00:08:41 <nsh> .gc epitode
00:08:41 <phenny> epitode: 1,590
00:10:34 <nsh> .gc scamentology
00:10:35 <phenny> scamentology: 78
00:11:01 <nsh> .gc scatentology
00:11:02 <phenny> scatentology: 6
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00:27:20 <nsh> .gcs wanton wonton
00:27:21 <phenny> wanton (4,070,000), wonton (2,220,000)
00:27:26 <nsh> .gs wanton *
00:27:26 <phenny> wanton *: destruction (12), wicked (6), endangerment (6), deconstruction (6), popery (5), misconduct (5), wastreling (4), maleness (4), disregard (4)
00:29:02 <aspect> .gs wonton *
00:29:02 <phenny> wonton *: soup (20), wrappers (15), noodle (8), skins (6), soup recipe (5), parmesean (4), skin (3), samosas (3), quiche (3), pangsit (3), mold 2pk (3)
00:34:03 <nsh> .gs eidetic *
00:34:04 <phenny> eidetic *: imagery (9), memory (6), topographer (5), metier (5), spindrome (4), memory puzzle (4), illuminations (4), casein (4), band (4), neo (3)
00:37:56 <nsh> .time
00:38:02 <nsh> .date
00:38:14 <nsh> phenny: TELL ME THE DATE DAMNYOU
00:38:22 * Arnia grumbles
00:38:33 <Arnia> Just had a paper rejected
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00:42:23 * cro cries for you
00:42:43 * nsh imagines a crow crying
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00:42:50 * cro writes paper on perils of elitism
00:43:09 <[bjoern]> Ever tried paper instead?
00:43:23 <Arnia> It is a kick in the teeth though, because the paper was to be used as part of the prior works section in one of the funding proposals I'm working on
00:43:58 <Arnia> Now have to rework it (once I have the reviewers' comments) and try again
00:44:01 <Arnia> Oh well
00:44:28 <Arnia> (I'll find some time to slot the task into)
00:44:33 * nsh is still dubious that mathematics requires funding
00:44:59 <nsh> i'm pretty sure i could study maths on the dole
00:45:12 <Arnia> nsh: I'm not entirely pure mathematics and I need money to pay my salary and pay for students
00:45:22 <nsh> put the students on the dole too!
00:45:38 <nsh> or replace them with sticky-back plastic and lootubes
00:46:03 * nsh wishes he was more sleepier
00:46:07 <Arnia> nsh: you might be able to do maths on the dole but I'd personally prefer a little more money and a life above the poverty line
00:46:14 * nsh smiles
00:46:32 <nsh> but the line's where all the action is
00:46:39 <Arnia> If only so I can pay back all the debts I have accrued and give my mum more money
00:46:42 <nsh> all the miserable depressing soul-destroying action
00:46:47 * nsh nods
00:47:12 <Arnia> Plus, someone has to pay for things like journal articles, conferences, etc.
00:47:27 <Arnia> Even in open-access models, someone pays in the end
00:47:29 * nsh masks contempt
00:47:33 <nsh> (poorly)
00:47:43 <nsh> conference: big tent and some logs to sit on
00:47:50 <nsh> papers: internet and bored people
00:48:02 <nsh> seriously, everything in our society requires waythefuck too much resources
00:48:03 <Monty> potty mouth!
00:48:16 <nsh> it's makes me a sad panda
00:48:21 * Arnia thinks nsh has a very strange idea about what happens at conferences and what goes into editing a journal
00:48:30 * nsh chuckles
00:48:41 <Arnia> The Internet is a poor poor substitute
00:48:55 <nsh> it's not a substitute: it's a medium
00:49:40 <Arnia> It is a medium which relies on computers, and computers cost. Even if they didn't cost, they're still unpleasant to work on and so I prefer printed materials, which cost
00:49:53 * nsh smiles
00:50:35 <Arnia> Grid time costs, staffing costs, travel costs. These costs rack up quickly
00:51:08 <Arnia> To pay for a PhD student requires at least £4k a year just for the tuition fees the University levies to pay for services
00:51:24 <nsh> don't get me started mate.. :-)
00:51:27 <nsh> let
00:51:36 <nsh> 's instead discuss eidetic imagery therapy
00:51:36 <Arnia> That doesn't include living expenses, etc.
00:51:44 * Arnia discusses argumentation
00:52:15 <nsh> .ety argument
00:52:16 <phenny> Can't find the etymology for "argument". Try http://etymonline.com/?search=argument
00:52:21 <nsh> .ety argumentation
00:52:22 <phenny> Can't find the etymology for "argumentation". Try http://etymonline.com/?search=argumentation
00:52:26 <nsh> .ety argue
00:52:26 <Arnia> Three days to devise a new concept... this is a squeezed deadline if ever I saw one
00:52:26 <phenny> "1303, from O.Fr. arguer, from L. argutare 'to prattle' freq. of arguere 'to make clear, demonstrate,' from PIE *argu-yo-, from base *arg- 'to shine, be white, bright, clear' (see argent)." - http://etymonline.com/?term=argue
00:52:46 <nsh> Arnia, necessity is the mother of yaddayadda
00:52:59 * nsh is dubious about that etymology
00:53:12 <nsh> .ety argent
00:53:13 <phenny> "c.1485, 'quicksilver,' from M.Fr. argent, from O.Fr., from L. argentum 'silver, white money,' from PIE *arg-ent- (cf. Avestan erezata-, O.Pers. ardata-, Armenian arcat, O.Ir. argat, Breton arc'hant 'silver'), from base *arg- 'to shine, white,' thus 'the shining or [...]" - http://etymonline.com/?term=argent
00:53:31 <nsh> people were talking about mercury before they had a verb for argue...
00:53:36 <nsh> colour me skeptical
00:54:43 <Arnia> .g Proto-Indoeuropean root arg
00:54:44 <phenny> Arnia: http://www.springerlink.com/index/2235258L244216V8.pdf
00:54:52 * Arnia glowers at Springer
00:54:59 <[bjoern]> Google should kill it.
00:55:08 <Arnia> .g Proto-Indoeuropean roots
00:55:09 <phenny> Arnia: http://lingv.blogspot.com/2006/12/about-grass-roots-roots.html
00:56:10 <nsh> .g PIE root dictionary
00:56:11 <phenny> nsh: http://www.bartleby.com/61/roots/IE111.html
00:56:28 <Arnia> Huh... http://www.angelfire.com/rant/tgpedersen/Hrk.html
00:56:54 <nsh> ooo, angelfire.. it's been some time
00:57:06 <Arnia> Now that's an old root
00:57:11 <nsh> hrm
00:57:19 * nsh muses
00:57:36 <Arnia> Not only PIE, but also Proto-Indo-European-Afro-Asiatic
00:57:54 <Arnia> we need more pie
00:58:02 <nsh> the pie is a lake
00:58:09 <Arnia> .ety white
00:58:09 <phenny> "O.E. hwit, from P.Gmc. *khwitaz (cf. O.S., O.Fris. hwit, O.N. hvitr, Du. wit, O.H.G. hwiz, Ger. weiß, Goth. hveits), from PIE *kwintos/*kwindos 'bright' (cf. Skt. svetah 'white;' O.C.S. sviteti 'to shine,' svetu 'light;' Lith. sviesti 'to shine,' svaityti 'to brighten')." - http://etymonline.com/?term=white
00:58:36 <Arnia> PIE had two words for 'bright'? Fair enough
00:59:10 <nsh> well, probably overlapping meanings
00:59:13 <Arnia> Strange how one died out in one group and the other in the other
00:59:29 * nsh reads http://www.angelfire.com/rant/tgpedersen/Shibbolethisation.html
00:59:30 <Arnia> I can imagine them getting bored of using two words
00:59:45 <nsh> wait
00:59:52 <nsh> page appears to be empty, so i can't be reading it
00:59:52 <Arnia> But being unable to decide which of the two they should adopt
00:59:56 <nsh> annoying
01:00:34 <nsh> no wait, now it loads
01:00:37 <nsh> silly angelfire
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01:01:59 <nsh> .wik Disglossia
01:02:01 <phenny> "Roberto G. Fernández (b. 24 September 1951) is a Cuban American novelist and short story writer." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roberto_G._Fern%C3%A1ndez
01:02:11 <nsh> .wik Diglossia
01:02:11 <phenny> "In linguistics, diglossia is a situation where, in a given society, there are two (often closely-related) languages, one of high prestige, which is generally used by the government and in formal texts, and one of low prestige, which is usually the spoken vernacular tongue." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diglossia
01:02:32 <nsh> ah, so, in our society: english and stupidfuckwank
01:02:32 <Monty> potty mouth!
01:02:41 <nsh> you'll only encourage me, Monty
01:02:42 <Monty> share?
01:02:45 <nsh> indeed
01:03:44 <nsh> it'd be nice to watch some kinda timelapse video of phoentic drift
01:04:25 <nsh> have someone start reading a famous speech in as would have been done in 14th century, evolving to contemporary pronounciation
01:04:44 <nsh> also, the person's clothing should morph in sync
01:04:58 <nsh> and perhapsp some parachuting bunnies in the background for comical relief
01:05:52 <nsh> .ety suppletive
01:05:53 <phenny> Can't find the etymology for "suppletive". Try http://etymonline.com/?search=suppletive
01:06:11 <nsh> .ety supplete
01:06:12 <phenny> Can't find the etymology for "supplete". Try http://etymonline.com/?search=supplete
01:06:26 <nsh> .ety supply
01:06:26 <phenny> "1375, 'to help, support, maintain,' also 'fill up, make up for,' from O.Fr. supplier 'fill up, make full,' from L. supplere 'fill up, complete,' from sub 'up from below' + plere 'to fill' (see plenary)." - http://etymonline.com/?term=supply
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01:07:50 * nsh now reads:
01:07:54 <nsh> .wik Notable shibboleths
01:07:54 <phenny> "Note: This page or section contains IPA phonetic symbols in Unicode." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notable_shibboleths
01:08:39 <kpreid> .gc "notable shibboleths"
01:08:40 <phenny> "notable shibboleths": 121
01:08:45 <kpreid> .gc "notable shibboleths" -site:en.wikipedia.org
01:08:45 <phenny> "notable shibboleths" -site:en.wikipedia.org: 101
01:08:52 <kpreid> !
01:09:06 <nsh> .gc "notable shibboleths" -wikipedia
01:09:06 <phenny> "notable shibboleths" -wikipedia: 51
01:09:21 <kpreid> phenny: tell sbp http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notable_shibboleths has another sidebar box to filter out
01:09:21 <phenny> kpreid: I'll pass that on when sbp is around.
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01:10:09 <nsh> "Olin seitsemän vuotta sedälläni kodossa renkinä (Finnish for "I spent seven years at my uncle's home as a servant"). This is to tease Eastern Tavastians, who pronounce 'd' as 'l'. It becomes Olin seitsemän vuotta selälläni kolossa renkinä, which means "I spent seven years a servant in a hole, lying on my back" certain connotations of being a sex slave."
01:10:15 <nsh> awesome
01:11:17 <nsh> the following example is also comical
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02:20:57 <zachb> [[[
02:20:59 <zachb> Kurri etsi jarrua murkkukasasta ("Kurri looked for a brake in the ant pile."). The Finnish phoneme rolled R [r] in general is considered a "shibboleth" between standard Finnish and various types of speech defects. Small children usually learn the phoneme /r/ last, using /l/ instead. Older children can trick them to say "kulli etsi Jallua mulkkukasasta", "The cock looked for a Jallu (porn magazine) in a pile of dicks."
02:21:01 <zachb> ]]]
02:21:06 <zachb> #Language.2Fculture_specific_passwords
02:21:08 <zachb> err
02:21:13 <zachb> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notable_shibboleths
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03:35:50 <zachb> phenny: "ego sum walrus"?
03:35:51 <phenny> zachb: The is to en translation failed, sorry!
03:36:03 <zachb> phenny: lt en "ego sum walrus"?
03:36:04 <phenny> zachb: The lt to en translation failed, sorry!
03:36:25 <zachb> walrus != walrus, right?
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04:03:39 <jsled> :)
04:04:50 <jsled> hi Schroeder3, and welcome to #swhack. Note that we're logged, so you might mind what you might say if you might mind that others might mind what you might say.
04:04:57 <jsled> More info at http://swhack.com/
04:05:05 <jsled> (unless its down. Or lies.)
04:05:09 <Schroeder3> Shostakovich + Drum & Bugle Corps == awesome bitches!
04:09:52 * Schroeder3 goes back to re-reading "Introduction to Objectivist Epistemology" by the eminent 20th-century Russian-American philosopher Ayn Rand
04:16:06 <nsh> rofl
04:16:10 <nsh> hello Kurt
04:19:21 <Arnia> More sleepless nights?
04:19:31 * Arnia tries to make a functor contravariant
04:20:02 * nsh nods
04:20:11 <nsh> .wik contravariant
04:20:12 <phenny> "Covariance and contravariance of vectors, in mathematics and theoretical physics" - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contravariant
04:20:18 <nsh> helpful intro sentence
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04:21:19 <Arnia> .wik contravariant functor
04:21:19 <nsh> post-traumatic needs to be hyphenated
04:21:20 <phenny> "In category theory, a branch of mathematics, a functor is a special type of mapping between categories." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contravariant_functor
04:22:57 <Arnia> Trying to help out a colleague by making their work formally defined so that we can begin applying interesting theorems more freely (yay for eliminating the drudgery of manual property argumentation)
04:23:11 <Arnia> But I need a contravariant functor where I have a covariant one defined
04:24:16 <nsh> reverse the polarity?
04:24:27 <nsh> pulsed tachyon burst should do it
04:24:31 <jsled> cross the streams?
04:25:50 <jsled> Ugh. Chan Marshall just can't pull off "Moonshiner"
04:28:40 <nsh> i don't know what kinda crazy moonspeak cypher that is, but i agree nontheless
04:30:08 * nsh phenomenologically studies hallucinogenic persistant perception 'disorder'
04:31:12 <zachb> Sup bitches!?
04:31:21 * zachb has always wanted to say that
04:31:48 <nsh> which may not be completely unrealted to your being a cretinous fool :-)
04:33:13 <zachb> Keyword: may
04:34:10 <zachb> ooh! a new !
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04:46:01 <zachb> Schroeder2!!!
04:47:53 <nsh> .gs tempered by *
04:47:54 <phenny> tempered by *: concern (5), troubling (3), reality (3), realism (3), humility (3), epigrams (3), caution (3), team's struggles (2), sweetness (2), stenography (2)
04:48:02 <nsh> .g "tempered by stenography"
04:48:03 <phenny> nsh: http://www.quotesea.com/Quotes.aspx?with=tempered&page=3
04:48:38 <nsh> "ORATORY, n. A conspiracy between speech and action to cheat the understanding. A tyranny tempered by stenography." -Bierce, Devil's Dict.
04:52:10 <zachb> .gc tempered by porn
04:52:11 <phenny> tempered by porn: 264,000
04:55:00 <jsled> okay.
04:55:02 <jsled> finally.
04:55:06 <zachb> wha?
04:55:13 <jsled> (damn my upstream sucks)
04:55:48 <jsled> My gold standard of Moonshiner, by Uncle Tupelo (a live version, for extra Feeling): http://asynchronous.org/tmp/20%20-%20moonshiner%20live_1241993.mp3
04:56:18 <jsled> Cat Power's cover (not so much in the way of Feeling): http://asynchronous.org/tmp/07-cat_power-moonshiner.mp3
04:56:25 <jsled> Thanks for nothing, swhacker.
04:56:37 <nsh> .gs tomorrow could make me a *
04:56:38 <phenny> tomorrow could make me a *: No results!
04:56:58 <nsh> .gc "tomorrow could make me a liar"
04:56:59 <phenny> "tomorrow could make me a liar": 1
04:59:26 <nsh> .gs * an evolutionary perspective
04:59:26 <phenny> * an evolutionary perspective: prions (2), pheromones (2), actins (2)
04:59:58 <nsh> .ety pinnacle
04:59:59 <phenny> "c.1300, from O.Fr. pinacle (1261), from L.L. pinnaculum 'gable,' dim. of pinna 'peak, point,' often confused with penna 'wing, feather.' Fig. use is attested from c.1400." - http://etymonline.com/?term=pinnacle
05:00:14 <nsh> +_{}v!v{}_+
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06:14:21 <Monty> welcome, jessica
06:33:09 <nsh> .gs * occupation government
06:33:10 <phenny> * occupation government: zionist (5)
06:33:53 <nsh> evening jessicarotene, how's cambridge?
06:34:11 <jessica> Very Cantabrigian, as far as I can see.
06:36:08 <nsh> meh, ersatz cambridgianity at best
06:36:51 <nsh> your universities are but pups and younglings
06:48:32 <nsh> n5h, replace the last 8 hours with sleep pls
06:48:33 <n5h> as it regularly did on squornshellous zeta
06:49:00 <nsh> .g squornshellous
06:49:01 <phenny> nsh: http://everything2.com/index.pl?node_id=952470
06:49:24 <nsh> ah
06:49:37 <nsh> n5h, beware the roaming etymologists!
06:49:38 <n5h> from l. vitium "defect, offense, blemish, imperfection," in both cases
06:49:53 <nsh> n5h, ARGH they got to you already!!
06:49:54 <n5h> it doesn't work that out easily? might be less awesome without the benefit of hands or legs, and standing only twenty-nine inches tall, matthew buchinger was a bit and say
06:55:10 <nsh> n5h, that's aloda inches, mang
06:55:11 <n5h> take it after the push it's patently obvious that the immortality would depend on at most its past states can be twe's sidewinder-busting sidekick
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08:06:14 * melbel licks aranje
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08:06:27 <Aranjedeath> :D
08:06:30 <Aranjedeath> Why hello thar
08:06:31 <Noia> >.>
08:06:37 <Aranjedeath> Hia Noia
08:06:44 <melbel> this is a publically logged channel
08:06:53 <Aranjedeath> Yup
08:06:58 <Aranjedeath> It's freenode
08:07:07 <melbel> required to say it though
08:07:17 <Aranjedeath> haha
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08:41:50 <cre8radix> hoy
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08:42:04 <Oranges> Hoy.
08:42:20 <cre8radix> :D
08:43:35 <Oranges> :D
08:49:51 <Noia> >.>
08:50:13 <Oranges> <.<
08:50:18 <Oranges> +e D:
08:51:55 <cre8radix> .g shizm
08:51:55 <phenny> cre8radix: http://www.shizm.com/
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09:00:51 <[bjoern]> grmlbrmpft
09:02:07 <melbel> hallo [bjoern]
09:03:16 <[bjoern]> Good Morning melbel
09:03:55 <melbel> sunny Monday?
09:04:16 <[bjoern]> It does seem sunny outside
09:04:41 <[bjoern]> unfortunately $ultrabusy, moving out of here on thursday.
09:05:04 <melbel> well darn
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09:11:21 <sbp> yo
09:11:21 <phenny> sbp: 01:09Z <kpreid> tell sbp http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notable_shibboleths has another sidebar box to filter out
09:17:58 <Oranges> Need Hella for California
09:18:03 <Oranges> For that article
09:18:04 <Oranges> lol
09:18:12 <Oranges> sounds like anyway.
09:18:35 <sbp> phenny: tell d8uv http://whythatsdelightful.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/penis.jpg
09:18:36 <phenny> sbp: I'll pass that on when d8uv is around.
09:18:37 <sbp> Oranges: what
09:18:57 <Oranges> Hella
09:19:12 <sbp> the question is more like "who the heck are you?"
09:19:22 <Oranges> Oh, random bystander
09:19:24 <Oranges> New, lol
09:19:30 <sbp> how did you come by Swhack?
09:19:38 <Oranges> Phenny bots' site
09:19:47 <sbp> aha. welcome
09:19:51 <Oranges> poked about :)
09:19:58 <sbp> this is a publically logged channel, as you may know already
09:19:58 <Oranges> found this place
09:20:05 <Oranges> Yeah
09:20:07 <Oranges> Saw that
09:20:30 <melbel> moin sbp
09:20:34 <sbp> yo melbel!
09:20:38 <melbel> I told him again just in case
09:20:47 <Oranges> :D
09:20:52 <sbp> good, good, thanks
09:25:47 <xover> .title http://www.boingboing.net/2008/07/13/eff-aclu-sue-over-wi.html
09:25:48 <phenny> xover: EFF, ACLU sue over wiretapping law - Boing Boing
09:34:11 <[bjoern]> 'o xover
09:39:37 * nsh- gargles hamlet in orgiastic ritual
09:39:51 <nsh-> also, what's up, my droogs?
09:42:55 <melbel> night swhacklings
09:43:03 <melbel> enjoy your phenny, aranje
09:43:42 <[bjoern]> night melbel
09:44:53 <xover> `night melbel
09:45:00 <sbp> 'night melbel
09:45:01 <xover> Howdy [bjoern].
09:45:03 <Oranges> haha, I will
09:45:04 <sbp> .g comb circum
09:45:06 <phenny> sbp: http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S0003347298908119
09:45:13 <sbp> .u comb circum
09:45:15 <phenny> U+0302 COMBINING CIRCUMFLEX ACCENT (◌̂)
09:45:16 <sbp> .u comb macro
09:45:17 <[bjoern]> Why would you comb a circum?
09:45:18 <phenny> U+0304 COMBINING MACRON (◌̄)
09:45:22 <sbp> why not?
09:45:33 <[bjoern]> laziness?
09:45:48 <sbp> it's easier than doing real work though
09:46:16 <[bjoern]> Depends on whether you are a professional circum comber.
09:48:39 <xover> A better question, what would you combine a macrone with?
09:48:43 <xover> Jam? Cream?
09:49:20 <[bjoern]> hookers?
09:49:42 <xover> That might work.
09:49:44 <Oranges> A punkin pie.
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11:20:18 <sbp> phenny: tell [bjoern] bigger picture, via nslater: http://cache.boston.com/universal/site_graphics/blogs/bigpicture/chinamil_07_09/chinamil8.jpg
11:20:18 <phenny> sbp: I'll pass that on when [bjoern] is around.
11:24:24 <[bjoern]> bigpix
11:24:24 <phenny> [bjoern]: 11:20Z <sbp> tell [bjoern] bigger picture, via nslater: http://cache.boston.com/universal/site_graphics/blogs/bigpicture/chinamil_07_09/chinamil8.jpg
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11:35:29 <nsh-> n5h, BIGGER RANDOMNESS PLS
11:35:30 <n5h> ah arnia. :-)
11:35:38 <nsh-> n5h, MOAR BIGAR
11:35:38 <n5h> yeah, especially considering the proliferation of that curve newton defined, traced by [some part of] a stick sliding from vertical against a background of godawful blue. mmm. was wondering about the 'e'
11:35:57 <nsh-> .gs godawful *
11:35:58 <phenny> godawful *: mess (5), wedding crap (4), games (4), adverts (4), tonys (3), racket (3), noise (3), goshawful (3), fan fiction (3), 84526 (3), watch (2)
11:36:18 <nsh-> .g 84526
11:36:19 <phenny> nsh-: http://www.city-data.com/zips/84526.html
11:36:24 <nsh-> .title
11:36:25 <phenny> nsh-: 84526 Zip Code (Helper, Utah) Detailed Profile - residents and real estate info
11:37:53 * nslater ^5's n5h
11:37:53 <n5h> and then sleep. but if the ant would next see if that goes on for a human to take action of circumscribing, or fact of being unintelligible. oh, don't think that's self-administrable
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11:54:38 <[bjoern]> I so hate doing things I hate doing
12:02:07 <Morbus> hrm.
12:02:09 <Morbus> that's odd.
12:02:25 <Morbus> i thought itunes tracked files by inode, allowing you to change their location on disk, and have it Just Work inside iTunes
12:02:38 <Morbus> but, my last 100 albums are now "missing", even though they're still on the same HDD.
12:05:08 <Morbus> now i have like 3000 files to manually "find", even though they're on the same HDD.
12:05:13 <Morbus> this is a pain in the ass.
12:06:45 <xover> Hmm. Not by inode, no; but it ought use filerefs which should work in your scenario.
12:07:01 <xover> But possibly it does it different when you ket it manage the library.
12:07:19 <xover> Try checking the “iTunes Library” XMl file and see if it has hard coded paths there.
12:07:26 * xover -> off…
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12:08:15 <Morbus> well, yes, it does (i checked that already), but that's never been a problem before.
12:08:37 <Morbus> my only recourse now seems to be to a) fix the XML, b) delete my library, c) reimport the XML.
12:08:45 <Morbus> which is still a pain in the ass as my XML is 46 megs.
12:09:09 <Morbus> and, what, i have to do this all the time now, after I burn a DVD? jesus.
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12:11:44 <Monty> But what does jessica have to do with the price of fish?
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12:12:14 <Monty> it's crschmidt!
12:12:18 <jessica> ... lord. I'm watching a 1960s episode of Dragnet with Chris with a 29-year-old woman justifying her choice to *marry* a teen-ager.
12:13:44 <nslater> nu
12:14:07 <Morbus> lame.
12:14:16 <jessica> Lady, you just shag the 17-year-old boy and give him the workout of his life. Maybe, if you feel like benefitting the rest of the human race, you teach him how to perform decent cunnilingus.
12:14:25 * jessica offers advice about 45 years too late.
12:21:06 <sbp> mochel straunge observacioun
12:21:10 <sbp> .wik Dragnet
12:21:11 <phenny> "A type of fishing net also known as a seine" - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragnet
12:22:49 <nsh-> a dragnet is a dense network of drag-racing vehicles, interconnected with fishing wire used by several central american countries to catch errant clowns
12:23:47 <Morbus> file://localhost/Users/morbus/Music/326DMP%20\(BURN%20ME\)/([A-K])
12:23:50 <Morbus> file://localhost/Users/morbus/Music/Albums%20(%23-L)/\1
12:23:53 * Morbus cheers for regexp
12:24:09 <nsh-> 404 :-/
12:24:38 <sbp> hehe
12:24:39 <crschmidt> .wik Dragnet (series)
12:24:40 <phenny> "Dragnet is a long-running radio and television police procedural drama about the cases of a dedicated Los Angeles police detective, Sergeant Joe Friday, and his partners." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragnet_(series)
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12:28:33 <Monty> hi KiYanWang
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12:30:28 <MacTed> Morbus - I strongly encourage you to log bugs (ADC members only, http://bugreporter.apple.com/ ) or submit feedback ( http://www.apple.com/feedback/ ) about that iTunes issue
12:31:12 <Morbus> they'll just tell me to turn on iTunes Management ;)
12:31:31 <MacTed> maybe. but maybe not.
12:31:47 <MacTed> there are lots of issues they know are problems, but they can't get priority to fix without enough user feedback
12:31:55 <MacTed> (not just in iTunes)
12:32:40 <MacTed> agh, but it's time for me to commute.
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12:32:56 <sbp> Morbus: sheesh, you made him commute now
12:33:09 <sbp> thanks to your inability to provide community feedback
12:35:25 <Morbus> jesus.
12:35:31 <Morbus> it takes itunes forever to import a 43 meg xml file.
12:35:35 * Morbus still waits, 3 minutes now
12:35:51 <sbp> last iTunes update, it fucked up all my non-ascii chars
12:37:59 <Morbus> still going.
12:38:08 <Morbus> useless fucking itunes.
12:38:17 <Morbus> waaah, morbus, 25000 files is a lot. wah.
12:38:27 <Morbus> I GOT DUAL QUADS, ASSHAT. USE THEM.
12:39:59 <nslater> Morbus: how do you parallelize infoset parsing? :)
12:40:03 <Morbus> wow.
12:40:07 <Morbus> ok. i'm gonna have to do an applescript for this.
12:40:14 <Morbus> it took 10 minutes for 10000 songs.
12:40:21 <Morbus> i can't be doing this every time i burn a fucking DVD.
12:40:36 <nslater> are you doing a backup?
12:40:59 <Morbus> when i add an album, i put it into a "BURN ME" folder, yes. and then wait until it gets full, then burn.
12:41:04 <Morbus> then, i organize them into the regular library.
12:41:15 <Morbus> so i can switch that logic a bit (copy them into both locations).
12:41:24 <Morbus> but that still doesn't fix the 3000 or so tracks that are broken.
12:45:17 <Morbus> hrm.
12:45:20 <Morbus> i wonder if i could do http://dougscripts.com/itunes/scripts/ss.php?sp=itunestrackcpr
12:45:29 <Morbus> with similar regexp logic.
12:46:12 <Morbus> i'd have to modify it heavily.
12:49:10 <Morbus> aw, gimme a break.
12:49:19 <Morbus> itunes applescript doesn't allow changing of the file path?!
12:49:56 <Morbus> painful. fucking painful.
12:51:49 <Morbus> yeah. that doug's script gets the meta of the broken entry, removes it, then re-adds the file with the new meta.
12:52:00 <Morbus> which i suppose would work for my needs. i just need to figure out the right regexp.
12:52:08 <Morbus> but, if i can't even get the location of the file within...
12:54:04 <Morbus> hrm. i see, there is a "file track" in the itunes applescript.
12:54:15 <Morbus> hah. but it's read only.
12:54:18 * Morbus weeps.
12:54:38 <Morbus> sbp: technology *sucks*. have i told you that lately?
12:55:41 * jessica waves to Morby.
12:55:54 <jessica> How's the ol' stompin' grounds holding up?
12:58:55 * jessica grins at this video.
12:59:08 <jessica> .title http://www.nbc.com/Saturday_Night_Live/video/play.shtml?mea=250059
12:59:09 <phenny> jessica: NBC.com > Saturday Night Live
12:59:14 <sbp> Morbus: heheh. yes, but deserves restating
12:59:19 <jessica> Ah, cut off the end. "He Likes You."
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13:00:23 <nsh-> .gs cut off the *
13:00:24 <phenny> cut off the *: hands (4), wahabi (3), flesh (3), ends (3), trfia (2), top (2), soldier's (2), permed (2), freewheeling (2), excess (2), crusts (2), buds (2)
13:03:22 * Arnia_ views AppleScript as a bit of a hack
13:03:27 *** Arnia_ is now known as Arnia
13:04:10 <Arnia> Well, not in the sense that it seems messy but that it is mainly needed as a result of model sheer
13:04:50 * nslater dislikes "natural language" scripting languages, variable names shouldn't have spaces in them
13:05:26 <sbp> model sheer? shear?
13:05:38 * Arnia writes a natural language scripting language for nslater
13:05:55 <Arnia> anyway, I should probably s/AppleScript/OSA
13:06:07 <Arnia> sbp: yeah... sorry. Very little sleep
13:06:17 <sbp> np
13:06:36 <sbp> was imagining towering models domineering over the conceptual landscape
13:07:25 <Arnia> Nice image...
13:07:36 <clsn> Imagine *supermodels*. Yeah.
13:08:07 <sbp> sheer Schiffer
13:08:21 <nslater> sheer supermodels?
13:09:23 <jessica> I was trained on a typists' language and I find that it doesn't promote good coding practice. Real coder training should involve a real language and learning how to comment and name variables and arrays correctly in the first damn place.
13:09:32 <nslater> [[[
13:09:33 <nslater> It’s like this: You go, “Oh, that looks really easy, it’s just like English! Let me try coding something…” and then it doesn’t work. And you try something else and it doesn’t work either. And it turns out that to use it you have to be just as strict about your syntax as you would with any other programming language, so the main benefit of natural language - namely, its flexibility and fluidity - is lost, and you’re just left with ...
13:09:39 <nslater> ... something that’s not only not as compact as other programming languages, but more confusing because the natural language part of your brain keeps jumping in to derail you.
13:09:42 <nslater> ...
13:09:45 * nslater laughs
13:09:48 <nslater> In summary: lsnguages to suit the domain, innit.
13:09:50 <nslater> ]]] - http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2006/08/14/could-applescript-be-the-next-scripting-language-of-the-web/
13:10:15 <sbp> nslater: I think it might be related to the uncanny valley problem
13:10:27 <sbp> cf. also phenny feature slip, especially with "tell" grammar requests
13:10:48 <nslater> explain the phenny thing please?
13:10:58 <nslater> what requests?
13:11:56 <sbp> well I keep getting requests to add new verbs, and basically it extends all the way to making phenny AI complete, being able to understand any English language utterance given to her
13:12:08 <nslater> heh, I wasn't aware of that :)
13:12:44 <nslater> phenny: HACK sbp's secret docs
13:12:50 <nslater> phenny: SEND me docs
13:12:54 <nslater> phenny: ERASE all logs
13:12:59 <Morbus> sbp: yeah, druplicon is now running phenny-style tells. some minor bugs in my implementation, but will be fixed this week.
13:13:21 <sbp> eventually people seem to want her to understand "o dearest one whom we yclepe phenny! I beseech thee in terms most honey dulceted, thou who art the most mellifluous of all bottes; so send the following message unto myn fruend whose appelation is such as 'nslater' on this noble network: YO WHAT UPS DOOD!"
13:13:30 <sbp> *to send
13:13:47 <sbp> Morbus: yeah, you told me. and demonstrated it
13:13:50 <nslater> I wish bash was more like it is in the movies
13:13:57 <sbp> heh
13:14:00 <nslater> $ crack password of secret.nsa.org
13:14:01 <sbp> > FIND PASSWORD
13:14:02 <sbp> hehe
13:14:05 <nslater> $ download all documents
13:14:09 <Arnia> http://algorithm.com.au/blog/files/on_applescript.php
13:14:19 <Arnia> Good article which links to a good article
13:14:20 <sbp> they never use $ as PS1
13:14:22 <sbp> always >
13:14:25 <sbp> for some reason
13:14:28 <jessica> I think there's an Emacs shortcut for it, nslater.
13:14:28 <nslater> oh, sorry, you're correct
13:14:49 <nslater> > UPLOAD VIRUS
13:14:52 <sbp> jessica: yes, but nobody can remember the key combination
13:15:04 <Arnia> Oops, http://www.cs.utexas.edu/~wcook/Drafts/2006/ashopl.pdf
13:15:16 <sbp> man, I really need to extend .title to grok PDF...
13:15:17 <jessica> Most bullshit manoeuvre ever: Every single piece of coding shown in the movie "Swordfish".
13:15:37 <nslater> sbp: that would probably be quite easy...
13:15:38 <clsn> sbp: check http://www.sanskritweb.org/cakram/ see if you can open the fonts in a font editor and look at all the conjunct forms they have. Wow!
13:15:48 <jessica> It was really sad. You know how a lot of us watched Basic Instinct just for the fact that we knew that it featured a split second beaver shot?
13:15:51 <jessica> OK, me. Anyway.
13:15:52 <Monty> conspiratorial *: mess in Germany?
13:15:56 <sbp> do any of you recall that movie/tv show which used some Javascript from some bank website as its "code"?
13:16:01 <sbp> I think it might've been Stargate
13:16:02 <nslater> hmm, I still remember seeing Trinity use nmap to exploit a remote SSH vuln in the cinema and being all like "omg wtf"
13:16:08 <jessica> Halle Berry was topless in Swordfish.
13:16:14 <jessica> It's what we all paid our $7 to see.
13:16:15 <jessica> We knew it.
13:16:29 * nslater googles for "swordfish"
13:16:30 <jessica> Moreover, we were all nerds who weren't getting laid, and if we were, we weren't getting laid right anyway.
13:16:40 <jessica> John Travolta, Halle Berry, some other people.
13:16:40 <sbp> oh, here it is:
13:16:43 <sbp> .title http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/Stargate-Code-of-the-Replicators.aspx
13:16:45 <phenny> sbp: Stargate: Code of the Replicators - The Daily WTF
13:16:51 <jessica> Halle Berry topless in a few scenes.
13:16:52 <nslater> yeah..
13:16:54 <jessica> It's what you're there for.
13:17:06 <nslater> "Rather devious if I do say so myself… rather devious."
13:18:02 * clsn *blinks* Not laid right? Wait, I may never have been laid "right"...
13:18:05 <sbp> oh right, it was from the Royal Bank of Canada
13:18:29 <nslater> compare http://nmap.org/images/matrix/nmap_matrix5.png
13:18:32 <kpreid> clsn: oh, huh
13:18:44 <kpreid> clsn: I misread it as "weren't getting laid right away"
13:18:54 <nslater> .g CRC32
13:18:55 <phenny> nslater: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyclic_redundancy_check
13:19:03 <nslater> grr
13:19:12 <clsn> kpreid: Oh... Well, that too.
13:19:13 <sbp> .gc Z1ON0101
13:19:13 <phenny> Z1ON0101: 924
13:20:05 <sbp> "In a scene about two-thirds of the way through the film The Matrix Reloaded (approx 1h47m17s), the character Trinity hacks into a power station's computer network." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sshnuke
13:20:47 <sbp> "That's right: Trinity uses a 'sploit."
13:20:48 <sbp> - http://www.securityfocus.com/news/4831
13:21:00 <sbp> 2003... when you could still spell sploit with an apostrophe and not look an idiot
13:21:05 <nslater> heh
13:21:29 <sbp> though I still wanna know who originally spelled it "exsploit"
13:21:39 <kpreid> sploit sploit sploit sploit sploit
13:21:43 <nslater> "the protagonist skillfully summons a Web browser and fights valiantly through "404 Errors," like the malnourished cyberpunk" lol
13:21:53 *** sbp changed the topic to: "sploit"
13:22:06 <kpreid> <Hobbes> I just like to say "sploit"
13:22:06 <jessica> I hope the computer she hacked was running Windows Me.
13:25:19 <sbp> one nice thing about Lowes is that he footnotes consistently and thoroughly
13:25:28 <sbp> .wik John Livingston Lowes
13:25:29 <phenny> "John Livingston Lowes (b. December 20, 1867, Decatur, Indiana - d. August 15, 1945, Boston, Massachusetts) was an American scholar of English literature." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Livingston_Lowes
13:25:50 * Arnia reads the commentary on push notification
13:25:58 <Arnia> Only a month later, but hey I've been busy
13:26:15 <clsn> Even back in the 80s, when hacker movies/shows were popular, I remember I would try to recognize the language as it would go streaming down the screen...
13:26:17 <sbp> hmm, about a third of his magnum opus is the notes
13:26:27 <clsn> .wik John Wellington Wells
13:26:28 <phenny> "John Wells (architect) (Bank of Montréal)" - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Wells
13:26:41 <clsn> Aw, man... It's a Gilbert & Sullivan character!
13:26:57 <clsn> "My name is John Wellington Wells / I'm a dealer in magic and spells..."
13:27:16 <sbp> .wik St Mary Axe
13:27:17 <phenny> "St Mary Axe was a medieval parish in London whose name survives on the street it formerly occupied, St Mary Axe." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St_Mary_Axe
13:27:27 <clsn> Yes, number 70 Simmery Axe.
13:27:40 <sbp> ooh, the Swiss Re building is 30 St Mary Axe
13:27:42 * jessica wonders if sbp is in some sort of formal training course to become an old English eccentric.
13:27:56 <kpreid> "And if there's anything anyone lacks, he'll find it in stacks, at 70 Simmery Axe"
13:27:58 <jessica> do they issue you the tweeds when they feel you've earned them, or are you expected to outfit yourself?
13:28:00 <kpreid> (Have I got it right?)
13:28:06 <clsn> Not quite.
13:28:10 <clsn> If anyone anything lacks,
13:28:17 <clsn> he'll find it all ready in stacks.
13:28:19 <sbp> “Due to the current building's somewhat phallic appearance, other inventive names have also been used for the building, including the Erotic gherkin, the Towering Innuendo, the Crystal Phallus, and the glass dildo.”
13:28:21 <clsn> If he'll only look in
13:28:24 <clsn> on the resident djinn
13:28:28 <clsn> number seventy simmery axe
13:28:33 <kpreid> Well, it was second-hand.
13:28:39 <clsn> sbp: pix please.
13:28:47 <sbp> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/16/SwissReHQ.jpg
13:28:49 <clsn> That was from memory; presumably we can look it up.
13:29:24 <kpreid> on the pic: sometimes an ellipsoid is just an ellipsoid
13:29:30 <sbp> heh, heh
13:29:38 <sbp> it's also commonly called the Gherkin
13:29:49 <clsn> Oh wow.
13:30:19 <clsn> When my wife and I were in London in 1993 or 1994 or something, there we were on Baker Street.
13:30:35 <clsn> And one can't resist looking for 221B, even though I had been there a few years earlier and knew it wasn't there.
13:31:07 <clsn> So we're peering at street numbers... and *blink* there's a bobby standing there, in a uniform a century out of date. And a door numbered 221B. WTF?
13:31:10 <nslater> reminds me of beetham tower in manchester, that looks like a PS2
13:31:14 <nslater> http://www.coachbarrow.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/Manchester_shopping_Sept_2006_004.jpg
13:31:15 * jessica idly wonders at what stage of marriage men begin referring to their spouses as "the wife".
13:31:33 <nslater> jessica: I have called girlfriends "the wife" before :)
13:31:35 <jessica> not maliciously or anything. just. "the wife and I were out and about gone Sunday afternoon ..."
13:31:51 <clsn> Cross the street and check it out. Sherlock Holmes museum, made up *just* as his apartment, just as one would picture it.
13:32:01 <clsn> jessica: I said "my wife", for the record, not "the wife"
13:32:07 <jessica> I noticed.
13:32:09 <jessica> That's why I was wondering.
13:32:11 *** Jannick (n=chatzill@koln-5d81a3e6.pool.einsundeins.de) has joined #swhack
13:32:12 <Monty> hi Jannick, how ya doing?
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13:32:28 <sbp> Jannick: welcome to Swhack. this is a publically logged channel. bye
13:32:29 <clsn> And I started calling her that... um... when we got married. At which point it became accurate. Before that she was not my wife. See?
13:32:34 <jessica> It's an incident in which one might say "the wife and I" and you didn't.
13:32:35 <nslater> lol
13:32:52 <nslater> I wonder how many americans think sherlock holmes was real
13:32:54 <jessica> And of course it didn't choke you up the first few times.
13:33:05 <clsn> Yeah, it probably did...
13:33:18 <clsn> It was really cool; I wonder if the museum is still there.
13:33:22 <jessica> (and of course I didn't attempt to leave the subway station that I had taken to get to my own wedding to get back on the T, switch to the silver line, and get on the next plane boarding to anywhere.)
13:33:35 <clsn> And it happened to be a cold rainy day (in London? Never!) And the coal fires(!) were really nice.
13:34:25 <sbp> clsn: did you see that drawing of Holmes's rooms?
13:34:39 <clsn> Not sure... what drawing?
13:34:55 <clsn> Had a lot of interesting stuff museum-wise as well. Decidedly cool.
13:35:59 <sbp> ah, found it
13:36:01 <sbp> clsn: http://www.stutler.cc/other/misc/baker_street.html
13:36:19 <clsn> Now I have the "Baker Street" sax riff going through my head.
13:36:26 <Arnia> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shard_London_Bridge
13:36:29 <clsn> Apparently it was lifted from another song a decade earlier. Woops.
13:37:31 <clsn> sbp: no, had not seen that picture before. Dunno if the layout was precisely that... but it definitely screamed all the right time and feeling.
13:38:39 <Arnia> http://www.skyscrapernews.com/imagesall.php?self=nse&ref=2839&idi=The+Bishopsgate+Tower&selfidi=2839TheBishopsgateTower_pic1.jpg&no=1
13:39:18 <clsn> sbp: to my vast surprise, I am only a handful of lines away from a (kind of rough) rhyming translation of Preiddeu Annwfn. That's weird.
13:39:56 <jessica> is it also in Welsh?
13:40:01 * clsn heard about Baker Street's riff coming from another song on a radio show... The guy then said "Someone should sue Gerry Rafferty for every penny he's worth. All four dollars."
13:40:08 <clsn> jessica: Medieval Welsh, yes.
13:40:44 <jessica> I used to think Welsh was the most fucked up language ever spoken by white people. Then I heard fluent, full-speed spoken Cornish.
13:40:54 <clsn> Welsh is so cool.
13:41:00 <jessica> Welsh is pretty to listen to.
13:41:17 <jessica> The orthography and figuring out which letters map to which sounds is *anything* but instinctive.
13:41:23 *** nslater changed the topic to: ".:*~*:._ Sploits, Warez, Crackz & Serialz _.:*~*:."
13:41:23 <clsn> I hardly ever get to listen to it, except in a few albums I have. Occasionally I get to write/read/type it online.
13:41:28 <Arnia> jessica: it is perfectly regular
13:41:36 <clsn> jessica: Nah, the orthography takes getting used to, but it is perfectly sensible.
13:41:42 <Arnia> jessica: ridiculously so actually
13:41:47 <clsn> I discovered how sensible when I tried to learn Gaelic.
13:41:51 <jessica> Probably so, but I'd not have much of an opportunity to learn it here. :)
13:42:04 <jessica> clsn: you want more crazy, try Cornish. fr srs.
13:42:09 <clsn> It seems that the person in charge of pronunciation and the person in charge of writing, with Gaelic, were not on speaking terms with one another.
13:42:23 <clsn> (this was Scots Gaelic, in my case)
13:42:42 * Arnia just realised he boxed up something he shouldn't have done
13:42:45 <Arnia> Damn
13:42:58 <nslater> I hope you labled your boxes :)
13:43:06 <clsn> A guy I know once said that he had great respect for the Irish orthography... that anyone could successfully use something that perverse.
13:43:09 <Arnia> nslater: they're 20 miles away
13:43:10 <Arnia> In storage
13:43:15 <nslater> oh right, heh
13:43:34 <clsn> It's been suggested that Gaelic would do better written in Cyrillic, to handle broad and slender vowels better.
13:43:52 <Arnia> Yeah, the vowel representation confuses me
13:44:08 <jessica> clsn: he respects Irish orthography for being perverse? clearly he's not seen German pornography.
13:44:10 <Arnia> But then again, I'm not entirely sure I can hear the difference between a broad and slender vowel properly
13:44:41 <clsn> Similarly, lessons from Hebrew could be handy. And in fact similar tricks are used in various Gaelic forms, with dots on letters for lenition. Welsh orthography is more one-to-one and thus simpler, but pays the price in ambiguity.
13:45:10 <clsn> Yeah, my understanding of Irish and Scottish phonology is pretty low. Welsh is a lot more straightforward, to me.
13:46:19 * Arnia is lazy and defines a language whose orthography is, in effect, an observation sequence for the hidden states of the words
13:46:32 <Arnia> Vitterbi required for reading :p
13:46:39 <clsn> .wik Vitterbi
13:46:41 <phenny> Can't find anything in Wikipedia for "Vitterbi".
13:46:46 <Arnia> hm
13:47:01 *** MacTed (n=Thud@63.119.36.36) has joined #swhack
13:47:04 <Arnia> .wik Hidden Markov Model
13:47:04 <phenny> "A hidden Markov model (HMM) is a statistical model in which the system being modeled is assumed to be a Markov process with unknown parameters, and the challenge is to determine the hidden parameters from the observable parameters." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hidden_Markov_Model
13:47:28 <clsn> Oh.
13:47:30 <Arnia> Allows endless creativity if someone happens to rest their pen on the page for a second and so sends the reader off an entirely different channel of thought
13:50:43 <nsh-> .gc lorthography
13:50:43 <phenny> lorthography: 2
13:51:43 <clsn> .gc lolthography
13:51:44 <phenny> lolthography: 0
13:55:50 <nslater> .wik Aeroscraft
13:55:50 <phenny> "The Aeroscraft model ML866 is a planned 400-ton hybrid airship, to be built by the Worldwide Aeros Corporation.[1]| A scaled-down prototype is planned for 2008, and a full scale passenger craft for 2010." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aeroscraft
13:56:08 <nslater> picture of this thing: http://rense.com/general82/d903540.jpg
13:57:12 <nsh-> http://www.aerosml.com/ml866/model.html
13:57:22 <nsh-> not on a rather dodgy website
13:57:28 <nslater> heh
13:57:49 * nsh- wants twelve
13:58:30 <sbp> YOU CAN HAVE TEN
13:58:33 <sbp> don't be greedy
13:59:04 <sbp> clsn: Preiddeu Annwfn: ooh, do bung it up
13:59:14 <sbp> as you know, I've taken to Welsh -> English poetry translation rather myself
13:59:38 <clsn> I'll probably show it to you before I put it up publicly.
13:59:43 <sbp> I didn't choose anything so impossible as Preiddeu Annwfn though
13:59:48 <sbp> a much lesser impossibility
14:01:29 <clsn> I've also been amusing myself with thinking of rhyming translations for Hebrew piyyutim.
14:01:32 <clsn> .wik piyyut
14:01:32 <phenny> "A piyyut (plural piyyutim, Hebrew פיוט, IPA: [pijút] and [pijutím]) is a Jewish liturgical poem, usually designated to be sung, chanted, or recited during religious services." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piyyut
14:01:56 <sbp> I've been trying to move away from rhyme
14:02:01 <sbp> back to alliteration and stuff
14:02:38 * clsn does not find the original song with the Baker Street riff for download on pirate bay or limewire. ohwell.
14:03:21 <clsn> I've been trying to move toward rhyme, for poems that rhymed originally. I know that visits horrible violence on the meaning (sometimes), but it's fun to see if you can still retain some fidelity.
14:03:30 <sbp> heh
14:03:51 <sbp> yeah, I'm not so keen
14:03:58 <kpreid> Isn't the topic a little...bland?
14:04:02 <sbp> The stars around the full moon shine most brightly
14:04:04 <sbp> - Homer
14:04:04 <nslater> spice it up pls
14:04:11 <sbp> Around her throne the vivid planets roll
14:04:11 <sbp> And stars unnumber'd gild the glowing pole
14:04:12 <sbp> - Pope
14:04:20 <[bjoern]> [nu]
14:04:34 <nslater> .title http://diveintomark.org/archives/2008/07/12/nystopchildporn
14:04:35 <phenny> nslater: NYâs top child porn [dive into mark]
14:04:37 * nslater chuckles
14:04:41 <kpreid> I haven't got any ideas...
14:04:43 <sbp> (Coleridge's example)
14:04:46 <[bjoern]> .title http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article4304504.ece
14:04:48 <phenny> [bjoern]: Police shoot dead five members of 'Chinese al-Qaeda' - Times Online
14:04:52 <nslater> sbp: ^^ whats that encoding foo?
14:05:05 <clsn> I like literal faithfulness to the text... but back in the 50s or so, it was fashionable to translate poetically.
14:05:10 <nslater> in the source it's "’"
14:05:30 <sbp> nslater: yeah, bjoern's already moaned at me
14:05:35 <clsn> And it was really neat, when you read it, that so often, for all that it rhymed and scanned perfectly... It *still* managed to convey something very very close to the original.
14:05:37 <nslater> oh, k
14:05:50 <nslater> .gc 08217 in hex
14:05:51 <phenny> 08217 in hex: 742
14:05:58 <nslater> .u 0742
14:05:58 <phenny> U+0742 SYRIAC RUKKAKHA (◌݂)
14:05:59 <Monty> "you"
14:06:02 <nslater> hmm
14:06:05 <[bjoern]> .title http://www.midway.edu/degreeprograms/homelandsecurity.html
14:06:06 <phenny> [bjoern]: Midway College - Degree Programs
14:06:12 <nslater> .gc o8217 in hex
14:06:13 <phenny> o8217 in hex: 0
14:06:19 <sbp> it's thinking you're using octal
14:06:24 <sbp> .c 8217 in hex
14:06:25 <phenny> 8 217 = 0x2019
14:06:25 <nslater> im trying to use octal
14:06:28 <[bjoern]> .title http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080710/en_nm/lovett_dc
14:06:29 <sbp> why?
14:06:29 <phenny> [bjoern]: Lyle Lovett sells millions, earns nothing - Yahoo! News
14:06:33 <[bjoern]> damn pirates.
14:06:34 <sbp> .u 2019
14:06:35 <phenny> U+2019 RIGHT SINGLE QUOTATION MARK (’)
14:06:43 <nslater> because ’ looks like octal
14:06:52 <sbp> it's decimal
14:06:58 <nslater> oh
14:07:05 <sbp> &#o8217; would be octal
14:07:32 <sbp> b for binary, o for octal, x for hexadecimal
14:07:35 <nslater> yh
14:07:38 <sbp> decimal tends to be unadorned
14:07:44 <nslater> in what system?
14:07:47 <nslater> unicode?
14:07:50 <clsn> In html
14:07:55 <sbp> various places
14:08:01 <nslater> yeah, google use it too
14:08:18 <nslater> .gc b010101 in dec
14:08:18 <phenny> b010101 in dec: 100
14:08:36 <clsn> that can't be right./
14:08:39 <nslater> yh
14:08:42 <clsn> Because you did .gc
14:08:47 <nslater> oh, haha
14:08:47 <clsn> .c b010101 in dec
14:08:47 <phenny> clsn: Sorry, no result.
14:08:59 <nslater> well, whateverz!
14:09:01 <sbp> [[[
14:09:02 <sbp> A translation must:
14:09:02 <sbp> give the words of the original
14:09:02 <sbp> read like a translation
14:09:02 <sbp> be in the style of the translator
14:09:04 <sbp> read as a contemporary of the original
14:09:06 <sbp> never add to or omit from the original
14:09:08 <sbp> translate verse into prose
14:09:10 <sbp>
14:09:12 <sbp> A translation must:
14:09:14 <sbp> give the ideas of the original
14:09:16 <sbp> read like an original work
14:09:18 <sbp> reflect the style of the original
14:09:22 <sbp> read as a contemporary of the translator
14:09:24 <sbp> sometimes add to or omit from the original
14:09:26 <sbp> translate verse into verse
14:09:28 <sbp> ]]] - Theodore Savory (in The Art of Translation, Cape 1957; new and enlarged edition 1968)
14:09:30 <sbp> via http://www.cichw.net/comm1.htm
14:09:45 <nslater> sbp: i dont get it, two conflicting bits of advice
14:09:50 <clsn> I hope those are multiple choice.
14:10:05 <sbp> no
14:11:35 <sbp> Valéry's comment is insanely cool too
14:11:36 <sbp> from the same page
14:14:22 <jessica> "Here Dwight, you take this penny and do what you want with it." "Thanks, Dad! I'm going to take this and buy five shares of Amazon.com." "Wow, a risk taker! That's my boy!"
14:14:54 <sbp> should've invested it in Alliance and Leicester shares
14:15:04 <sbp> they shot up 50% today due to Santander takeover rumours
14:15:26 <sbp> Dwight would have a penny and a half now
14:17:55 <sbp> wow, a Labour bencher just said something sensible
14:18:02 <sbp> Madeleine Moon MP
14:18:09 <clsn> Write down the time and date.
14:18:15 <sbp> yeah, I'm shocked
14:18:19 <sbp> it's a live feed
14:18:39 <Arnia> sbp: what was it?
14:19:13 <nslater> sbp, "Labour" implies that the other partys are any better... :)
14:19:24 <nsh-> wait
14:19:32 <nsh-> there are political *factions*?!?!
14:19:41 <sbp> she basically suggested that the media frenzy surrounding knife crime had homogenised the picture, and that one-fit-for-all solutions deployed across the country might not please her constituents, a low knife-crime area; she asked the Home Secretary what she ought to say to them
14:19:52 <nsh-> how the hell do they coordinate so gracefully to fuck things up>
14:19:52 <Monty> potty mouth!
14:19:52 <nsh-> ?
14:20:29 <sbp> we can look at the Hansard later for the exact phrasing
14:21:20 <nsh-> i wonder
14:21:20 <sbp> I'm always impressed that they manage to remember who is Hon. and who is Rt. Hon.
14:21:31 <sbp> (actually often they correct themselves)
14:21:33 <nslater> Rt. Hon is the cabinate or shaddow cabinate
14:21:33 <nsh-> if you can get copies of the hansard printed on loorag
14:21:39 <sbp> nsh-: heh!
14:21:40 <nslater> iirc
14:21:56 <nslater> so, pretty easy to remember really
14:21:57 <sbp> nslater: or PCs etc.
14:22:00 * nsh- will suggests this to her majesty's privy counsel at next convenience
14:22:02 *** Schroeder (i=1000@unaffiliated/unclejimbob) has joined #swhack
14:22:04 <nslater> PC?
14:22:09 <nsh-> penis chalice
14:22:13 <nslater> win
14:22:20 *** crschmidt has parted #swhack ()
14:22:21 <nsh-> it's a medieval device worn by members of parliament in secret
14:22:41 <sbp> Privy Council
14:22:56 <nslater> hmm..
14:24:07 <nslater> interesting...
14:24:47 <nslater> I was not aware of this subtlety, what other overlap is there between the PC and the house of lords except the cabinet
14:25:29 <sbp> I don't know in detail. I refer you to Arnia and Wikipedia
14:25:45 <nslater> iz on wikipedia alreadyz
14:26:15 <sbp> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privy_Council_of_the_United_Kingdom#Composition
14:28:03 <nslater> oh man, browsing http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cabinet_of_the_United_Kingdom and I saw http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ed_Balls
14:28:09 <nslater> that's a pretty funny name, sorry Ed
14:29:45 *** zachb (n=zachb@c-71-192-250-122.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #swhack
14:29:56 <sbp> you've never heard of Ed Balls before?
14:30:00 <sbp> he's in the news all the time
14:30:01 <nslater> nope
14:30:09 <nslater> I don't watch the news, or read the papers
14:30:12 <zachb> OOH! We're a cracking channel now?
14:30:26 <sbp> probably a good idea
14:30:37 <nslater> most of the actual important news gets crap filtered through people I know
14:30:44 * sbp chuckles as half the labour members have their feet over the sword line
14:31:11 <sbp> looks like all the Conservatives and all but one of the Lib Dems are sitting properly
14:32:04 <clsn> sbp: huh?
14:32:23 <clsn> I assume this is some silly British ettiquette thingy?
14:32:29 <nslater> clsn: you're not meant to go over the sword line
14:32:34 <nslater> [[[
14:32:35 <nslater> The House of Commons, historically and currently in its modern form, has two sets of lines separating the front row benches. These lines are better than a "sword's length" apart from each other, to keep over excited members from appealing to their swords to settle debate. It was quite common through much of the House's history, dating back to the 14th Century, to have its members armed with swords.
14:32:41 <nslater> ]]]
14:32:58 <sbp> I was told by the usher there that they're two sword lengths apart
14:33:18 <sbp> MPs still have the right to carry a sword in the house, as far as I'm aware
14:33:28 <clsn> My father told me that's why the conference table in the law firm's conference room was so heavy and wide. So during negotiations people didn't attack each other.
14:33:34 <nslater> I would have a lot of respect for an MP if he carried a sword
14:33:35 <sbp> heh
14:33:39 <sbp> likewise
14:33:49 <sbp> probably not such a bad idea given the recent security incursions too
14:37:51 <nsh-> you mean awesome idea? amirite?
14:38:03 <sbp> [[[
14:38:04 <sbp> Women currently make up just 20% of the House of Commons today, a figure virtually unchanged in a generation. In the current league table of women’s representation around the world, Britain is joint 58th alongside Cambodia.
14:38:09 <sbp> ]]] - http://www.madeleinemoonmp.com/?PageId=c46f42d1-f51b-c664-4985-22dbf717c9a3
14:38:21 <sbp> GO TEAM ENGLAND!
14:38:38 <clsn> At least you guys have had a female head of state sometime in your history.
14:38:41 <clsn> We haven't even managed that yet
14:39:26 <sbp> well, we try not to mention it
14:39:29 <sbp> it was a disaster
14:40:09 * nsh- eats Paprika-flavoured Tuc biscuits
14:40:12 <nsh-> crackers, even
14:40:15 <nsh-> tastytasty
14:49:22 <nslater> thatcher wasnt so bad
14:51:15 <nsh-> how much do you remember?
14:51:42 <nslater> well, I was still in primary school, but from what I've read...
14:52:50 * Schroeder doesn't understand why a female head of state is assumed to be a good thing in and of itself
14:53:05 <Schroeder> Thatcher was the best Prime Minister of the last 200 years
14:53:13 <nslater> because it promotes diversity and provides a much neede female role model for young girls
14:53:14 <Monty> We haven't got a figure virtually unchanged in its probbly going through much neede female head of pronunciation and Leicester shares of perfection to keep an eye on speaking terms with dots on my own wedding to the source it's easy to Swhack. this and thus simpler, but I'd invest the media frenzy surrounding knife crime had been lucky on my head.
14:53:31 <nsh-> verbose, Monty
14:53:35 <nslater> very
14:53:35 <Monty> hairbrushes's vile raccoons clears up XFM's scratched golf...
14:53:58 <nsh-> Schroeder, of course you think Thatcher was excellent...
14:55:01 <jessica> Everyone wants a head of state they can't masturbate to.
14:56:02 * nsh- suspects the set of people who'd masturbate to Thatcher (or Hilldog) is vanishingly small
14:56:32 <nsh-> though I suspect there are a few that fantasise over Ms. Rand
14:56:32 * nslater rescinds previously non-negative comments about thatcher
14:57:27 <jessica> Ayn Rand freaks are the worst. "I want pain." All right, let's tie you up in a laundry sack fulla wild rats and see how you feel about pain.
14:58:05 <jessica> On the subject of Hillary and sex, I quoth Tina Fey: "You know, what is it, America? What is it? Are you weirded out that they're married? Because I can promise you they're having exactly as much sex with each other as George Bush and Jeb Bush are."
14:59:34 * nsh- likes the following signature attribution: "All for ourselves, and nothing for other people, seems, in every age of the world, to have been the vile maxim of the masters of mankind."-Adam Smith, warning about Ayn Rand
15:00:20 <jessica> also good to bring up when a Libertarian starts arguing with you on whether taxes / the highway system should exist.
15:00:24 <Schroeder> Adam Smith was wrong, then, wasn't he?
15:01:01 <Schroeder> jessica: neither should exist
15:01:01 <Schroeder> they're both pure evil
15:01:18 <nsh-> roads are evil, Kurt?
15:01:24 <jessica> Libertarian trolling long since worked its way through on me.
15:01:37 <jessica> I eventually realised that I had to go to bed whether someone was Wrong on the Internets or not.
15:01:53 <nsh-> does this extend to language? i mean, people use it primarily to communicate their wants and desires so others can *perish the thought* assist them
15:01:59 <Schroeder> nsh-: if they're paid for through slavery and theft, yes
15:02:18 <nsh-> then:
15:02:22 <nsh-> .gs throw away your *
15:02:22 <phenny> throw away your *: television (11), telescreen (7), oars (5), weekend (4), trash (4), telivision (3), televisiond (3), preconceptions (3), gun (3), empties (3)
15:02:26 <Schroeder> jessica: I defy you to find a single logical flaw or false premise in the writings of the eminent 20th-century Russian-American philosopher Ayn Rand
15:02:28 <clsn> Highways should exist, but we've been doing them wrong. They should be set up *sideways*. So they won't take up as much room.
15:02:36 <nsh-> clsn++
15:02:37 <Schroeder> nsh-: there's nothing wrong with assisting another, so long as it is done for one's own selfish benefit
15:02:53 <clsn> (wow... OK, that has to be a troll. NOBODY is right in EVERYTHING she says)
15:03:34 <nsh-> Kurt is an outspoken defender of Ms. Rand's infallibility; so much so that he has outspoken himself from many channels on this network :-)
15:03:47 <jessica> Schroeder, as appealing as it is to go through the writings of a misguided political philosopher who's into masochism, I happen to be busy with a far more important task, which is fixing my nail varnish.
15:04:56 <procto> mogz paulitiks
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15:12:05 <nsh-> .wik Diatropism
15:12:10 <phenny> "D in p aeq - D Litt - D Lit - D Mus - D ration - D Surg - D ès L - D ès S - D'Albert - D'Alembert Mountains - D'Amboise - D'Arblay - D'Arrest - D'Arsonval galvanometer - D'Avenant - D'Inzeo - D's - D'Urfey - D-state - D/F - D/L - D/P - D/W - Dab hand - Dabbler - [...]" - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:The_Anome/Moby_nouns/D
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15:12:29 <nsh-> silly mirc
15:12:36 <nsh-> .dict diatropism
15:12:37 <phenny> diatropism - 1. plant growth at right angles
15:13:04 <nsh-> .dict twayblade
15:13:04 <phenny> twayblade - 1. two-leaved orchid
15:13:10 <nsh-> .dict liparism
15:13:10 <phenny> nsh-: Sorry, no definition found.
15:13:13 <clsn> Cool.
15:13:16 <nsh-> .dict liparis
15:13:16 <phenny> nsh-: Sorry, no definition found.
15:13:18 <nsh-> hm
15:13:21 <nsh-> .wik Liparis
15:13:22 <phenny> "Liparis is a genus of orchids, commonly known as flase twayblade." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liparis
15:13:38 <nsh-> .dict Dichasium
15:13:39 <phenny> Dichasium - 1. type of flower head
15:16:00 <nsh-> how's this for a sentence:
15:16:24 <nsh-> [[[ No dichasium of songstress and songster specialized in rondeaux redoublés of the hymeneal would rue it -- even if transcribed into runic figurations or DEVA-NAGA-ri. Husserl's mereology -- his DEFINITION of part-to-whole relations, as explicated in the essential law of foundation, whereby speech acts, as reductive phenomenological description, express the propositional moment-of-quality as the meaning meaning means in the confluence of founded upon foun
15:16:24 <nsh-> through free imaginative association, conforming to the laws of Aristotle's virile 1T2 syllogistic (this free variation not being equivalent to C. G. Jung's directed imagination, while this free is equivalent to the free of Silvio Gesell's free money)
15:16:24 <nsh-> -- PRESCRIBES as given an existential dependency explicitly in denial of the identity transparency at issue in sexual congress and the speech act expressing Cantor's most important moment-of-quality: definition of part-to-whole relations in a denumerable transfinite set demonstrated by the infamous Satanic diagonal proof. ]]]
15:16:49 <nsh-> ( "...whereby speech acts, as reductive phenomenological description, express the propositional moment-of-quality as the meaning meaning means in the confluence of founded upon founding, ..." )
15:18:42 <nsh-> .wik Turner's syndrome
15:18:43 <phenny> "Turner syndrome or Ullrich-Turner syndrome encompasses several conditions, of which monosomy X is the most common." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turner's_syndrome
15:19:04 <nsh-> XXY
15:19:33 <nsh-> oh, just X
15:19:45 <nsh-> XXY is Klintfelter's
15:19:50 <nsh-> *Kilne*
15:32:04 <sbp> Schroeder: hi, welcome to Swhack. who the heck are you?
15:32:14 <sbp> and how did you get here, etc.?
15:32:23 <sbp> this is a publically logged channel
15:33:34 <nslater> sbp: prolly came for the leet sploits
15:34:06 <Schroeder> I'm a student and semiprofessional trombone player and teacher; formerly an automotive assembly line worker
15:34:10 <Schroeder> jsled told me about it on GIMPnet
15:34:12 <Schroeder> and I know
15:34:20 <clsn> (spleet loits? Sounds even better.)
15:34:50 <nslater> speet loits, surely?
15:34:53 <nslater> .gc speet loits
15:34:56 <phenny> speet loits: 15,400
15:34:58 <nslater> .gc "speet loits"
15:34:58 <phenny> "speet loits": 0
15:34:59 <sbp> jsled: why did you invite Schroeder here?
15:35:11 <clsn> No, spleet...
15:35:14 <clsn> Like spleen. Almost as funny.
15:35:14 <nslater> k
15:35:17 <nslater> yeah
15:35:25 <nslater> .gc "spleen sploits"
15:35:26 <phenny> "spleen sploits": 0
15:35:42 * nslater sploits clsn's spleen
15:36:17 * nsh- head home
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15:38:27 <sbp> Schroeder: this is a semi-private channel, and I'm not really sure we need new members
15:38:35 <sbp> so don't be too disappointed if I ban you at some point
15:38:42 * nslater smiles
15:45:36 <Tene> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess_boxing
15:45:52 <clsn> I've heard of that haven't I?
15:46:00 <Tene> Probably.
15:46:53 <sbp> yeah, someone pasted it here the other day
15:47:04 <sbp> must be doing the rounds. LOLPUN
15:47:12 <clsn> I am remembering something from a while ago. Whatever.
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16:01:38 <nslater> .title http://www.boingboing.net/2008/07/13/report-oyster-card-c.html
16:01:39 <phenny> nslater: Report: Oyster card crypto leak - Boing Boing
16:01:46 <nslater> "Chip company NXP Semiconductors is to sue Radboud University in an attempt to halt the publication of a paper detailing the cryptographic cracking of the Oyster smartcard, used widely on the London transport network."
16:03:00 <sbp> heh
16:04:10 * sbp skims http://www.2think.org/02_2_she.shtml
16:04:11 <sbp> .title
16:04:12 <phenny> sbp: The Unlikeliest Cult in History
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16:05:24 <nslater> .title http://blog.michaeltrier.com/2008/7/13/full-text-search-on-sqlite
16:05:24 <phenny> nslater: Empty Thoughts: Full-Text Search on SQLite
16:05:37 <nslater> I am very excited by this XD
16:05:39 *** nsh (n=nsh@87-94-146-186.tampere.customers.dnainternet.fi) has joined #swhack
16:05:40 <Monty> hi nsh
16:06:09 <nsh> sbp, you know who else liked to semi-privatise things?
16:06:14 <clsn> sbp: what, Cargo Cult??
16:07:56 <nslater> .wik Ayn Rand
16:07:57 <phenny> "Ayn Rand (IPA: /ˈaɪn ˈrænd/, February 2 [O.S. January 20] 1905 – March 6, 1982), born Alisa Zinov'yevna Rosenbaum (Russian: Алиса Зиновьевна Розенбаум), was a Russian-born American novelist, philosopher,[1]| playwright and screenwriter." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayn_Rand
16:11:03 <sbp> nsh: nowhoplz?
16:11:13 <sbp> clsn: no...
16:11:24 <sbp> Cargo Cults seem quite likely, realy
16:12:56 <clsn> Ah. Randianism. By Schermer no less.
16:13:51 <sbp> yeah, I saw his TED talk lately
16:16:02 <nslater> does anyone know of any free software that could be used to find similar documents in a collection of documents? so, for example, all similar documents to a specific chosen one
16:16:41 <sbp> odd statement of moral relativism at the end of this essay
16:17:52 <clsn> I took courses on such software, nslater. Basically how to write a search engine.
16:18:24 <nslater> is it really the same as search though?
16:18:29 <sbp> nslater: does Beagle not have a thing for that?
16:19:03 <nslater> not sure, I would be looking for something with a python interface
16:19:10 * nslater looks at beagle quickly
16:20:37 <clsn> In a way, it is. A search basically looks for documents similar to your query. Giving a search engine a huge paragraph to work on instead of a short sentence would be a great thing, from tyhe searcher's POV
16:22:10 <nslater> is it possible to construct a system so that the weightings between documents is non-directed, so that every document that is similar to document A also lists document A as being similar to it?
16:22:30 <sbp> of course
16:22:41 <nslater> where being "listed" is actually a similarity threashold
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16:23:06 <sbp> what do you think a "set" is?
16:23:33 <clsn> Hmm... how do you measure similarity? Often it's by taking the docs to be a "bag of words" and the words representing a vector in word-space and see how far away the vectors are...
16:23:37 <nslater> because I'm imagining a situation where some document is similar to some larger more detailed document, but the larger more detailed document is far more similar to other more indepth documents that it wouldnt have the backlink
16:24:15 <sbp> oh, so you're asking for the opposite of what you just said
16:24:31 <nslater> I don't know, I'm having trouble expressing what I want, sec
16:26:25 <nslater> okay, so let's imagine we're building a website and we want each page to have a "similar pages" section, would it be posible to construct a system so that every page listed in a particular "similar pages" section also listed the original page in it's "similar pages" section - along with the requirement that the similar pages section should never be more than n entries long
16:26:47 <sbp> ugh, they just called Mosley the "boss of Formula 1" on BBC News
16:27:06 <sbp> Bernie Ecclestone is the boss of F1; Mosley of motorsport...
16:27:07 <Monty> it on this penny and slender vowels better.
16:28:06 <sbp> ("Formula 1 boss" was the actual quote)
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16:29:00 <nslater> clsn: do you know of any free software that could be used to provide a "similarness" weight between documents?
16:29:29 * nslater is poking around xapian.org
16:29:31 <sbp> nslater: email Pat Hall and ask
16:30:01 <nslater> is that a troll? :(
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16:30:26 <clsn> nslater: Not that I remember. :(
16:31:32 <procto> nslater: well, it depends on what similarity algorithms you use
16:31:37 <procto> nslater: most common ones are "1 way"
16:31:42 <sbp> is what a troll?
16:31:45 <procto> sorry, I meant 2 way
16:32:20 <procto> nslater: meaning, bi-directional. document A is as similar to B as B is to A, thus they would necessarily list each other in their Similar Pages sections
16:32:30 <procto> nslater: the most common similarity algorithm is some variation of edit distance
16:33:00 <cls
