00:08:53 <[[sroracle]]> YAML is excellent
00:09:08 <[[sroracle]]> However JSON is more widely supported
00:20:12 <[bjoern]> JSON is not closed under concatenation.
00:20:39 <[bjoern]> XML is, if you allow for external parsed entities which don't require a single root element, and so is YAML.
00:37:32 <kpreid> how is the support for EPEs among readily available xml libs?
00:38:49 <[bjoern]> <!DOCTYPE root [ <!ENTITY foo ...> ]> <root>&foo;</root> is well supported, as one option.
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01:01:34 <nslater> [bjoern]: what do you mean by closed under concatenation?
01:04:01 <kpreid> the concatenation of two JSON documents is not a JSON document
01:04:35 <nslater> neither is two XML documents
01:04:37 <kpreid> it's particularly bad in that (iirc) some interpretations of JSON have that the 'array' value type is not allowed as the root value
01:04:42 <kpreid> right, thus EPEs
01:04:52 <nslater> right
01:05:08 <nslater> but you could say the same for json?
01:05:20 <kpreid> I suppose
01:05:34 <nslater> it's just that json doesn't explicitly mention anything like json fragments
01:05:39 * kpreid retreats behind [bjoern]
01:06:14 <nslater> really though, as long as you use trailing commas, you could count any valid JSON type as a fragment
01:06:24 <nslater> i dont see what advantage any of this is though
01:06:33 <nslater> perhaps ive never seen as use case that needs to concatinate documents
01:07:28 <nslater> the JSON spec is mental anyway
01:07:42 <nslater> it specifies that JSON must be "encoded" in Unicode
01:08:13 <nslater> and then in a foot note mentions that only UTF-8 or UTF-16 are valid
01:08:37 <nslater> and JSON encoded in Latin1 is garbage, per the spec... i think
01:08:49 <nslater> im not sure - we ran into this with couchdb, and i think ive blocked out the memory
01:09:02 <nslater> we took it to douglas crockford, and he basically went "meh."
01:09:22 <nslater> and I think that somewhere I publicly wrote that the RFC editor must have been high
01:09:31 <nslater> open saurce, fun and games!
01:10:19 <nslater> this is the bug that kicked it all off
01:10:20 <nslater> .title https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/COUCHDB-345
01:10:22 <phenny> nslater: [#COUCHDB-345] "High ASCII" can be inserted into db but not retrieved - ASF JIRA
01:10:29 <nslater> my first comment being
01:10:30 <nslater> "It is unpossible to have Unicode strings. That breaks science."
01:11:46 <nslater> the second one starting "The JSON RFC is either wrong or carelessly worded." being my serious response
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01:40:42 <nsh> HALP MY CONVERG IS SLOW
01:46:12 <nslater> what be up nsh?
01:46:37 <nsh> still coding genetic algorithm to render a picture from polygons
01:47:52 <nslater> oh, someone did that for you already
01:48:03 <nslater> i saw it on kottke
01:48:04 <nsh> not in python
01:48:14 <nslater> you know what im on about then?
01:48:19 <nsh> of course
01:48:32 <nsh> .g rogel alsing genetic mona lisa
01:48:32 <phenny> nsh: http://rogeralsing.com/2008/12/07/genetic-programming-evolution-of-mona-lisa/
01:48:39 <nslater> ayeup
01:48:45 <nslater> dont of course me, anyway
01:48:46 <nslater> boya
01:48:56 * nsh smiles
01:48:57 <nslater> i am busy doing ajax
01:48:58 <nsh> what you up to?
01:49:13 <nsh> for to what end?
01:49:20 <nslater> what's the content of your pastebuffer?
01:49:25 <nslater> mine is… potluck time
01:49:26 <nslater> retailer_data["recent_datetime"]
01:49:26 <nsh> They specifically designed the film so that the oiled-up teenagers would be safe from all straight adult men.
01:49:37 <nslater> awesome
01:49:45 <nslater> im working on a web analytics app
01:49:48 <nsh> (referring to the new Twilight film)
01:49:56 <nsh> what's web analytics anyway?
01:50:03 <nsh> who comes to your site and what they click on?
01:50:24 <nslater> no one yet, it's not live
01:50:31 <nslater> did you see the drunk review of twilight?
01:50:48 <nsh> nuppers
01:50:58 <nsh> .g drunk review twilight
01:50:59 <nslater> you will like it
01:50:59 <phenny> nsh: http://www.commonsensemedia.org/movie-reviews/twilight
01:51:06 <nslater> no
01:52:03 <nslater> nsh: http://margaritamovies.tumblr.com/post/252869342/twilight-2-twi-harder
01:53:22 <nsh> i like it already
01:53:53 <nsh> jesus is that a real poster for the film?
01:53:57 <nslater> yeah
01:53:59 <nslater> you seen it?
01:56:05 <nsh> nah man
01:57:25 <nsh> "Vampire Guy wants to die even though Miserable Girl really isnt even all that hot, and apparently the only way for vampires to die in this thing is to be executed by the Council Of Wanky Long Haired Vampires for exposing yourself to humans."
01:57:26 <nsh> lol
01:59:26 <[bjoern]> .u ᔻ
01:59:27 <phenny> U+153B CANADIAN SYLLABICS YWAA (ᔻ)
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02:06:44 <[bjoern]> .wik Glyph
02:06:44 <phenny> "A glyph (pronounced /ˈɡlɪf/) is an element of writing." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glyph
02:06:51 <[bjoern]> thx, very helpful
02:08:15 <[bjoern]> xml external parsed entities are closed under concat, if you omit the xml declaration in the second instance
02:09:07 <[bjoern]> JSON would have a hard time defining fragments, considering the leading/trailing "," problem
02:09:38 <[bjoern]> nslater, a simple use case is a logfile
02:10:12 <[bjoern]> Just appending the new text vs modifying the logfile so the new stuff fits in
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02:38:06 <kpreid> Wait, there's a JSON RFC?
02:38:10 <kpreid> Sheehs.
02:40:06 <[bjoern]> Had to, to get a mime type registered.
02:41:26 <kpreid> point
02:41:55 <kpreid> someone should arrange a mime type subnamespace which embeds URLs
02:42:27 <[bjoern]> You are late, timbl already proposed mime types should really be urls.
02:42:42 <[bjoern]> Community ignored him, as far as I can tell.
02:42:44 <kpreid> having a standards-org managed namespace doesn't do all that much good other than having nice short memorable identifiers
02:42:47 <kpreid> well, yeah, but that's an if-only. I'm saying we should have a workaround :)
02:43:05 <[bjoern]> Except it added to the "X should really be URLs" permajoke.
02:44:05 <[bjoern]> nothing stopping you from registering a mime/type;url="your url here" metatype.
02:45:27 <kpreid> except time to write it up and shove it through a standards process
02:46:13 <kpreid> hm do mime type parameters have quoting syntax like that? I was figuring it'd have to pull tricks
02:53:38 <[bjoern]> they do have quoting
02:53:45 <[bjoern]> usually incl. \" escaping
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03:57:37 <Monty> Thank goodness, jetscreamer is back!
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04:18:55 <Monty> it's jeffarch_!
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10:00:44 <Monty> bah, it's jetscreamer again
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14:22:27 <Monty> Thank goodness, clsn is back!
14:22:28 <Monty> welcome, Jibbler
14:22:30 <Monty> Speak of the devil, it's scottrageous!
14:22:31 <Monty> it's nsh!
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15:06:36 <Monty> Speak of the devil, it's eel!
16:00:47 <[bjoern]> "Don't worry, metagaming is all that matters"
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18:04:04 <Monty> hi [[sroracle]]
18:04:29 <[[sroracle]]> Howdy Monty
18:04:29 <Monty> Does talking about this bother you ?
18:04:38 <[[sroracle]]> No Monty, not at all
18:04:41 <Monty> they no one the RFC is ram available xml libs?
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22:37:53 <Monty> welcome, jetscreamer
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