork bork bork"?
14:17:32 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got 'norwegian'...
14:17:35 <sbp> hahahaha
14:17:48 <perigrin> which actually all the Sweeds I've met say that it is.
14:18:20 <perigrin> phenny, "jungle bunny monkey pants"
14:18:25 <perigrin> phenny, "jungle bunny monkey pants"?
14:18:28 <phenny> perigrin: Hmm, got 'manx'...
14:18:31 * perigrin always forgets the punctuation
14:19:40 <Arnia> phenny, "diuretic commandos"?
14:19:40 <sbp> I'll try 'n' use an even better guessor
14:19:43 <phenny> Arnia: "diuretic commandos" (es)
14:22:16 <bjoern_> .title http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9031139
14:22:19 <phenny> bjoern_: Infected job search sites lead to info theft for 46,000
14:23:58 <kpreid> phenny: "ad hoc"?
14:24:00 <phenny> kpreid: Hmm, got 'icelandic'...
14:24:08 <kpreid> phenny: "ad nauseam"?
14:24:11 <phenny> kpreid: Hmm, got 'icelandic'...
14:26:12 <perigrin> Iceland ... last of the Roman Outposts.
14:26:29 *** littledan_ (n=littleda@c-66-31-46-131.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #swhack
14:26:32 *** littledan has quit (Connection reset by peer)
14:26:56 <Arnia> phenny: "anaerobic sluices"?
14:26:59 <phenny> Arnia: Hmm, got 'latin'...
14:27:21 <perigrin> phenny: "keflavik"?
14:27:56 <sbp> please hold the line. I'm testing the new guesser
14:28:10 * bjoern_ drops the line
14:28:13 <sbp> CLEARLY IT SI NOT GOING WELL, OMG?
14:28:21 * Arnia picks up the line and sends it to the badgers
14:28:33 <Jabberwock> mushroom mushroom.
14:28:34 * kpreid toes the line
14:28:41 * perigrin sets his super spy squirrels to following the badgers
14:28:44 <sbp> kpreid! Arnia!
14:28:47 <sbp> et al.
14:28:52 * Arnia blows up Jabberwock for a bad joke
14:28:54 * crschmidt crosses the line.
14:28:56 <Arnia> sbp!
14:29:06 *** klutometis (i=klutomet@24-205-75-190.dhcp.psdn.ca.charter.com) has joined #swhack
14:29:12 <Jabberwock> I can not be blown up. I'm an RP god moder. Suck my tail.
14:29:13 <sbp> klutometis!
14:29:32 <Jabberwock> (please)
14:29:33 <klutometis> sbp!
14:29:41 <bjoern_> asl?
14:30:38 *** littledan_ is now known as littledan
14:31:37 * Arnia straps Jabberwock to Monty
14:31:37 <Monty> now, to pick up 1.1%
14:34:32 <Jabberwock> I'm very aroused
14:34:55 <Jabberwock> Monty: Can I tickle you?
14:34:57 <Monty> ahhhhhhhhhh here trying to me!
14:35:28 <Jabberwock> lol.. sounded a little discordant
14:36:03 <bjoern_> perverts.
14:36:16 <Jabberwock> voyeur.
14:36:22 <dahut> bjoern_: My inner child is approaching screwing velocity.
14:36:31 <jsled> wow.
14:36:40 <Jabberwock> lol wtf
14:36:48 <jsled> Monty: what's your screwing velocity?
14:36:48 <Monty> What about your own screwing velocity ?
14:37:01 <Jabberwock> lol that was a Dr. Sbaitso response
14:37:08 <bjoern_> .g screwing velocity spaceballs
14:37:10 <phenny> bjoern_: http://science.slashdot.org/science/06/09/27/129238.shtml
14:37:21 <jsled> WTF?
14:37:36 <Jabberwock> comb the desert!
14:38:29 <bjoern_> It's not funny when you say it.
14:38:59 <Jabberwock> Thanks Mr bjoern_ :(
14:39:26 <bjoern_> It's just what they pay me for.
14:39:48 <sbp> phenny: "bork bork bork"?
14:39:52 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "norwegian"...
14:40:00 <sbp> phenny, "jungle bunny monkey pants"?
14:40:03 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "en"...
14:40:07 <Jabberwock> what's that aboot?
14:40:08 <sbp> phenny: "anaerobic sluices"?
14:40:09 <bjoern_> ...
14:40:11 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "irish"...
14:40:18 <Jabberwock> phenny: "i trollberg och skug"?
14:40:20 <sbp> phenny, "mork mork mork"?
14:40:20 <phenny> Jabberwock: Hmm, got "swedish"...
14:40:23 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "en"...
14:40:36 <Jabberwock> is that through google?
14:40:38 <sbp> phenny: "יליאם שייקספיר"?
14:40:42 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "hebrew"...
14:40:46 <bjoern_> ...
14:40:46 <sbp> phenny, "yr adenydd yn yr awyr"?
14:40:50 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "welsh"...
14:40:51 <Jabberwock> wlesh!
14:40:54 <bjoern_> This one is not better...
14:40:55 <sbp> phenny, "OH NEIN NICHT DAS UMLAUTUNGEHEUER!"?
14:40:55 <Jabberwock> yeah.
14:40:59 <phenny> sbp: "OH NO NOT THE UMLAUT MONSTER!" (de)
14:41:06 <sbp> phenny: "puttin' tha maether toung on the wab!"?
14:41:08 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "en"...
14:41:17 <Jabberwock> How do you type those throatily tick-tock noises that natives do?
14:41:19 <sbp> bjoern_: not better, but more accurate! :-)
14:41:28 <sbp> .cp click
14:41:29 <phenny> 01C0: LATIN LETTER DENTAL CLICK (ǀ)
14:41:29 <perigrin> sbp, except for the scots
14:41:30 <phenny> 01C1: LATIN LETTER LATERAL CLICK (ǁ)
14:41:31 <phenny> 01C2: LATIN LETTER ALVEOLAR CLICK (ǂ) [...]
14:41:34 <bjoern_> sbp: Hmm, got "en"...
14:41:38 <sbp> perigrin: well, yes
14:41:46 <sbp> bjoern_: what do you want it to output for English things?
14:42:00 <Jabberwock> phenny: "forsooth do i bequeath"
14:42:02 <Jabberwock> phenny: "forsooth do i bequeath"?
14:42:04 <phenny> Jabberwock: Hmm, got "en"...
14:42:06 <sbp> <phenny> OMG IT SI ALREADY TRONSLATROED?! ALAGOAL!ON!
14:42:08 <Jabberwock> OLD en bastard
14:42:12 <jsled> Hmm. I'm adding "affinity groups" to our dispatching layer. So we can divide the system up into "foreground" and "background" clusters that prefer to call within themselves, but failover to the others if need be...
14:42:12 <bjoern_> the default language for this channel. So either german or klingon.
14:42:13 <sbp> hehe
14:42:17 <kpreid> phenny: "coi do'u ko tersmu dei"?
14:42:21 <phenny> kpreid: Hmm, got "latvian"...
14:42:27 <bjoern_> can't you do en -> ja -> en or something?
14:42:40 <sbp> hmm, that's a good idea
14:42:43 <Jabberwock> sbp is gonna be busy :)
14:42:57 <Arnia> An en-to-en translation protocol?
14:43:00 <Jabberwock> doesn't dictionary.com have a translator api?
14:43:07 <Jabberwock> or babblefish
14:43:28 <kpreid> .gc "end-to-end translation"
14:43:31 <phenny> "end-to-end translation": 1,090
14:43:33 <kpreid> .gc "en-to-en translation"
14:43:34 <perigrin> phenny, "eorles andwlitan, on hine ymb monig"?
14:43:35 <phenny> "en-to-en translation": 1
14:43:39 <phenny> perigrin: Hmm, got "en"...
14:43:39 <jsled> From the perspective of a node, there's the nodes you prefer to dispatch to, and the other ones. I'm trying to figure out the terminology for referring to the groups. affine" and "non-affine" just don't seem right. But "our" and "other" don't either.
14:43:56 <jsled> "us" vs. "them" is just cumbersome.
14:44:07 <jsled> "friendly" vs. "hostile" isn't right either.
14:44:18 <kpreid> jsled: hmm...
14:44:38 <perigrin> Jabberwock, that is old english :)
14:44:51 * perigrin however had to cheat
14:44:51 <Jabberwock> damn
14:44:55 <kpreid> jsled: "near" and "far"?
14:45:16 *** DrBacchus (n=rbowen@apache/committer/rbowen) has joined #swhack
14:45:17 <perigrin> picked a line at random from my copy of Beowulf
14:45:37 <sbp> phenny: reload translate
14:45:40 <phenny> sbp: <module 'modules.translate' from '/home/sbp/phenny/modules/translate.py'> (version: 2007-08-17 14:45:18)
14:45:46 <jsled> kpreid: the distance metaphor doesn't quite fit, though I've used it in the past for other relations.
14:46:00 <sbp> phenny: "this is clearly some English text, and that is obvious even to Monty"?
14:46:02 <Monty> magnifies volume-control...?
14:46:04 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "en"...
14:46:07 <sbp> rats
14:46:16 <jsled> kpreid: Maybe "preferred" and "notPreferred" or something.
14:46:18 <sbp> phenny: "coi do'u ko tersmu dei"?
14:46:21 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "latvian"...
14:46:36 <Arnia> phenny, "compounding cheesecake"?
14:46:39 <phenny> Arnia: Hmm, got "en"...
14:46:57 <kpreid> phenny: "coi do'u ko pe'u tersmu dei"?
14:46:59 <sbp> phenny: reload translate
14:47:00 <phenny> kpreid: Hmm, got "latvian"...
14:47:01 <phenny> sbp: <module 'modules.translate' from '/home/sbp/phenny/modules/translate.py'> (version: 2007-08-17 14:46:43)
14:47:02 <sbp> phenny: "this is clearly some English text, and that is obvious even to Monty"?
14:47:03 <Monty> I'll never win
14:47:07 <phenny> sbp: "This is the English text clearly, that is clear in Monty" (en -> ja -> en)
14:47:08 <sbp> nope
14:47:10 <Monty> if (housewife == bear) { chums fantasises about plentiful leather;}
14:47:14 <sbp> there we go
14:47:20 <kpreid> phenny: "coi do'u ko pe'u tersmu dei"?
14:47:24 <phenny> kpreid: Hmm, got "latvian"...
14:47:26 <sbp> phenny: "please munge this. how many babbles can fit in a lightbulb?"?
14:47:28 <kpreid> aw :)
14:47:31 <Jabberwock> Monty has some sick fetishes
14:47:31 <phenny> sbp: "Some noise can encounter lightbulb, this munge?" (en -> ja -> en)
14:47:31 <Monty> Are you are...
14:47:58 <sbp> phenny: "baby ducks sitting on the pond are cute"?
14:48:02 <phenny> sbp: "The duck of the baby who is put with the pond is lovely" (en -> ja -> en)
14:48:12 <sbp> I'll add a few more steps
14:48:17 <bjoern_> phenny, "Nordfriesland mutt blieven"?
14:48:20 <phenny> bjoern_: Hmm, got "swedish"...
14:48:50 <Jabberwock> phenny: "desine"
14:48:51 <Jabberwock> phenny: "desine"?
14:48:56 <phenny> Jabberwock: "desine" (fr)
14:48:59 <Jabberwock> it's latin dammit
14:49:12 <Jabberwock> don't throw that fr crap my way
14:49:13 <bjoern_> phenny, "I'll never win"?
14:49:16 <phenny> bjoern_: "I do not win under any condition" (en -> ja -> en)
14:49:21 <sbp> hahaha
14:49:27 <sbp> phenny: reload translate
14:49:29 <phenny> sbp: <module 'modules.translate' from '/home/sbp/phenny/modules/translate.py'> (version: 2007-08-17 14:49:05)
14:49:32 <sbp> phenny: "I'll never win"?
14:49:37 <phenny> sbp: "I do not win under any condition" (en -> ... -> en)
14:49:41 <kpreid> phenny: "Also, as with instructions, the sending side properly has wiggle room that the receiver does not in deciding how to use the protocol while staying within the semantics."?
14:49:41 <sbp> hmph
14:49:46 <phenny> kpreid: "Furthermore in the same way as the indication which remains fromsemantics, the movement where ind3ecidantcommentemployingthe whichdoes not have the side receiver of sendingacorrectementthepartmeasures time precisely." (en -> ... -> en)
14:49:57 <sbp> well it's doing en -> fr -> en -> de -> en -> ja -> en now
14:50:06 <bjoern_> what's with the white space anyway?
14:50:11 <sbp> phenny: "please munge this. how many babbles can fit in a lightbulb?"?
14:50:21 <phenny> sbp: "Does that designate the rumor of the munge some rankeinemlightbulbadapt which this is as the canned goods?" (en -> ... -> en)
14:50:24 <sbp> bjoern_: it's going through German
14:50:29 <sbp> where WHITESPACEDOESN'TEXIST
14:50:30 <Jabberwock> ... wow
14:50:41 <sbp> maybe I should use Spanish instead
14:50:45 <bjoern_> I CALL BUG
14:50:51 <Jabberwock> phenny: "eis verd geboran in des Christengottes zeit"?
14:50:54 <phenny> Jabberwock: "ice verd geboran in the Christian God time" (de)
14:50:56 *** littledan has quit (Connection timed out)
14:50:59 <bjoern_> I think it's your scraping, the old code had that too
14:51:03 <kpreid> sbp: can you ask phenny to translate to non-English?
14:51:07 <sbp> nope
14:51:13 <sbp> and nope
14:51:22 <sbp> phenny: reload translate
14:51:24 <phenny> sbp: <module 'modules.translate' from '/home/sbp/phenny/modules/translate.py'> (version: 2007-08-17 14:50:54)
14:51:32 <sbp> phenny: "Also, as with instructions, the sending side properly has wiggle room that the receiver does not in deciding how to use the protocol while staying within the semantics."?
14:51:37 <phenny> sbp: "As in the indication which on the one hand, is not inthepartdelacorrectement of the agitation and sends the receiver ofprotocoldelemployingthe of d3ecidantcomment, on the one hand the sidewhere he is remaining inlasem3antica." (en -> ... -> en)
14:51:47 <sbp> ah, maybe it is then
14:52:00 <sbp> I'll test this manually
14:52:06 <bjoern_> phenny, "Oh hm, no sign of paralyzing options..."?
14:52:11 <phenny> bjoern_: "Hm d ' Ohio state... there is no sample of the selection which is madehelpless" (en -> ... -> en)
14:52:16 <kpreid> phenny: "manual"?
14:52:19 <phenny> kpreid: "manual" (es)
14:53:03 <bjoern_> phenny, "brb...gotta help neighbor with anything because *I* am sooo unmotivated today ..."?
14:53:07 <phenny> bjoern_: "Being in the neighbor of all things... * unmotivated I sooo * now...you obtained brb in order to help" (en -> ... -> en)
14:53:34 <bjoern_> phenny, "As we all know, unmetered humourous oesophagus depends on floating seventh CrustyGeek"?
14:53:42 <phenny> bjoern_: "Because d3ejenos has known him in us, dependsdusepti2emehumourousofthe esophagus unmetered which floats CrustyGeek" (en -> ... -> en)
14:54:34 <sbp> I apologise to your language
14:54:34 <bjoern_> phenny, "okay I need to write clipboard manipulation magics"?
14:54:37 <phenny> bjoern_: "Necessity of the approval I which writes the board which is small toofthe of direction delmagics" (en -> ... -> en)
14:54:39 <sbp> phenny: reload translate
14:54:41 <phenny> sbp: <module 'modules.translate' from '/home/sbp/phenny/modules/translate.py'> (version: 2007-08-17 14:54:10)
14:54:43 <bjoern_> ACCEPTED
14:54:44 <sbp> phenny, "As we all know, unmetered humourous oesophagus depends on floating seventh CrustyGeek"?
14:54:47 <sbp> yay
14:54:49 <phenny> sbp: "All ways we to reach it depends on that itself 7 are moved back and forth knowing the humourous esophagus, unmetered. CrustyGeek" (en -> ... -> en)
14:54:53 <sbp> and offer you... a fix!
14:54:59 <sbp> en -> de -> en -> ja -> en
14:55:14 <bjoern_> yay
14:55:16 <kpreid> phenny: "Attempting to save image file."?
14:55:16 <bjoern_> phenny, "I'll never win"?
14:55:21 <phenny> bjoern_: "I do not win under any condition" (en -> ... -> en)
14:55:21 <sbp> phenny: "dear translator, how do you translate things? regards, me"?
14:55:26 <phenny> sbp: "The translator who becomes love, how is thing translated? Point, I" (en -> ... -> en)
14:55:29 <phenny> kpreid: "The attempt which stores the image document." (en -> ... -> en)
14:56:10 <bjoern_> phenny, "which was obvious because that's the only reason that Firefox ever barfs on redirects; if there are too many"?
14:56:14 <phenny> bjoern_: "It was clear because either one, that is the only reason of this Firefox in all barfs, address; If there are many even in remainder" (en -> ... -> en)
14:56:43 <sbp> phenny: "let there be light"?
14:56:46 <bjoern_> phenny, "i have the feeling that it isn't sufficient, but i haven't been able to construct an example"?
14:56:47 <phenny> sbp: "Then the left is the light/write" (en -> ... -> en)
14:56:50 <phenny> bjoern_: "I that am not sufficient, but I possess the thing feeling which is not ge$$$WESEN which is not competent example is designed" (en -> ... -> en)
14:57:04 <bjoern_> okay I think this is sufficiently entertaining for now!
14:57:09 <sbp> phenny: "ü-Ei"?
14:57:11 <bjoern_> thx111
14:57:13 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "estonian"...
14:57:14 <sbp> yeah, it's not too bad
14:57:16 <sbp> you're welcome!
14:57:24 <sbp> you and all your estonian surprise eggs
14:57:35 <bjoern_> phenny, "OH THE INHUuMANITY OF IT ALL! I... think I'll open a biscuit factory"?
14:57:39 <kpreid> phenny: "Now that I think about it, this is the 'best' that can possibly be done, given that the passing carries the problem along: that problem is (potentially) unique to that particular event-of-disconnection."?
14:57:39 <phenny> bjoern_: "Ohio state that INHUuMANITY entirely! When I open Biskuitfabrik, I. you think" (en -> ... -> en)
14:57:44 <phenny> kpreid: "It is possible perhaps, now it can accept me that remain concerning and to do, ' it is best ', you think there and carry problem it exceeds: This problem (perhaps) is single in the decrease which has separation this." (en -> ... -> en)
14:58:30 <bjoern_> phenny, "Does that have anything to do with the fact that your future wives to say you are not worthy of I since you perhaps was not worthy of any woman and I deserve a man wholly devoted to I ?"?
14:58:34 <phenny> bjoern_: "To that it is inadequate perhaps from all women, it can lift up me altogether and being to obtain the person who is I there is everything which it should make the fact that in order your future wife there is no I and to say it is appropriate, in you?" (en -> ... -> en)
14:59:22 <bjoern_> phenny, "well there are varying degrees of certainty, if you are 66% sure of something, are you really sure about it?"?
14:59:26 <phenny> bjoern_: "If as for the well 66% year old which to that somewhat is from safety, it differed the guarantee over there, really it is certain, is?" (en -> ... -> en)
14:59:49 <kpreid> phenny: "e galan to nlaari et tor taarno der frunk"?
14:59:52 <phenny> kpreid: Hmm, got "danish"...
15:00:13 <bjoern_> phenny, "jeg hedder bjoern. hvor gamble er du?"
15:00:43 <bjoern_> phenny, "jeg hedder bjoern. hvor gamble er du"?
15:00:46 <phenny> bjoern_: Hmm, got "danish"...
15:00:50 <kpreid> sbp: when phenny says hmm, a translator is unavailable, yes?
15:00:57 <bjoern_> yes
15:01:10 <sbp> yeah
15:01:14 <sbp> just adding some new ones now though
15:01:22 <sbp> Chinese, Greek, Dutch, and Russian
15:01:27 <sbp> phenny: reload translate
15:01:28 <bjoern_> excellent
15:01:30 <phenny> sbp: <module 'modules.translate' from '/home/sbp/phenny/modules/translate.py'> (version: 2007-08-17 15:00:53)
15:01:31 <kpreid> phenny: "non-transitive network failures"?
15:01:39 <phenny> kpreid: Hmm, got "romanian"...
15:01:42 <sbp> phenny, "jeg hedder bjoern. hvor gamble er du"?
15:01:45 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "danish"...
15:01:50 <bjoern_> it's danish
15:01:53 <sbp> aye
15:01:55 <sbp> I'm stupid
15:01:58 <bjoern_> or what I remember danish to be ...
15:02:00 <bjoern_> phenny, "Go fuck a sunset, hippie"?
15:02:05 <sbp> phenny, "Objekt der Begierde"?
15:02:08 <phenny> sbp: "Object of the longing" (de)
15:02:10 <phenny> bjoern_: "Bumsen goes the sunset, the hippie" (en -> ... -> en)
15:02:14 <sbp> phenny, "mork mork mork"?
15:02:18 <phenny> sbp: "Mork of mork of mork" (en -> ... -> en)
15:02:34 <kpreid> phenny: "維基百科，自由的百科全書"?
15:02:37 <phenny> kpreid: "□base hundred branches, free hundred branches entire □" (zh)
15:02:59 <kpreid> phenny: "首頁"?
15:03:02 <phenny> kpreid: "□" (zh)
15:03:11 <sbp> phenny: "Hij zal mijn ziel in vrede verlossen van degenen die mij te na komen, want onder velen was hij met mij"?
15:03:13 <phenny> sbp: "He will release my soul in peace of those who me comes at after, because many were he with me" (nl)
15:03:38 *** alienbrain has quit (Remote closed the connection)
15:03:42 <bjoern_> phenny, "twe once said: I'm not saying that having differentiated put and delete are interesting in retrospect of the problems is that every new software patent increases the desire to break something to say on the cutting edge."?
15:03:48 <phenny> bjoern_: "One time you called twe: That itself the software patent where each is new in examination of the problem which is not I legend which puts in place distinction and deletion saying raising the craving which ardently breaks what of the mouths is interesting, it is." (en -> ... -> en)
15:03:56 <sbp> phenny: "Содержит, в отличие от словаря Зализняка, большое количество аббревиатур, составных слов, собственных имен, причастий."?
15:04:00 <phenny> sbp: "Contains, in contrast to the dictionary Of zaliznyaka, a large quantity of abbreviations, composite words, proper names, participles." (ru)
15:04:03 <sbp> phenny: "multifarious clockwork donkey"?
15:04:08 <phenny> sbp: "The multiform clock it sets up and is slow" (en -> ... -> en)
15:04:19 <sbp> where'd the donkey go?
15:04:26 <kpreid> it slowed
15:04:31 <sbp> ah
15:04:38 <bjoern_> phenny, "In Soviet Russia, donkey balls suck you"?
15:04:46 <phenny> bjoern_: "Sphere inhales with the Soviet Russian donkey" (en -> ... -> en)
15:04:47 <kpreid> phenny: "three-toed sloth"?
15:04:49 <sbp> hehe
15:04:51 <phenny> kpreid: "As for 3 3 sloth touching it is with the toe" (en -> ... -> en)
15:05:15 <kpreid> phenny: "As for 3 3 sloth touching it is with the toe"?
15:05:30 <phenny> kpreid: "There is with a toe which receives the influence of 3 3 in regard to sloth" (en -> ... -> en)
15:05:33 <bjoern_> phenny, "jcowan uses a keyboard on Windows that provides full Latin-1 while only affecting the AltGr key"?
15:05:40 <kpreid> phenny: "There is with a toe which receives the influence of 3 3 in regard to sloth"?
15:05:42 <phenny> bjoern_: "Only jcowan use AltGr and supply of Latin system 1 of emotion the keyboard of Windows which is not adjusted sufficiently," (en -> ... -> en)
15:05:42 <sbp> phenny: reload translate
15:05:44 <phenny> kpreid: "That gives with the toe which receives influence from 3 3 in regard to sloth," (en -> ... -> en)
15:05:44 <phenny> sbp: <module 'modules.translate' from '/home/sbp/phenny/modules/translate.py'> (version: 2007-08-17 15:05:18)
15:05:51 <sbp> phenny: "slightly better chain representation"?
15:05:56 <phenny> sbp: "Something improves chain indication" (en -...-> en)
15:06:00 <sbp> me!
15:06:08 <kpreid> phenny: "That gives with the toe which receives influence from 3 3 in regard to sloth,"?
15:06:12 <phenny> kpreid: "With the toe where that receives influence from 3 3 in regard to sloth and gives" (en -...-> en)
15:06:21 <kpreid> phenny: "With the toe where that receives influence from 3 3 in regard to sloth and gives"?
15:06:22 <bjoern_> phenny, "Hmm, got "danish"..."?
15:06:25 <phenny> bjoern_: Hmm, got "indonesian"...
15:06:25 <phenny> kpreid: "The toe which influence receives 3 from 3 in regard to sloth, gives and," (en -...-> en)
15:06:37 <kpreid> phenny: "The toe which influence receives 3 from 3 in regard to sloth, gives and,"?
15:06:41 <phenny> kpreid: "Influence it gives the toe which receives 3 from 3 in regard to sloth," (en -...-> en)
15:06:54 <kpreid> phenny: "Influence it gives the toe which receives 3 from 3 in regard to sloth,"?
15:06:58 <phenny> kpreid: "The toe where influence receives 3 from 3 to that in regard to sloth and gives" (en -...-> en)
15:07:04 <bjoern_> phenny, "One large one and five small numbers: 25, 2, 6, 4, 5, 9. Your target is 431. You have thirty seconds, tick, tock, tick, tock..."?
15:07:11 <phenny> bjoern_: "It is large, a quantity whose five is small: 25. 2, 6, 4, 5 and 9. Purpose is 431. 30 seconds, tock of tock and Haeckchen of Haeckchen... you pass those" (en -...-> en)
15:07:20 <sbp> phenny: "Hmm, got "indonesian"..."?
15:07:24 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "indonesian"...
15:07:24 <kpreid> phenny: "The toe where influence receives 3 from 3 to that in regard to sloth and gives"?
15:07:28 <phenny> kpreid: "The place where it receives 3 in influence considering sloth from 3, gives, the toe" (en -...-> en)
15:07:32 <kpreid> I quit
15:07:39 <kpreid> .g "machine translation fixed point"
15:07:41 <sbp> kpreid loses!
15:07:42 <phenny> "machine translation fixed point": sorry, no results were found.
15:08:00 <Tene> .gc kpreid loses
15:08:02 <phenny> kpreid loses: 869
15:08:10 <Tene> .gc sbp loses
15:08:10 <crschmidt> .gc kpreid wins
15:08:13 <phenny> sbp loses: 285,000
15:08:15 <phenny> kpreid wins: 479
15:08:21 <crschmidt> .gc sbp wins
15:08:23 <phenny> sbp wins: 41,100
15:08:33 <kpreid> .gc "kpreid loses"
15:08:33 <sbp> phenny: "Файловая почта! Файлы из интернета - почтовой бандеролью на CD/DVD"?
15:08:35 <phenny> "kpreid loses": 4
15:08:37 <crschmidt> .gc crschmidt wins
15:08:38 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "ru"...
15:08:40 <phenny> crschmidt wins: 518
15:08:44 <crschmidt> .gc crschmidt loses
15:08:46 <sbp> you can translate ru!
15:08:46 <phenny> crschmidt loses: 19,900
15:08:47 <Tene> .gc "tene wins"
15:08:47 <bjoern_> .compare [bjoern_ wins] [bjoern_ loses]
15:08:49 <phenny> "tene wins": 5
15:08:50 <crschmidt> wow
15:08:50 <phenny> bjoern_ loses (754), bjoern_ wins (287)
15:08:53 <crschmidt> i'm a big loser
15:09:00 <kpreid> .gc "crschmidt loses"
15:09:01 <phenny> "crschmidt loses": 1
15:09:07 <kpreid> no you aren't
15:09:08 <Tene> .gc "tene loses"
15:09:09 <phenny> "tene loses": 1
15:09:11 <bjoern_> .compare [sbp wins] [sbp loses]
15:09:11 <phenny> sbp loses (286,000), sbp wins (41,100)
15:09:23 <Tene> .compare [aero wins] [aero loses]
15:09:24 <phenny> aero loses (1,920,000), aero wins (574,000)
15:09:39 <bjoern_> .compare [Monty wins] [Monty loses]
15:09:40 <Monty> rats
15:09:40 <phenny> Monty loses (2,380,000), Monty wins (1,140,000)
15:09:41 <Monty> quite cracked it...
15:09:48 <crschmidt> kpreid: in what way? I (or others around me) have lost many times
15:10:15 <kpreid> please note the quoted form
15:10:25 <crschmidt> Oh, sure
15:11:07 <sbp> phenny: "Файловая почта! Файлы из интернета - почтовой бандеролью на CD/DVD"?
15:11:08 <crschmidt> but the fact that I have only explicitly lost once (compared ti winning twice, or the record) is irrelevant to the fact that my overall "myself and people arond me" win/loss ratio is 19,900:508
15:11:09 <phenny> sbp: "File mail! Files from the Internet - by post wrapper on CD/DVD" (ru)
15:11:12 <sbp> ah. weird
15:11:30 <sbp> phenny: "Знаменитости, голые знаменитости, фото знаменитостей :: Обсуждение"?
15:11:31 <phenny> sbp: "Celebrities, naked celebrities, the photo of celebrities:: the consideration" (ru)
15:11:38 <bjoern_> .calc 1:2
15:11:39 <phenny> bjoern_: Sorry, no result.
15:11:47 <crschmidt> .calc 19900/508
15:11:50 <phenny> 19 900 / 508 = 39.1732283
15:11:59 <crschmidt> .calc 285000/41100
15:12:01 <phenny> 285 000 / 41 100 = 6.93430657
15:13:26 <klutometis> it may be part of the shtick at swhack,
15:13:29 <klutometis> but it's occasionally difficulit to discern between anthropoid and android
15:13:33 <klutometis> turing test, anyone?
15:13:40 <sbp> klutometis: if it's voiced, it's a bot
15:13:58 <bjoern_> I am voiced.
15:13:59 *** MoiraA (i=moira@gateway/tor/x-70bff53b9861f7b8) has joined #swhack
15:14:05 <sbp> but yeah, that's still part of the sßsSSschtick
15:14:05 <klutometis> aha
15:14:26 <sbp> yo Moira
15:22:08 <thelsdj> mornin all
15:22:30 *** JimJibber is now known as JibberJim
15:24:34 <kpreid> phenny: "Excuse me, sir, but your name is on fire."?
15:24:38 <phenny> kpreid: "The gentleman to whom I can give reputation permit, but as for your name there is a fire." (en -...-> en)
15:25:53 * sbp posts an OWL recipe to Whits
15:25:57 <sbp> yo thelsdj!
15:26:11 <sbp> kpreid: hehe, that's a good one
15:26:38 <crschmidt> Why does the translaty thing sometimes tell the language and sometimes return a en -> foo -> en translation?
15:26:55 <crschmidt> phenny: "How sweet it is to be loved by you."?
15:26:59 <phenny> crschmidt: "As the candy is that proper, by you being loved." (en -...-> en)
15:27:53 <kpreid> phenny: "Excuse me, sir."
15:28:12 <bjoern_> because translating english to english does not make sense?
15:28:21 <sbp> crschmidt: if the input is English, she munges it. if the input is not English but is translatable to English, she translates it. if the input is neither English nor translatable, she tells you which language she thinks it is
15:28:26 <kpreid> phenny: "Excuse me, sir."?
15:28:29 <bjoern_> whereas translating english to -> something -> english does?
15:28:30 <phenny> kpreid: "Permit me." (en -...-> en)
15:28:58 <kpreid> phenny: "Excuse me, sir, but I'm leaving."?
15:29:00 <bjoern_> phenny, "Beat me with a clue stick"?
15:29:02 <phenny> kpreid: "The gentleman to whom I can give reputation permit, but I go away." (en -...-> en)
15:29:07 <phenny> bjoern_: "Strike me of the stick of the datum point" (en -...-> en)
15:29:16 <kpreid> okay, so the "but" is necessary
15:29:31 *** kpreid changed the topic to: "The Stick of the Datum Point"
15:29:38 <crschmidt> sbp: gotcha.
15:29:58 <sbp> phenny: "why would you do such a sweet naugty thing to a solemn tacky gentleman like her?"
15:30:02 <sbp> phenny: "why would you do such a sweet naugty thing to a solemn tacky gentleman like her"?
15:30:12 <bjoern_> CANT USE HIS OWN BOT!
15:30:12 <phenny> sbp: "Is sweet naugty thing the gentleman who has serious stickiness why done in that kind of ones which are that way?" (en -...-> en)
15:30:15 <kpreid> phenny: "gotcha"?
15:30:21 <sbp> can't spell naughty, either
15:30:24 <phenny> kpreid: Hmm, got "czech"...
15:30:42 <klutometis> phenny: The geography that I stands compares you superior.
15:30:47 <sbp> phenny: "iarj oiaj oiaj rgAORGJ AOPR ga ORGJ APO GJAOejgpoar fjpaeio jfapO EJFPAOr fjapojef poaef , OAJ rgpoaj rgpoa jga; IAJr gPIajr gpaor!"?
15:30:51 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "albanian"...
15:31:00 <kpreid> klutometis: the quotes and the question mark are quite necessary.
15:31:03 <bjoern_> phenny, "Welcome to the eternal chatroom of #Swhack"?
15:31:07 <phenny> bjoern_: "The # Swhack of Welcomely to eternal chatroom" (en -...-> en)
15:31:20 <klutometis> phenny: "The geography that I stands compares you superior?"
15:31:30 <bjoern_> phenny, Are the Quote Marks Necessary, I always Wondered?
15:31:45 <sbp> yes
15:31:52 * bjoern_ got that
15:31:52 <sbp> because I might introduce other syntaxen in future
15:32:08 <kpreid> phenny: "The geography that I stands compares you superior."?
15:32:09 <sbp> necessary not only technically, but rationally
15:32:11 <kpreid> klutometis: like that
15:32:12 <phenny> kpreid: "The excellence it compares the geography which stands because of I." (en -...-> en)
15:32:29 <kpreid> phenny: "inferiority complex"?
15:32:32 <phenny> kpreid: Hmm, got "romanian"...
15:32:45 <sbp> phenny: "Romanian inferiority complex?"?
15:32:50 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "romanian"...
15:33:01 <sbp> phenny: "Romanian inferiority complexes are something to be admired"?
15:33:07 <phenny> sbp: "The Rumanian inferiority complex being praised is something" (en -...-> en)
15:33:21 <klutometis> hmm, I guess the reverse mapping from engrish -> en is more difficult
15:33:32 <sbp> yes
15:36:36 <sbp> phenny: "jibba jabba jibba jabba jobba jibber jibba jabba"?
15:36:39 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "maltese"...
15:37:23 <sbp> phenny: "LOEL OMFG I SWA LIAEK 2 D0GZ an DEY WER D01N I7, LOLLL!!!!!"?
15:37:27 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "welsh"...
15:38:18 <sbp> phenny: "lol omg k thx bai roffle dongz wtf hehe"?
15:38:21 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "hungarian"...
15:39:38 <sbp> phenny: "open(Q,$0);while(<Q>){if(/^#(.*)$/){for(split('-',$1)){$q=0;for(split){s/\|/:.:/xg;s/:/../g;$Q=$_?length:$_;$q+=$q?$Q:$Q*20;}print chr($q);}}}print'\n';"?
15:39:42 <phenny> sbp: "open(Q, $0);while(){if(/^#(.*)$/){for(split('-', $1)){$q=0;for(split){s/\|/:.:/xg;s/:/../g;$Q=$_?length:$_;$q+=$q?$Q:$Q*20;}print chr($q);}}}print'\n;" (nl)
15:39:58 <sbp> perl = double dutch
15:41:28 <sbp> phenny: "Brunaim bairiþ bairka bogum laubans liubans liudandei"?
15:41:32 <phenny> sbp: Hmm, got "lithuanian"...
15:41:33 <sbp> (Gothic)
15:42:39 <thelsdj> phenny: "私はアダムです"?
15:42:43 <phenny> thelsdj: "I am Adam" (ja)
15:42:48 <sbp> :-)
15:43:00 *** crschmid1 (n=crschmid@mordor.metacarta.com) has joined #swhack
15:43:37 <crschmid1> phenny: "صحراء النفود"?
15:43:40 <phenny> crschmid1: Hmm, got "arabic"...
15:43:46 <bjoern_> phenny, "The version attribute indicates the version of the HTML. The default value is 4.0, which specifies that the result should be output as HTML conforming to the HTML 4.0 Recommendation "?
15:43:50 <phenny> bjoern_: "Edition shows the edition of attribute HTML. That value of the default the result should be used as HTML of agreement of the nomination of HTML 4,0 and 4,0, that it appointed, is" (en -...-> en)
15:44:14 <crschmid1> phenny: "اللغة العربية"?
15:44:18 <phenny> crschmid1: Hmm, got "arabic"...
15:45:37 <bjoern_> phenny, "Was du nicht willst, was man dir tut, das fuege auch keinem anderen zu"?
15:45:41 <phenny> bjoern_: "Which you do not want, what one does you, cause also to no different one" (de)
15:45:59 <bjoern_> phenny, "Which you do not want, what one does you, cause also to no different one"?
15:46:03 <phenny> bjoern_: "And you do not desire to cause separately 1 Tsuga is done or, which" (en -...-> en)
15:47:53 *** crschmid1 has quit (Client Quit)
15:49:02 <sbp> phenny: "They are a small POTENTIOMETER, short circuits and a beer of malzes of the tea."?
15:49:07 <phenny> sbp: "Those are the potentiometer, the circuit and the beer whose of shortage malzes of brown is small." (en -...-> en)
15:49:15 <sbp> phenny: "I'm a little teapot, short and stout"?
15:49:19 <phenny> sbp: "I am small teekanne, short circuit and stout" (en -...-> en)
15:50:32 <bjoern_> phenny, "We wish to congratulate you over your email success in our computer balloting sweepstake held on 2nd, August,2007.This is a Millennium Scientific Computer Game in which email addresses were used"?
15:50:32 *** Moira (n=moira@AC8FE490.ipt.aol.com) has joined #swhack
15:50:37 <phenny> bjoern_: "The year computer for the play of the scientific work where the many E-mailes address which we celebrate and are 2. in success of the E-mail of our Computerabstimmenlotterie which are kept, August 2007.This are used you like," (en -...-> en)
15:51:30 <bjoern_> .gc google_ad_section_start
15:51:32 <phenny> google_ad_section_start: 141,000
15:51:37 <Moira> hi
15:51:42 <sbp> hey Moir
15:51:43 <sbp> ...a!
15:51:48 <bjoern_> .title http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070817/ap_on_re_eu/russia_bombers
15:51:49 *** Moira is now known as MoiraA_
15:51:51 <phenny> bjoern_: Russia orders long-range bomber patrols - Yahoo! News
15:51:55 <MoiraA_> dunno what happened to tor
15:51:59 <MoiraA_> soon as I connected it packed in
15:52:01 <bjoern_> Yahoo! News indeed
15:52:04 <sbp> its arse-gut fell out?
15:52:13 <jsled> YSlow is awesome.
15:52:26 <MoiraA_> something like that :)
15:52:42 <jsled> http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/archives/000932.html
15:53:11 <bjoern_> phenny, "Ich bin bei einer routinen Ueberpreufung in meiner Bank (Standard Bank von Sued Afrika) wo ich arbeite, auf einem Konto gestossen, was nicht in anspruch genommen worden ist, wo derzeit $12,500,000 (zwoelfmillionenfuenfhundert US Dollar) gutgeschrieben sind."?
15:53:13 <phenny> bjoern_: "I am discovered with routines a Ueberpreufung in my bank (standard bank of south Africa) where I work, an account, which was not taken up, where $12.500.000 (twelve million five hundred US dollar) is credited at present." (de)
15:54:10 <bjoern_> phenny, "Finished wrong are cleaned resumes paused downloads. To speed up your file. Clean without finished wrong are cleaned resumes paused. Desired files faster than ever! Find, more sources it free do not, include ads!"?
15:54:14 <phenny> bjoern_: "The summary which makes clean inaccuracy download is finished pausierten. The document accelerates. There is no unfairness unfairness which is finished pausierte of the summary which makes clean is clean makes. A at all fast more desirable document! Discovery, many sources, freely ADS is not included that!" (en -...-> en)
15:54:57 <bjoern_> phenny, "It was not grief, this feeling, although she was nearly overwhelmed with grief - this was a strange, thundery feeling that she couldnt ever remember having before. "His big foolish grin stretched even wider; he thought soon it would meet in the back, tie a lovers knot there, and most of his poor old bean would just topple off."?
15:55:00 <phenny> bjoern_: Phrase must be <= 300 chars.
15:55:07 <bjoern_> phenny, "It was not grief, this feeling, although she was nearly overwhelmed with grief - this was a strange, thundery feeling that she couldnt ever remember having before. "His big foolish grin stretched even wider; he thought soon it would meet in the back, tie a lovers knot there"?
15:55:12 <phenny> bjoern_: "That was overwhelmed the wrongdoing almost, but it was not by mistake this to feel, - this range thundery to feel strange there was a thing which it has at all before couldnt itself which is made to remember. "It expanded foolish Grinsen largely directly; Directly, when the knot which has the love of the back section is connected, it meets there, you thought" (en -...-> en)
15:55:16 <bjoern_> LETS SELL IT AS "SPAM DECODER"!
15:55:45 <sbp> not a bad idea
15:55:49 <bjoern_> phenny, "All here, Steengo said. Very good. The tachyometer is ready. them. Instead he followed the young man back to the castle. In the cannot face it. We are too trained for survival and nothing else."?
15:56:03 <phenny> bjoern_: "Steengo you called everything, here. Very good. Preparation does many tachyometer that. However, that followed to the young person in the lock. It is not possible to face with that. We continuance and thing because of what and are trained with another method." (en -...-> en)
15:56:34 <bjoern_> phenny, "A WEATHER FRONT MOVING INTO THE WESTERN GULF OF ALASKA WILL BRINGSNOW TO THE KENAI PENINSULA BEGINNING THIS MORNING AND CONTINUINGTHROUGH THURSDAY."?
15:56:39 <phenny> bjoern_: "WEATHER-FRONT which beginning KENAI peninsular now morning moves and in western bay Alaska of CONTINUINGTHROUGH Thursday will BRINGSNOW." (en -...-> en)
15:57:50 <bjoern_> .gc scalabilityOfURIAccess-58
15:57:52 <phenny> scalabilityOfURIAccess-58: 0
15:58:05 <bjoern_> And you so wish it'd stay that way...
15:58:42 <sbp> scalability of URI access?
15:59:06 <bjoern_> Don't look at me, look at nw... where is he anyway?
15:59:06 <sbp> explain this issue to me in two words or less
16:00:54 <Talliesin> popularity costs
16:01:16 <sbp> I have beloaded YSlow
16:01:20 <sbp> I will now run it on various websites
16:01:53 <sbp> http://crschmidt.net/ - 99
16:02:16 <thelsdj> blog.thelsdj.org
16:02:17 <sbp> http://www.hackcraft.net/ - 77
16:02:38 <sbp> http://blog.thelsdj.org/ - 73
16:02:49 <thelsdj> is higher or lower score better?
16:03:03 <kpreid> .g YSlow
16:03:05 <phenny> kpreid: http://developer.yahoo.com/yslow/
16:03:08 <sbp> http://bjoern.hoehrmann.de/ - 79
16:03:11 <sbp> higher is better
16:03:20 <sbp> see http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/archives/000932.html
16:03:39 <sbp> http://www.bjoernsworld.de/ - 88
16:03:54 <sbp> http://inamidst.com/ - 80
16:04:09 <Talliesin> I'd expect a lowish score.
16:04:14 <sbp> http://inamidst.com/lo/ - 92
16:05:11 <bjoern_> http://iecapt.sourceforge.net/ ?
16:05:29 <sbp> http://www.disobey.com/ - 62
16:05:43 <sbp> http://iecapt.sourceforge.net/ - 90
16:06:02 <sbp> http://www.aaronsw.com/ - 91
16:06:13 <sbp> http://swhack.com/ - 95
16:06:24 <Morbus> unfair comparisons on disobey.com, i think
16:06:24 <thelsdj> http://ipwebdev.com/hermit/
16:06:32 <sbp> huh, http://crschmidt.net/ now says 95
16:06:38 <Morbus> mine is graphically inferior to your other test cases.
16:06:51 <sbp> Morbus: I think the fact that your scorecard took AAAAaaAGES to load is the problem
16:07:03 <sbp> graphically inferior? shouldn't that make it faster? :-)
16:07:17 <sbp> http://ipwebdev.com/hermit/ - 93
16:07:19 <Morbus> no, it means that all the sites that rank highly had little graphics on them.
16:07:24 <Morbus> whereas mine has lots
16:07:41 <sbp> http://kpreid.livejournal.com/ - 66
16:07:44 <Morbus> anyways, i've already done yslow testing on my stuff ;)
16:07:47 <sbp> aha
16:07:49 <sbp> hehe
16:08:09 <bjoern_> Search Engine Corp. publishes random number generator. Who'd have thought...
16:08:10 <sbp> http://www.achewood.com/ - 68
16:08:12 *** littledan (n=littleda@c-66-31-46-131.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #swhack
16:08:17 <sbp> anyone else want a page done?
16:08:20 <perigrin> sbp, http://saintpaul.openguides.org
16:08:21 <sbp> quick, before I uninstall it
16:08:44 <sbp> http://saintpaul.openguides.org/ - 85
16:08:48 <bjoern_> w3.org!
16:08:50 <bjoern_> ietf.org!
16:09:03 <sbp> http://www.w3.org/ - 82
16:09:11 <perigrin> developer.yahoo.com/yslow/!
16:09:14 <bjoern_> europa.eu
16:09:50 <sbp> http://www.ietf.org/ - 84
16:09:55 <jsled> http://asynchronous.org/
16:10:09 <sbp> http://developer.yahoo.com/yslow/ - 72
16:10:26 <sbp> http://europa.eu/ - 65
16:10:39 <sbp> wow
16:10:42 <sbp> http://asynchronous.org/ - 100
16:10:52 <jsled> winnar!
16:10:53 <kpreid> sbp: http://homepage.mac.com/kpreid/ ?
16:10:58 <bjoern_> So, it is a random number generator.
16:11:07 <sbp> hehe
16:11:14 <sbp> http://homepage.mac.com/kpreid/ - 92
16:11:47 <sbp> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love - 54
16:11:57 <bjoern_> try mine again, but first say whether it'll up, down, or equal...
16:12:25 <sbp> hmm. it'll go up
16:12:44 <sbp> http://bjoern.hoehrmann.de/ - 79
16:12:46 <sbp> same
16:13:02 *** littledan has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
16:13:10 <sbp> http://www.w3.org/Style/CSS/ - 38
16:13:14 *** littledan (n=littleda@c-66-31-46-131.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #swhack
16:13:16 <bjoern_> at least I didn't change anything...
16:14:59 <sbp> jsled: wait, so you use a CDN?
16:15:17 <jsled> I must, apparently.
16:15:24 <jsled> I mean, it's news to me.
16:15:33 * bjoern_ now used the opportunity to optipng his page
16:16:02 <sbp> I don't think the size of files affects it at all
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16:16:37 <sbp> okay, gonna turn it off if no more requests
16:16:40 <bjoern_> me either, but it I just love keeping my homepage up to date you know.
16:16:53 <sbp> OH YEAH?
16:16:56 <sbp> WELL THAT MAKES TWO OF US
16:16:57 <bjoern_> OH YEAH!
16:17:15 <bjoern_> saved 7K!
16:17:24 <sbp> hehe
16:17:32 <sbp> you should try manual paletteing too
16:17:35 <sbp> it can be really, really effective
16:18:52 <bjoern_> If you consider that half the size (14kb) comes from an image I don't use at all, I doubt it would in my case...
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16:21:06 <bjoern_> .gc "a fellow Yahoo!"
16:21:09 <phenny> "a fellow Yahoo!": 1,030
16:24:07 * sbp -> http://www.mnot.net/cgi_buffer/
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16:44:26 <Monty> yo littledan!
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16:51:11 <sbp> oh, I see
16:51:15 <sbp> scalabilityOfURIAccess-58 == slashdotting
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16:56:32 <bjoern_> I was more thinking "OMG BitTorrent does not use HTTP WTF!?!"
16:58:01 <thelsdj> ha! I'm 3 days older than the CD!
16:58:27 <crschmidt> http://www.mnot.net/cgi_buffer/ is very cool
16:59:26 <bjoern_> Your cover is probably also not slowly killing you.
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17:12:31 <bjoern_> .compare "white space" "black space" "orange space" "red space" "transparent space"
17:12:34 <phenny> "white space" (2,010,000), "black space" (178,000), "red space" (88,900), "transparent space" (38,200), "orange space" (16,000)
17:14:25 *** bpt (n=bpt@adsl-227-105-133.rmo.bellsouth.net) has joined #swhack
17:14:37 <Arnia> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/6949473.stm
17:14:48 <bjoern_> .title http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/6949473.stm
17:14:56 <phenny> bjoern_: BBC NEWS | Technology | Bluetooth helps Facebook friends
17:15:18 <bjoern_> Does it slaughter them?
17:17:36 <Arnia> ...
17:17:41 * Arnia dies
17:18:03 <bjoern_> seems to work, then
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19:23:08 <sbp> Monty: remind me in 16 hours to do something for THE MORB
19:23:08 <Monty> sbp: Okay, I'll remind you about that on Sat Aug 18 12:22:55 BST 2007
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20:43:04 <deltab> sbp: tonight's Stephen Fry night on BBC4
20:57:13 * findlay wishes he had something clever to entertain the channel with
20:57:18 * findlay blames Tene
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23:08:02 <Monty> it's l7!
23:13:26 <est> is not
23:19:56 <Arnia> is two
23:20:00 <Arnia> and three and four
23:20:02 <Arnia> Not five though
23:20:06 <Arnia> Six is a possibility
23:34:43 <est> no..no six
23:35:35 <Arnia> Hm... I'm stumped
23:35:47 <Arnia> We should hire a mathematician to work out whether six
23:35:55 <Arnia> Or seven or ate
23:35:58 <Arnia> But I already ate
23:36:18 * Arnia munches on primes
23:40:53 <est> number nine? number nine?
23:42:40 * Arnia trisects est
23:46:03 <Arnia> Hm... does anyone know of a content management system which uses RDF as its back-end?
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23:55:54 <thelsdj> Arnia: my brain?
23:56:17 * Arnia plugs thelsdj's brain into his server
23:56:39 <Arnia> One thing that intrigues me is using eRDF as a templating language (of sorts)